How often do you have to go around?

Right.. for example at OSH where they are landing 3 planes at a time on
the same runway.


Ron Natalie wrote:
Mxsmanic wrote:
d&tm writes:

And of course for obvious reasons powered aircraft have to give
way to gliders.

I guess one can't really ask a glider to go around.

There's no rule that says you have to give way to gliders.
If you are lower and on final you have the right of way.
Of course, common sense says to give gliders and others
restricted in ability to manouver the right of way.'


In addition, while ATC may have rules to that don't allow
them to permit it, there is no regulation from the pilot
side that says you can't have two aircraft on the runway
at the same time. You do have to be very careful however.

Dan wrote:
Right.. for example at OSH where they are landing 3 planes at a time on
the same runway.


Oshkosh gets a special exemption to allow that. Normally,
there are stricter rules that the controllers must follow.
They have to plan (with little exception) that one aircraft
can not touch down until the other is clear.

In article ,
Ron Natalie wrote:

Dan wrote:
Right.. for example at OSH where they are landing 3 planes at a time on
the same runway.


Oshkosh gets a special exemption to allow that. Normally,
there are stricter rules that the controllers must follow.
They have to plan (with little exception) that one aircraft
can not touch down until the other is clear.

At HPN, sometimes they play a little game. If the spacing is tight, the
controller will ask the first plane, "Are you clear of the runway?". If
the pilot has any savvy at all, he'll reply that he is, regardless of
whether he's really over the hold short line or not. The tower will then
immediately give me my landing clearance.

Everybody wins. I don't get sent around and controller has "proof" on the
recording that he didn't break any rules.

In article ,
Roy Smith wrote:

Everybody wins. I don't get sent around and controller has "proof" on the
recording that he didn't break any rules.

PAO plays a similar game with pilots they know (ones that call
the tower controllers by name). Several times while a plane has
been slow getting to the end taxiway, they've cleared the plane holding in
position for high speed taxi, with take-off clearance happening on
the roll. Usually there is a plane on short final as well, so
everybody wins.

What PAO really needs is another taxi way between the middle of
the runway, and the end. The two taxiways near the middle are
right next to each other, and easy to miss if the landing is a
little long. Taxiing the 1000ft down to the end adds alot of time
on the runway.

Airport diagram pdf: http://204.108.4.16/d-tpp/0610/09216AD.PDF

On the subject of go arounds, I had to go around today since a bird
decided to do a downwind take off just as I was on short final.
I had to break off the approach to avoid a collision.

There was also a flock of birds on downwind at one point. 'traffic
on downwind, a flock of birds, type unknown, possibly seagulls'
was the call from the tower.

John
--
John Clear - http://www.clear-prop.org/

Ron Natalie wrote:



They have to plan (with little exception) that one aircraft
can not touch down until the other is clear.

Not even close to being correct. In fact most operations at GA airports
allow two aircraft on the runway. The general rule is if either
aircraft is a jet or weighs more than 12,500 then only one on the runway.

Newps wrote:


Ron Natalie wrote:



They have to plan (with little exception) that one aircraft
can not touch down until the other is clear.

Not even close to being correct. In fact most operations at GA airports
allow two aircraft on the runway. The general rule is if either
aircraft is a jet or weighs more than 12,500 then only one on the runway.

Yep. And that's something that needs to be taught more, because it
shocked me when it first happened to me. My instructor never told me
anything about it,and very few people I talked to knew it was legal.

On Sun, 15 Oct 2006 17:57:12 -0400, Ron Natalie
wrote:

Dan wrote:
Right.. for example at OSH where they are landing 3 planes at a time on
the same runway.


Oshkosh gets a special exemption to allow that. Normally,
there are stricter rules that the controllers must follow.
They have to plan (with little exception) that one aircraft
can not touch down until the other is clear.

Going into OSH about a week before the fly-in one year there were a
pair of us flying loose formation turning final. One was a Cozy and
the other my Deb. A tail dragger had landed and only partially turned
off at the first taxiway. The Cozy (canard) didn't have room to land.
I told the tower I had plenty of room. There was a pause followed by
ahhh OK. I had to apply power to get up to the tail dragger who was
still setting there talking to the ground crew. I started to go
around and they were gesturing for him to hurry up and get out of the
way. After all he could have stopped clear of the runway as he had a
good 100 feet plus to the west parallel taxiway for 36.

As usual I had trouble convincing them the Deb went in the classic
camping area even with my 1959 model sign.:-))


Roger Halstead (K8RI & ARRL life member)
(N833R, S# CD-2 Worlds oldest Debonair)
www.rogerhalstead.com