barrel roll in 172

"Not all airplanes are capable of completing all maneuvers."

Regards,

James A. (Jim) Carter

-----Original Message-----
From: Jose ]
Posted At: Wednesday, August 02, 2006 23:37
Posted To: rec.aviation.piloting
Conversation: barrel roll in 172
Subject: barrel roll in 172

All airplanes can stall, even the stall proof airplanes.
maybe the cargo shifts, maybe something happens, maybe the
A&P mis-rigs the elevator or the stop breaks.

I like the "maybe something happens" method of stalling a plane. I
was
(of course) referring to airplanes that have not broken, and are being
flown deliberately into a maneuver. Not all airplanes are capable of
all maneuvers.

Jose
--
The monkey turns the crank and thinks he's making the music.
for Email, make the obvious change in the address.

"Not all airplanes are capable of completing all maneuvers."

If it hasn't completed a maneuver, it hasn't done it.

Jose
--
The monkey turns the crank and thinks he's making the music.
for Email, make the obvious change in the address.

I competition or air combat, I'd agree. But if an airplane
can roll to 60 degree bank it can be held in the roll and it
will become inverted and then because of the inertia
continue back to upright. If you stop inverted you will
have problems because most engines will quit after a short
while, you might have some reduced aileron control and you
probably didn't hold forward elevator so you split S'd out
and roll control was returned. You just could not do a
competition grade hesitation roll.

If a Pitts S-2 starts a snap roll and the prop breaks off
the hub, does that mean a Pitts S-2 can't do a snap roll?
And if a Cessna 172 does a barrel roll, does that mean that
all Cessna 172 PILOTS are capable of doing barrel rolls?


--
James H. Macklin
ATP,CFI,A&P

--
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But government sees it as an obstacle to be overcome.
some support
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"Jose" wrote in message
...
| "Not all airplanes are capable of completing all
maneuvers."
|
| If it hasn't completed a maneuver, it hasn't done it.
|
| Jose
| --
| The monkey turns the crank and thinks he's making the
music.
| for Email, make the obvious change in the address.

Jim Macklin wrote:

But if an airplane
can roll to 60 degree bank it can be held in the roll and it
will become inverted and then because of the inertia
continue back to upright.

Not necessarily, and certainly not because of the inertia.

If you stop inverted you will
have problems because most engines will quit after a short
while, you might have some reduced aileron control and you
probably didn't hold forward elevator so you split S'd out
and roll control was returned.

Or more likely, if done accidentally ("didn't hold forward elevator"),
the airplane broke because of overload.

You should cease to spread dangerous wisdom about things you don't
understand. (As well as cease to top post.)

Stefan
(Removed PED, because this isn't.)

I think Bill Gates like top posting, why should I change to
satisfy you?

Perhaps you don't know what you're talking about either?



--
James H. Macklin
ATP,CFI,A&P

"Stefan" wrote in message
...
| Jim Macklin wrote:
|
| But if an airplane
| can roll to 60 degree bank it can be held in the roll
and it
| will become inverted and then because of the inertia
| continue back to upright.
|
| Not necessarily, and certainly not because of the inertia.
|
| If you stop inverted you will
| have problems because most engines will quit after a
short
| while, you might have some reduced aileron control and
you
| probably didn't hold forward elevator so you split S'd
out
| and roll control was returned.
|
| Or more likely, if done accidentally ("didn't hold forward
elevator"),
| the airplane broke because of overload.
|
| You should cease to spread dangerous wisdom about things
you don't
| understand. (As well as cease to top post.)
|
| Stefan
| (Removed PED, because this isn't.)

In article l4sAg.84945$ZW3.9567@dukeread04, p51mustang[threeX12]
@xxxhotmail.calm says...
I think Bill Gates like top posting, why should I change to
satisfy you?

follow
to
hard
very
thread
the
makes
It

--
Duncan

Jim Macklin wrote:

I think Bill Gates like top posting, why should I change to
satisfy you?

A. Because it makes the thread hard to follow.
Q. Why is top posting frowned upon?

And what does Bill Gates have to do with that?

Anno v. Heimburg wrote:
Jim Macklin wrote:


I think Bill Gates like top posting, why should I change to
satisfy you?


A. Because it makes the thread hard to follow.
Q. Why is top posting frowned upon?

And what does Bill Gates have to do with that?

He's dyslexic.


Matt

On 2006-08-05, Anno v. Heimburg wrote:
Jim Macklin wrote:

I think Bill Gates like top posting, why should I change to
satisfy you?

A. Because it makes the thread hard to follow.
Q. Why is top posting frowned upon?

Also, interleaved quoting (AND trimming quotes) is called netiquette -
the manners of Usenet. Transplanted to real life, "I think Bill Gates
like top posting, why should I change to satisfy you?" could become:

"I think the airlines like straight in approaches. Why should I enter
the pattern on a 45 to downwind just to satisfy you?"

"It's too much effort to wait three seconds to hold the door open for
the person following. Why should I wait three seconds just to satisfy
them?"

"Why should I say please and thank you? Some _insert rich person here_
gets by quite OK being extremely rude, so why should I change to satisfy
you?"

"Why should I move over to the right lane? Why should I leave my
comfortable rolling roadblock position just to satisfy you?"

Additionally, top posting costs people money. Top posters usually don't
trim their quoted material which can get quite long after a while. Those
reading Usenet when they are passing time in the airport, using their
cell phone, have to pay per kilobyte.

--
Yes, the Reply-To email address is valid.
Oolite-Linux: an Elite tribute: http://oolite-linux.berlios.de

But if an airplane
can roll to 60 degree bank it can be held in the roll and it
will become inverted and then because of the inertia
continue back to upright.

By the time that happens, the nose may well be pointing down. You'd
need to push, and you might not have enough elevator authority to keep
the nose on the horizon. I don't know; I never did it in a 172. I can
certainly imagine other planes that don't have enough authority to keep
it going.

If a Pitts S-2 starts a snap roll and the prop breaks off
the hub, does that mean a Pitts S-2 can't do a snap roll?

If it comes off every time, yes.


--
The monkey turns the crank and thinks he's making the music.
for Email, make the obvious change in the address.