No more "Left Downwind"?

"BTIZ" wrote in message
news:8thKg.2054$8J2.536@fed1read11...

same thing happened at HND.. they had a tower, but no designated Class D
airspace
so it was magenta.. when the class D airspace was assigned.. it changed to
blue


That wouldn't be the same thing.

That wouldn't be the same thing.

Depends on your definition of "same". If you expect it to mean
"identical", then no, the "same thing" could not happen at any other
airport. However, if it is taken to mean "normally synched items
appeared apparantly out of synch for a short while" then "the same
thing" happened there.

It just happened in reverse, so to speak.

Jose
--
The monkey turns the crank and thinks he's making the music.
for Email, make the obvious change in the address.

"Jose" wrote in message
news

Depends on your definition of "same". If you expect it to mean
"identical", then no, the "same thing" could not happen at any other
airport. However, if it is taken to mean "normally synched items appeared
apparantly out of synch for a short while" then "the same thing" happened
there.

It just happened in reverse, so to speak.


It's not the same thing because one example had designated Class D airspace
while the other example did not have designated Class D airspace.

It's not the same thing because one example had designated Class D airspace
while the other example did not have designated Class D airspace.

One case was tower but no D going to tower with D.
The other case was D but no tower, going to tower with D.

The initial (or middle) condition was that the normally synched tower/D
combination was out of synch. That is a degree of sameness.

True, they were out of synch in the opposite direction, so it was not
"identical". But the degree of sameness is sufficient (IMHO) for the
point of the post.

So, what exactly is the charting requirement for a magenta vs a blue
airport symbol? And what is the exact relationship between class D and
a tower?

And while I'm at it... Special VFR used to be available in a surface
area. With the new alphabet, is it available above the ceiling of the
class D?

Jose
--
The monkey turns the crank and thinks he's making the music.
for Email, make the obvious change in the address.

"Jose" wrote in message
om...

One case was tower but no D going to tower with D.
The other case was D but no tower, going to tower with D.

The initial (or middle) condition was that the normally synched tower/D
combination was out of synch. That is a degree of sameness.

True, they were out of synch in the opposite direction, so it was not
"identical". But the degree of sameness is sufficient (IMHO) for the
point of the post.


In other words, not the same thing.



So, what exactly is the charting requirement for a magenta vs a blue
airport symbol? And what is the exact relationship between class D and a
tower?


A blue airport symbol indicates an airport with a control tower, a magenta
airport symbol indicates an airport without a control tower.



And while I'm at it... Special VFR used to be available in a surface area.


It still is.



With the new alphabet, is it available above the ceiling of the class D?


No. What would be the purpose of Special VFR above the ceiling of a surface
area?

In other words, not the same thing.

Well, what non-identical thing would qualify (in this context) as "the
same thing"?

A blue airport symbol indicates an airport with a control tower, a magenta
airport symbol indicates an airport without a control tower.

Got that. Does a control tower always mean class D (or better)? Does
class D always mean a control tower?

What would be the purpose of Special VFR above the ceiling of a surface
area?

The same as the purpose of SVFR in a surface area. One reason would be
to find VFR above a broken layer. It would of course require positive
control of the airspace, which is probably not available above the D.

Is the D equivalent to a "surface area"?

Jose
--
The monkey turns the crank and thinks he's making the music.
for Email, make the obvious change in the address.

Jose wrote:

Does a control tower always mean class D (or better)?

No.

Does class D always mean a control tower?

No.

Is the D equivalent to a "surface area"?

No.


Stefan

"Jose" wrote in message
et...

Well, what non-identical thing would qualify (in this context) as "the
same thing"?


You'll have to tell me. What was the point of your response to my
statement?



Got that. Does a control tower always mean class D (or better)?


No.



Does class D always mean a control tower?


No.



The same as the purpose of SVFR in a surface area.


The purpose of SVFR in a surface area is usually to get in or out of an
airport within it when it cannot be done under basic VFR. Please explain
how that can be done while remaining above the ceiling of the Class D
airspace.



One reason would be
to find VFR above a broken layer. It would of course require positive
control of the airspace, which is probably not available above the D.


What do you do if you don't find it?



Is the D equivalent to a "surface area"?


A surface area is the airspace contained by the lateral boundary of
controlled airspace designated for an airport that begins at the surface and
extends upward. In the US, they come in Class B, C, D, and Class E flavors.