barrel roll in 172

In article ,
Andrey Serbinenko wrote:

If kept within the normal category load limits, is 172 certified to do
barrel rolls?

Certified? No.
Possible? Yes, but you will finish much lower than where you started.

"john smith" wrote

Certified? No.
Possible? Yes, but you will finish much lower than where you started.

Don't encourage that type of behavior with a yes. If he had to ask, he is
probably not a competent aerobatic pilot, and a blown barrel roll could
stall the plane, or overstress it, so it fails then, or later.

I'll bet he is not going to wear a parachute, either, which is required.

The answer to rolling a normal category plane should be no, always.

We don't want his, or someone else's blood on our hands.
--
Jim in NC

Morgans wrote
I'll bet he is not going to wear a parachute, either, which is
required.

Where does it say that?

The answer to rolling a normal category plane should be no, always.

The C-172 that I fly is a Utility Category airplane, if I want it to be.

Bob Moore
ATP CFI

Utility category allows some limited acro maneuvers, and a
list of approved maneuvers is on the placard on the side
wall of the cabin and in the POH. If you want to do rolls,
snap rolls, etc, rent or buy an airplane designed and tested
and certified as such. Can the 172 do acro, sure, with Bob
Hoover doing the flying. Can some ham handed 100 private
pilot do it with out falling out of the roll, and pulling 9
Gs in the recovery? Probably not.

Parachutes are required when you exceed certain attitudes,
the mental attitude being the most important.


§ 91.303 Aerobatic flight.
No person may operate an aircraft in aerobatic flight-

(a) Over any congested area of a city, town, or settlement;

(b) Over an open air assembly of persons;

(c) Within the lateral boundaries of the surface areas of
Class B, Class C, Class D, or Class E airspace designated
for an airport;

(d) Within 4 nautical miles of the center line of any
Federal airway;

(e) Below an altitude of 1,500 feet above the surface; or

(f) When flight visibility is less than 3 statute miles.

For the purposes of this section, aerobatic flight means an
intentional maneuver involving an abrupt change in an
aircraft's attitude, an abnormal attitude, or abnormal
acceleration, not necessary for normal flight.

[Doc. No. 18834, 54 FR 34308, Aug. 18, 1989, as amended by
Amdt. 91-227, 56 FR 65661, Dec. 17, 1991]

§ 91.307 Parachutes and parachuting.
(a) No pilot of a civil aircraft may allow a parachute that
is available for emergency use to be carried in that
aircraft unless it is an approved type and-

(1) If a chair type (canopy in back), it has been packed by
a certificated and appropriately rated parachute rigger
within the preceding 120 days; or

(2) If any other type, it has been packed by a certificated
and appropriately rated parachute rigger-

(i) Within the preceding 120 days, if its canopy, shrouds,
and harness are composed exclusively of nylon, rayon, or
other similar synthetic fiber or materials that are
substantially resistant to damage from mold, mildew, or
other fungi and other rotting agents propagated in a moist
environment; or

(ii) Within the preceding 60 days, if any part of the
parachute is composed of silk, pongee, or other natural
fiber, or materials not specified in paragraph (a)(2)(i) of
this section.

(b) Except in an emergency, no pilot in command may allow,
and no person may conduct, a parachute operation from an
aircraft within the United States except in accordance with
part 105 of this chapter.

(c) Unless each occupant of the aircraft is wearing an
approved parachute, no pilot of a civil aircraft carrying
any person (other than a crewmember) may execute any
intentional maneuver that exceeds-

(1) A bank of 60 degrees relative to the horizon; or

(2) A nose-up or nose-down attitude of 30 degrees relative
to the horizon.

(d) Paragraph (c) of this section does not apply to-

(1) Flight tests for pilot certification or rating; or

(2) Spins and other flight maneuvers required by the
regulations for any certificate or rating when given by-

(i) A certificated flight instructor; or

(ii) An airline transport pilot instructing in accordance
with §61.67 of this chapter.

(e) For the purposes of this section, approved parachute
means-

(1) A parachute manufactured under a type certificate or a
technical standard order (C-23 series); or

(2) A personnel-carrying military parachute identified by an
NAF, AAF, or AN drawing number, an AAF order number, or any
other military designation or specification number.

[Doc. No. 18334, 54 FR 34308, Aug. 18, 1989, as amended by
Amdt. 91-255, 62 FR 68137, Dec. 30, 1997; Amdt. 91-268, 66
FR 23553, May 9, 2001]


--
James H. Macklin
ATP,CFI,A&P

"Bob Moore" wrote in message
. 122...
| Morgans wrote
| I'll bet he is not going to wear a parachute, either,
which is
| required.
|
| Where does it say that?
|
| The answer to rolling a normal category plane should be
no, always.
|
| The C-172 that I fly is a Utility Category airplane, if I
want it to be.
|
| Bob Moore
| ATP CFI

In article kMMvg.78923$ZW3.78738@dukeread04,
"Jim Macklin" wrote:


Parachutes are required when you exceed certain attitudes,
the mental attitude being the most important.

Read it again. Parachutes are not required if you're solo.

Then why a C172 with 4 seats. Fools always carry a witness.



"Dale" wrote in message
...
| In article kMMvg.78923$ZW3.78738@dukeread04,
| "Jim Macklin"
wrote:
|
|
| Parachutes are required when you exceed certain
attitudes,
| the mental attitude being the most important.
|
| Read it again. Parachutes are not required if you're
solo.

Jim Macklin wrote:
Then why a C172 with 4 seats. Fools always carry a witness.


The most dangerous incidents in aviation are often proceded
by "Watch this."

Morgans schrieb:

Don't encourage that type of behavior with a yes.

Where did he write that he wants top try it? He was just wondering.

and a blown barrel roll could stall the plane,

Gee... and then fall out of the sky in pieces, I assume. I wonder what
your comment would have been if a journalist had written this.

I'll bet he is not going to wear a parachute, either, which is required.

No. As it's illegal to do barrel roll a 172, there can't be a legal
requirement to wear a chute while doing so.

Stefan

Stefan wrote:

Morgans schrieb:

Don't encourage that type of behavior with a yes.


Where did he write that he wants top try it? He was just wondering.

and a blown barrel roll could stall the plane,


Gee... and then fall out of the sky in pieces, I assume. I wonder what
your comment would have been if a journalist had written this.

I'll bet he is not going to wear a parachute, either, which is required.


No. As it's illegal to do barrel roll a 172, there can't be a legal
requirement to wear a chute while doing so.

You obviously aren't very familiar with the IRS. You are required to
report and pay taxes on money gained illegally. :-)

Matt

Don't encourage that type of behavior with a yes. If he had to ask, he is

I'm slightly disappointed by how quickly you've assumed my complete
brainlessness. Yes I know what FARs say, and what POH says, and no, I'm
not going to read this newsgroup and go break my neck the next morning.
What I was hoping to hear was an opinion of someone who's familiar with
what is involved in test-flying for normal/utility category and how much
it covers the type of stress imposed on the airframe and systems in a barrel
roll.


Andrey