Circle to Land @ KRBG

Instrument approaches are published for Class B,C,D and E
airspace. An instrument approach requires controlled
airspace and traffic separation. Class G is uncontrolled
and although there may be a Class G airport, the instrument
approach is conducted in the Class E over laid above the
Class G.


--
James H. Macklin
ATP,CFI,A&P

--
The people think the Constitution protects their rights;
But government sees it as an obstacle to be overcome.
some support
http://www.usdoj.gov/olc/secondamendment2.htm
See http://www.fija.org/ more about your rights and duties.


"Steven P. McNicoll" wrote in
message
ink.net...
|
| "Jim Macklin" wrote
in message
| news:q4j%f.3072$8q.974@dukeread08...
|
| There are no instrument approaches in Class G
|
|
| There are many instrument approaches in Class G airspace.
|
|

"Jim Macklin" wrote in message
news:G%j%f.3074$8q.2429@dukeread08...

Instrument approaches are published for Class B,C,D and E
airspace. An instrument approach requires controlled
airspace and traffic separation. Class G is uncontrolled
and although there may be a Class G airport, the instrument
approach is conducted in the Class E over laid above the
Class G.


Many of them are also conducted in Class G airspace. Do you hold an
instrument rating?

Yes, and I will stand by the statement, there are no IAP in
Class G, by definition of the airspace. There are IAP that
penetrate Class G at 1200 or 700 ft AGL.


--
James H. Macklin
ATP,CFI,A&P

"Steven P. McNicoll" wrote in
message
ink.net...
|
| "Jim Macklin" wrote
in message
| news:G%j%f.3074$8q.2429@dukeread08...
|
| Instrument approaches are published for Class B,C,D and
E
| airspace. An instrument approach requires controlled
| airspace and traffic separation. Class G is
uncontrolled
| and although there may be a Class G airport, the
instrument
| approach is conducted in the Class E over laid above the
| Class G.
|
|
| Many of them are also conducted in Class G airspace. Do
you hold an
| instrument rating?
|
|

"Jim Macklin" wrote in message
news:BNv%f.3146$8q.678@dukeread08...

Yes, and I will stand by the statement, there are no IAP in
Class G, by definition of the airspace. There are IAP that
penetrate Class G at 1200 or 700 ft AGL.


There is nothing in the definition of Class G airspace that prevents having
IAPs in it. You cannot stand by your previous statement, "There are no
instrument approaches in Class G" airspace, and now acknowledge that there
are instrument approaches in Class G airspace.

Your knowledge level is far below what would be expected from someone with
the experience and ratings you claim to have. I think you're a fibber.

The FAA will establish controlled airspace as part of the
authorization of an IAP. The FAA must have control of
airspace in order to issue a clearance, Class G does not
meet that requirement.

We seem to have a problem, my experience is just what I've
said...
8,000 hours;FAR 141 former chief flight instructor, FAR 135
Director of Operations, single-pilot IFR in all models King
Air 90 ,200 and 300 and other ASEL/AMEL Beech aircraft.
Gold Seal CFI ASMEI. No violations.

What do you have? What do you think I'm fibbing about?


--
James H. Macklin
ATP,CFI,A&P

--
The people think the Constitution protects their rights;
But government sees it as an obstacle to be overcome.
some support
http://www.usdoj.gov/olc/secondamendment2.htm
See http://www.fija.org/ more about your rights and duties.


"Steven P. McNicoll" wrote in
message
ink.net...
|
| "Jim Macklin" wrote
in message
| news:BNv%f.3146$8q.678@dukeread08...
|
| Yes, and I will stand by the statement, there are no IAP
in
| Class G, by definition of the airspace. There are IAP
that
| penetrate Class G at 1200 or 700 ft AGL.
|
|
| There is nothing in the definition of Class G airspace
that prevents having
| IAPs in it. You cannot stand by your previous statement,
"There are no
| instrument approaches in Class G" airspace, and now
acknowledge that there
| are instrument approaches in Class G airspace.
|
| Your knowledge level is far below what would be expected
from someone with
| the experience and ratings you claim to have. I think
you're a fibber.
|
|

"Jim Macklin" wrote in message
news:1nx%f.3161$8q.2075@dukeread08...

The FAA will establish controlled airspace as part of the
authorization of an IAP. The FAA must have control of
airspace in order to issue a clearance, Class G does not
meet that requirement.


How do you explain all those IAPs in Class G airspace?



We seem to have a problem, my experience is just what I've
said...
8,000 hours;FAR 141 former chief flight instructor, FAR 135
Director of Operations, single-pilot IFR in all models King
Air 90 ,200 and 300 and other ASEL/AMEL Beech aircraft.
Gold Seal CFI ASMEI. No violations.


The problem is your knowledge level is far less than what would be expected
of someone with the experience you claim. But that's not my problem.



What do you have?


Dimples on my butt.



What do you think I'm fibbing about?


I think you're fibbing about your experience.

There are no IAP IN Class G, there are many IAP in Class E
that have the airport in Class G. The initial approach,
final approach and missed approach are all in Class E.


Any one who wants can look at my certificates on the FAA web
site, that is my name and I live in Kansas.

As for ATC and instrument approaches, when you depart from
an airport in Class G airspace, with an IFR clearance, you
will be issued a clearance that says, enter controlled
airspace on heading such and such. If you depart VFR you
will be told to maintain VFR until they can coordinate your
entering controlled airspace with IFR separation from other
IFR traffic.

Since you seem to be just a troll with dimples on your butt,
I'll not further explain.


--
James H. Macklin
ATP,CFI,A&P

--
The people think the Constitution protects their rights;
But government sees it as an obstacle to be overcome.
some support
http://www.usdoj.gov/olc/secondamendment2.htm
See http://www.fija.org/ more about your rights and duties.


"Steven P. McNicoll" wrote in
message
k.net...
|
| "Jim Macklin" wrote
in message
| news:1nx%f.3161$8q.2075@dukeread08...
|
| The FAA will establish controlled airspace as part of
the
| authorization of an IAP. The FAA must have control of
| airspace in order to issue a clearance, Class G does not
| meet that requirement.
|
|
| How do you explain all those IAPs in Class G airspace?
|
|
|
| We seem to have a problem, my experience is just what
I've
| said...
| 8,000 hours;FAR 141 former chief flight instructor, FAR
135
| Director of Operations, single-pilot IFR in all models
King
| Air 90 ,200 and 300 and other ASEL/AMEL Beech aircraft.
| Gold Seal CFI ASMEI. No violations.
|
|
| The problem is your knowledge level is far less than what
would be expected
| of someone with the experience you claim. But that's not
my problem.
|
|
|
| What do you have?
|
|
| Dimples on my butt.
|
|
|
| What do you think I'm fibbing about?
|
|
| I think you're fibbing about your experience.
|
|

Jim Macklin wrote:
The FAA will establish controlled airspace as part of the
authorization of an IAP. The FAA must have control of
airspace in order to issue a clearance, Class G does not
meet that requirement.

We seem to have a problem, my experience is just what I've
said...
8,000 hours;FAR 141 former chief flight instructor, FAR 135
Director of Operations, single-pilot IFR in all models King
Air 90 ,200 and 300 and other ASEL/AMEL Beech aircraft.
Gold Seal CFI ASMEI. No violations.

What do you have? What do you think I'm fibbing about?


I've met a lot (too many, actually) pilots who have similar such
credentials and, alas, who never really mastered some of the finer
points of airspace.

EVERY IAP at a CLass E airport (excepting those with Class E surface
areas) that has a MDA or DA with a HAT (or HAA for circling) of less
than 700 feet has some portion of the final approach and missed approach
segments in Glass G airspace.

You are correct in that ATC cannot issue IFR clearances in Class G
airspace. But, when you are cleared for an approach to an airport with
an MDA or DA well below Class E airspace, you are not yet in Class G
airspace, thus the clearance is proper. It is up to you to not descend
below the floor of Class E airspace in the final approach segment, if
you choose to remain in Class E airspace. That is not a concern for ATC.

OTOH, if you are issued a departure clearance from such an airport, it
will contain the caveat "...upon entering controlled airspace.." because
you are in Class G airspace when issued the departure clearance.

yep
"Sam Spade" wrote in message
news:dyP%f.34407$bm6.1633@fed1read04...
| Jim Macklin wrote:
| The FAA will establish controlled airspace as part of
the
| authorization of an IAP. The FAA must have control of
| airspace in order to issue a clearance, Class G does not
| meet that requirement.
|
| We seem to have a problem, my experience is just what
I've
| said...
| 8,000 hours;FAR 141 former chief flight instructor, FAR
135
| Director of Operations, single-pilot IFR in all models
King
| Air 90 ,200 and 300 and other ASEL/AMEL Beech aircraft.
| Gold Seal CFI ASMEI. No violations.
|
| What do you have? What do you think I'm fibbing about?
|
|
| I've met a lot (too many, actually) pilots who have
similar such
| credentials and, alas, who never really mastered some of
the finer
| points of airspace.
|
| EVERY IAP at a CLass E airport (excepting those with Class
E surface
| areas) that has a MDA or DA with a HAT (or HAA for
circling) of less
| than 700 feet has some portion of the final approach and
missed approach
| segments in Glass G airspace.
|
| You are correct in that ATC cannot issue IFR clearances in
Class G
| airspace. But, when you are cleared for an approach to an
airport with
| an MDA or DA well below Class E airspace, you are not yet
in Class G
| airspace, thus the clearance is proper. It is up to you
to not descend
| below the floor of Class E airspace in the final approach
segment, if
| you choose to remain in Class E airspace. That is not a
concern for ATC.
|
| OTOH, if you are issued a departure clearance from such an
airport, it
| will contain the caveat "...upon entering controlled
airspace.." because
| you are in Class G airspace when issued the departure
clearance.

"Jim Macklin" wrote in message
news:G%j%f.3074$8q.2429@dukeread08...
Class G is uncontrolled
and although there may be a Class G airport, the instrument
approach is conducted in the Class E over laid above the
Class G.

How is that relevant to this discussion? The post you replied to quoted a
FAR about traffic patterns at Class G airports, regardless of the airspace
above.

--Gary