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#1
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"Ron Snipes" wrote:
Accident occurred Monday, September 04, 2006 in Penhook, VA .... The pilot held a private pilot certificate with a rating for airplane single engine land, which was issued on June 17, 2006. His most recent FAA third class medical certificate was issued on February 16, 2006. He did not hold an instrument rating. Looks like around four months to get the certificate and a fatal mistake in judgment two and a half months later. :-( |
#2
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"Jim Logajan" wrote in message
.. . "Ron Snipes" wrote: Accident occurred Monday, September 04, 2006 in Penhook, VA ... The pilot held a private pilot certificate with a rating for airplane single engine land, which was issued on June 17, 2006. His most recent FAA third class medical certificate was issued on February 16, 2006. He did not hold an instrument rating. Looks like around four months to get the certificate and a fatal mistake in judgment two and a half months later. :-( And not just a mistake in judgment. He also lacked the skill to keep his plane upright under instrument conditions, which all private pilots are supposed to be trained to do. --Gary |
#3
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Besides, being carbureted, a 150 will quit after only a few seconds
inverted. The NTSB should also look at the quality and quantity of the simulated IMC time during his training. |
#4
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Viperdoc wrote:
Besides, being carbureted, a 150 will quit after only a few seconds inverted. The NTSB should also look at the quality and quantity of the simulated IMC time during his training. The basic instrument flight instruction part of PP training is really not sufficient, nor is it intended to be for sustained flight into IMC. Especially when at the same time trying to communicate with ATC, manage NAV radios and so forth.... that is what the instrument rating trains you to do. |
#5
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"ktbr" wrote in message
... Viperdoc wrote: Besides, being carbureted, a 150 will quit after only a few seconds inverted. The NTSB should also look at the quality and quantity of the simulated IMC time during his training. The basic instrument flight instruction part of PP training is really not sufficient, nor is it intended to be for sustained flight into IMC. Especially when at the same time trying to communicate with ATC, manage NAV radios and so forth.... that is what the instrument rating trains you to do. I disagree. The PP instrument training really should suffice to keep you upright in clouds for long enough to reach VMC if there's any within range. The instrument rating, in addition, teaches you to reliably maintain a precise heading and altitude, perform approaches to the minima (and with a partial panel), and understand the IFR system (planning, filing, lost comm procedures, and other regulations). --Gary |
#6
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Gary Drescher wrote:
I disagree. The PP instrument training really should suffice to keep you upright in clouds for long enough to reach VMC if there's any within range. It is generally understood that the training is sufficient to allow you to recognize your have entered IMC and then immediately make a 180 and get back out.... all in the space of a reasonably short time.... and there is not too much turbulence... and you are not to nervous... and hopefully you have maintained those skills since you checkride. etc. etc. It also assumes the pilot has and uses every cell of good judgement he has. I doubt the conditions of the obave referenced accident met this criteria. |
#7
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ktbr wrote:
Gary Drescher wrote: I disagree. The PP instrument training really should suffice to keep you upright in clouds for long enough to reach VMC if there's any within range. It is generally understood that the training is sufficient to allow you to recognize your have entered IMC and then immediately make a 180 and get back out.... all in the space of a reasonably short time.... and there is not too much turbulence... and you are not to nervous... and hopefully you have maintained those skills since you checkride. etc. etc. It also assumes the pilot has and uses every cell of good judgement he has. I doubt the conditions of the obave referenced accident met this criteria. As soon as he decided to depart, a few cells can be assumed to be on the blink. All well said. |
#8
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In a previous article, "Gary Drescher" said:
I disagree. The PP instrument training really should suffice to keep you upright in clouds for long enough to reach VMC if there's any within range. If you were in VMC and entered a cloud, it's supposed to be sufficient training that you can make a gentle 180 back to VMC. But this idiot launched into IMC. That's significantly different. -- Paul Tomblin http://xcski.com/blogs/pt/ "Panic kills" -- Rick Grant (quoting RCAF pilot training) |
#9
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"ktbr" == ktbr writes:
ktbr Viperdoc wrote: Besides, being carbureted, a 150 will quit after only a few seconds inverted. The NTSB should also look at the quality and quantity of the simulated IMC time during his training. ktbr The basic instrument flight instruction part of PP training ktbr is really not sufficient, nor is it intended to be for ktbr sustained flight into IMC. Quite so. As those who have flown solo in IMC know, there is a huge psychological difference between flying with a hood in sunshine and an instructor and knowing what you are about to do, and blundering into IMC with no warning and only yourself to get out of it. The hood training for the PP can never really prepare one for the case of blundering into IMC. Which is why on occasion I may chase a cloud and wander a bit too close. Not every VFR pilot needs the IFR rating, but every pilot does need some exposure to real IMC. Do it with an instructor and learn to live another day. -- Look, if you don't like my parties, you can leave in a huff. If that's too soon, leave in a minute and a huff. If you can't find that, you can leave in a taxi. Groucho Marx |
#10
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![]() Viperdoc wrote: Besides, being carbureted, a 150 will quit after only a few seconds inverted. I'm thinking in such a situation that the negative G required to kill the engine would be pre-empted by pilot's need to pull the wings off. Does anyone, ever, kill an engine that way when mistakenly entering IMC? |
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