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#1
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When I learned to fly a seaplane, the instructor, a very
experienced seaplane pilot recounted his personal witnessed landing of a Lake with the wheels down. He is dead now of old age, so I guess you can just take my word that it isn't a good idea or you can buy a Lake and try it for yourself. "Peter Duniho" wrote in message ... | "Jim Macklin" wrote in message | news:fc8yg.84357$ZW3.70188@dukeread04... | If you splashdown in a Lake with the wheels down, the water | will enter the nosewheel compartment and cause some very | serious problems with the next take-off. The airplane will | perform an imitation of a submarine. | | How many times have you landed a Lake in the water with the wheels down? | What data do you have to support your claim that the consequences you | mention are assured? And why in the world do you think that water in the | nosewheel compartment will "cause some very serious problems with the next | take-off"? For someone who presumes to know what will happen in a gear-down | landing in a Lake amphib, it's interesting to note that you clearly have no | idea that the nosewheel compartment of a Lake amphib is not watertight, and | that water inside it is not an issue whatsoever. | | I am amazed at your willingness to make claims regarding topics you | obviously know nothing about. | | |
#2
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"Jim Macklin" wrote in message
news:2u8yg.84360$ZW3.50960@dukeread04... When I learned to fly a seaplane, the instructor, a very experienced seaplane pilot recounted his personal witnessed landing of a Lake with the wheels down. He is dead now of old age, so I guess you can just take my word that it isn't a good idea or you can buy a Lake and try it for yourself. I am unclear as to your point. I wrote in my post that gear-down landings are hazardous. You replied in a way that implied disagreement. Now you are claiming that "it isn't a good idea", which is exactly what I've been saying all along. Do you, or do you not, agree with me that gear-down landings on the water are hazardous? As far as buying a Lake and trying it myself, I own a Lake and would never intentionally land it gear down, for the very reasons I've stated repeatedly in this thread. If you'd been paying any attention, you'd realize that. Pete |
#3
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I think you completely misread my posts and the intention.
Landing gear down is important on land and gear up on water is even more important. The Lake with the wheels down has a large scoop effect on the nose compartment. On the airplane that was seen, the water blew out the nose compartment bulkhead. A rapid dive was the result. Perhaps Lake has strengthened the bulkhead. On a floatplane with conventional floats, a level or nose low landing or rough water can [will] dig in and cause the airplane to flip and sink until the floats are at the surface and the cabin is under about 6 to 10 feet. With amphibian floats and a proper nose high landing, being flipped upside down is still a possibility and no worse than with conventional floats. It seems that even a sport pilot with just a few hours could be taught to raise and lower the gear. I think as much as safety, the FAA position on LSA is based on retractable landplanes exceeding the speed limit, something no floatplane will do. I hold an ATP but presently no medical. I could fly a LSA, it does seem that there may be more restrictions than are necessary. I think a 61.31 endorsement should handle these types of issues, just as sport pilots can get an endorsement for different airspace classification, something a student pilot can handle at 15-20 hours and night flight is allowed student pilots but not sport pilots. -- James H. Macklin ATP,CFI,A&P "Peter Duniho" wrote in message ... | "Jim Macklin" wrote in message | news:2u8yg.84360$ZW3.50960@dukeread04... | When I learned to fly a seaplane, the instructor, a very | experienced seaplane pilot recounted his personal witnessed | landing of a Lake with the wheels down. He is dead now of | old age, so I guess you can just take my word that it isn't | a good idea or you can buy a Lake and try it for yourself. | | I am unclear as to your point. I wrote in my post that gear-down landings | are hazardous. You replied in a way that implied disagreement. Now you are | claiming that "it isn't a good idea", which is exactly what I've been saying | all along. | | Do you, or do you not, agree with me that gear-down landings on the water | are hazardous? | | As far as buying a Lake and trying it myself, I own a Lake and would never | intentionally land it gear down, for the very reasons I've stated repeatedly | in this thread. If you'd been paying any attention, you'd realize that. | | Pete | | |
#4
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"Jim Macklin" wrote in message
news:yR8yg.84361$ZW3.33772@dukeread04... I think you completely misread my posts and the intention. Landing gear down is important on land and gear up on water is even more important. So you are agreeing with my point. [...] It seems that even a sport pilot with just a few hours could be taught to raise and lower the gear. You'd think a full-fledged Private certificate holder could be taught the same. And yet, landings with the gear in the wrong position continue to happen. And that's my point. The Sport Pilot rules are specifically designed to try to remove some of the more common opportunities for error that the general pilot population runs into. It seems plausible that the FAA was trying to address one of those common opportunities by restricting the type of landing gear an LSA airplane is allowed to have. I think as much as safety, the FAA position on LSA is based on retractable landplanes exceeding the speed limit, something no floatplane will do. I doubt that. The airspeed limit can be exceeded even with fixed-gear designs, and it's simple enough to flight test any design to find whether it exceeds the LSA speed limit or not. There should be no reason to add addition design restrictions for that purpose. Pete |
#5
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I think that you are agreeing with me on the basic point, I
never said that landings with the gear in the wrong position are safe. I also not that high time commercial and ATP and even CFI land gear up on runways, the USAF landed a C130 on the water runway at Patterson, LA many years ago. It was night and the crew saw the runway lights and landed. The runway they selected was water with green edge lights and white threshold lights. Brings to mind that 3,000 foot wide runway only 150 feet long. I'm just not look for an argument. -- James H. Macklin ATP,CFI,A&P -- The people think the Constitution protects their rights; But government sees it as an obstacle to be overcome. some support http://www.usdoj.gov/olc/secondamendment2.htm See http://www.fija.org/ more about your rights and duties. "Peter Duniho" wrote in message ... | "Jim Macklin" wrote in message | news:yR8yg.84361$ZW3.33772@dukeread04... | I think you completely misread my posts and the intention. | | Landing gear down is important on land and gear up on water | is even more important. | | So you are agreeing with my point. | | [...] | It seems that even a sport pilot with just a few hours could | be taught to raise and lower the gear. | | You'd think a full-fledged Private certificate holder could be taught the | same. And yet, landings with the gear in the wrong position continue to | happen. | | And that's my point. The Sport Pilot rules are specifically designed to try | to remove some of the more common opportunities for error that the general | pilot population runs into. It seems plausible that the FAA was trying to | address one of those common opportunities by restricting the type of landing | gear an LSA airplane is allowed to have. | | I think as much as | safety, the FAA position on LSA is based on retractable | landplanes exceeding the speed limit, something no | floatplane will do. | | I doubt that. The airspeed limit can be exceeded even with fixed-gear | designs, and it's simple enough to flight test any design to find whether it | exceeds the LSA speed limit or not. There should be no reason to add | addition design restrictions for that purpose. | | Pete | | |
#6
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"Jim Macklin" wrote in message
news:%Pdyg.84400$ZW3.14020@dukeread04... I think that you are agreeing with me on the basic point If it makes your ego feel better to word it that way, that's fine with me. Even though it was I who first brought up the issue of the hazard of gear-down water landings. ![]() |
#7
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Is this sweeps week?
"Peter Duniho" wrote in message ... | "Jim Macklin" wrote in message | news:%Pdyg.84400$ZW3.14020@dukeread04... | I think that you are agreeing with me on the basic point | | If it makes your ego feel better to word it that way, that's fine with me. | Even though it was I who first brought up the issue of the hazard of | gear-down water landings. ![]() | | |
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