Plane plunges into sewage tank, disappears

In article ,
says...


They are unhappy events as in you don't get to use the plane afterwards
- but water landings are surprisingly survivable. Fixed gear or
retractible gear doesn't seem to make a lot of difference in ditchings.

http://www.equipped.com/ditchingmyths.htm


Good link - good response.
I am one of those who has read articles on the subject, over many years,
and formed what appears to be an uninformed opinion. The case here is well
enough presented to merit a review of some of those widely-circulated
ideas.

GF

"Peter Dohm" wrote in message


Very difficult. Perhaps impossible. The situation really stinks!

No matter how you cut it, it's a crappy way to go.

--
John T
http://sage1solutions.com/blogs/TknoFlyer
Reduce spam. Use Sender Policy Framework: http://openspf.org
____________________

On 2006-12-20, Roger wrote:
Maybe so and maybe not. You are playing the odds. I lost a good
friend just a couple weeks ago when he apparently dug a float in while
landing.

People have been lost when they've botched landings on dry land too. Are
we "playing the odds" when landing on dry land? Well, some people would
say so about any flying!

The point is (and made by this article) - ditching isn't nearly the
"certain death" that it's painted to be, and indeed in most cases it's
survivable with little enough injury that egress is possible (around 90%
of inshore water ditchings). One person dying when botching a water
landing does not change this.

--
Yes, the Reply-To email address is valid.
Oolite-Linux: an Elite tribute: http://oolite-linux.berlios.de

Shoki, one of the three that were killed was one of my fellow CFI's at my
FBO. While I only knew him in the day-to-day operations at our FBO, he was
always one of the warmest and friendliest person you could hope to meet.
The day he and his students died in that incredulously tragic crash I found
myself trying to reconcile that I had just seen him earlier that day,
walking by my desk in the CFI office area, smiling and waving as he always
would as he went off to his flight instruction duties.

The day after the accident all the CFI's met at the FBO, although none of us
had any desire to fly; both out of respect for our fallen friend and because
we were distracted by the loss of three of our own and were just not fit to
fly.

We hung around at the FBO for many hours (after an early morning meeting
where the announcement was shared - we were told to feel free to
decline/cancel any flights and to respect the wishes of any of our students
that were not up to flying that day). The thoughts we shared went back and
forth between the ones lost and the 'what could have gone wrong'
discussions.

The site of the accident was around the practice area that most of us visit
regularly with our students. The uncanny 'accuracy' (for lack of a better
word) that the plane went down into the sewage pond was dumbfounding. Of
course, the cruel irony of meeting one's end in a raw sewage pond made the
tragedy seem all the more poignant. They had to use a high pressure hose
with heavily chlorinated water to wash of the aircraft wreckage and the
bodies before copter lifting the wreckage (along with the bodies - secured
in by tarps and ropes) out of the emptied sewage pond and then set down on a
clear area nearby.

The wreckage was taken to Sacramento for study and the bodies were take to
the coroner.

One of our CFI's had been flying by the area and saw an aircraft spinning
in, but she had said that she was so high and the plane so low, that it
looked almost like a model radio airplane. It was after she landed that she
realized what she had just witnessed. Shoki had been one of her very close
friends at the flight school.

I didn't know the students very well, although I obviously knew them by
sight, in the day-to-day operations of the FBO.

I had been told years ago that if you fly long enough you will eventually
know someone who dies. Although another nearby business lost their owner in
a plane accident, this is the first time that this kind of tragedy has
struck in the 'home nest', as it were.

I took one of my students up for a flight yesterday and although the mood to
the aircraft was a somber one, talking about the loss - once we were in the
air, we both did what we had to do and focused our minds on the task.

There had been so many posts on this thread (which I wouldn't have noticed
until a friend mentioned the thread on this newsgroup; usually I'm just on
RAS), I just felt it important to put a human side, personal account of the
loss my flight school has gone through. There are three burning candles
with offerings of flowers on our front desk, commemorating the loss.

This was a profound loss that will be felt for some time.


--
--
=-----
Good Flights!

Cecil E. Chapman
CFI-A, CP-ASEL-IA

Check out my personal flying adventures from my first flight to the
checkride AND the continuing adventures beyond!
Complete with pictures and text at: www.bayareapilot.com

"I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things."
- Antoine de Saint-Exupery -

"We who fly, do so for the love of flying. We are alive in the air with
this miracle that lies in our hands and beneath our feet"
- Cecil Day Lewis -

"Cecil Chapman" wrote in message
. net...
Shoki, one of the three that were killed was one of my fellow CFI's at my
FBO. While I only knew him in the day-to-day operations at our FBO, he
was always one of the warmest and friendliest person you could hope to
meet. The day he and his students died in that incredulously tragic crash
I found myself trying to reconcile that I had just seen him earlier that
day, walking by my desk in the CFI office area, smiling and waving as he
always would as he went off to his flight instruction duties.

The day after the accident all the CFI's met at the FBO, although none of
us had any desire to fly; both out of respect for our fallen friend and
because we were distracted by the loss of three of our own and were just
not fit to fly.

We hung around at the FBO for many hours (after an early morning meeting
where the announcement was shared - we were told to feel free to
decline/cancel any flights and to respect the wishes of any of our
students that were not up to flying that day). The thoughts we shared
went back and forth between the ones lost and the 'what could have gone
wrong' discussions.

The site of the accident was around the practice area that most of us
visit regularly with our students. The uncanny 'accuracy' (for lack of a
better word) that the plane went down into the sewage pond was
dumbfounding. Of course, the cruel irony of meeting one's end in a raw
sewage pond made the tragedy seem all the more poignant. They had to use
a high pressure hose with heavily chlorinated water to wash of the
aircraft wreckage and the bodies before copter lifting the wreckage (along
with the bodies - secured in by tarps and ropes) out of the emptied sewage
pond and then set down on a clear area nearby.

The wreckage was taken to Sacramento for study and the bodies were take to
the coroner.

One of our CFI's had been flying by the area and saw an aircraft spinning
in, but she had said that she was so high and the plane so low, that it
looked almost like a model radio airplane. It was after she landed that
she realized what she had just witnessed. Shoki had been one of her very
close friends at the flight school.

I didn't know the students very well, although I obviously knew them by
sight, in the day-to-day operations of the FBO.

I had been told years ago that if you fly long enough you will eventually
know someone who dies. Although another nearby business lost their owner
in a plane accident, this is the first time that this kind of tragedy has
struck in the 'home nest', as it were.

I took one of my students up for a flight yesterday and although the mood
to the aircraft was a somber one, talking about the loss - once we were in
the air, we both did what we had to do and focused our minds on the task.

There had been so many posts on this thread (which I wouldn't have noticed
until a friend mentioned the thread on this newsgroup; usually I'm just on
RAS), I just felt it important to put a human side, personal account of
the loss my flight school has gone through. There are three burning
candles with offerings of flowers on our front desk, commemorating the
loss.

This was a profound loss that will be felt for some time.


--
--
=-----
Good Flights!

Cecil E. Chapman
CFI-A, CP-ASEL-IA

Check out my personal flying adventures from my first flight to the
checkride AND the continuing adventures beyond!
Complete with pictures and text at: www.bayareapilot.com

"I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things."
- Antoine de Saint-Exupery -

"We who fly, do so for the love of flying. We are alive in the air with
this miracle that lies in our hands and beneath our feet"
- Cecil Day Lewis -

Thanks, we had been wondering about you. Fate is the hunter, sometimes
it strikes VERY close to home. Hang in there.

Al G

The sad facts is that many airplanes will not recover from a
fully developed spin with the CG aft of the utility category
limit or with three people onboard or any baggage. If a
student gets into a spin and there is any delay in recovery
or any "fight" over the controls, the outcome will be
tragic.

Some maneuvers should not be done with any passengers, even
an observer or CFI in the back seats.


The meeting was a good thing as was the decision not to fly
that day. The boss's support was good too.





"Al G" wrote in message
...
|
| "Cecil Chapman" wrote in
message
| . net...
| Shoki, one of the three that were killed was one of my
fellow CFI's at my
| FBO. While I only knew him in the day-to-day
operations at our FBO, he
| was always one of the warmest and friendliest person you
could hope to
| meet. The day he and his students died in that
incredulously tragic crash
| I found myself trying to reconcile that I had just seen
him earlier that
| day, walking by my desk in the CFI office area, smiling
and waving as he
| always would as he went off to his flight instruction
duties.
|
| The day after the accident all the CFI's met at the FBO,
although none of
| us had any desire to fly; both out of respect for our
fallen friend and
| because we were distracted by the loss of three of our
own and were just
| not fit to fly.
|
| We hung around at the FBO for many hours (after an early
morning meeting
| where the announcement was shared - we were told to feel
free to
| decline/cancel any flights and to respect the wishes of
any of our
| students that were not up to flying that day). The
thoughts we shared
| went back and forth between the ones lost and the 'what
could have gone
| wrong' discussions.
|
| The site of the accident was around the practice area
that most of us
| visit regularly with our students. The uncanny
'accuracy' (for lack of a
| better word) that the plane went down into the sewage
pond was
| dumbfounding. Of course, the cruel irony of meeting
one's end in a raw
| sewage pond made the tragedy seem all the more poignant.
They had to use
| a high pressure hose with heavily chlorinated water to
wash of the
| aircraft wreckage and the bodies before copter lifting
the wreckage (along
| with the bodies - secured in by tarps and ropes) out of
the emptied sewage
| pond and then set down on a clear area nearby.
|
| The wreckage was taken to Sacramento for study and the
bodies were take to
| the coroner.
|
| One of our CFI's had been flying by the area and saw an
aircraft spinning
| in, but she had said that she was so high and the plane
so low, that it
| looked almost like a model radio airplane. It was after
she landed that
| she realized what she had just witnessed. Shoki had
been one of her very
| close friends at the flight school.
|
| I didn't know the students very well, although I
obviously knew them by
| sight, in the day-to-day operations of the FBO.
|
| I had been told years ago that if you fly long enough
you will eventually
| know someone who dies. Although another nearby business
lost their owner
| in a plane accident, this is the first time that this
kind of tragedy has
| struck in the 'home nest', as it were.
|
| I took one of my students up for a flight yesterday and
although the mood
| to the aircraft was a somber one, talking about the
loss - once we were in
| the air, we both did what we had to do and focused our
minds on the task.
|
| There had been so many posts on this thread (which I
wouldn't have noticed
| until a friend mentioned the thread on this newsgroup;
usually I'm just on
| RAS), I just felt it important to put a human side,
personal account of
| the loss my flight school has gone through. There are
three burning
| candles with offerings of flowers on our front desk,
commemorating the
| loss.
|
| This was a profound loss that will be felt for some
time.
|
|
| --
| --
| =-----
| Good Flights!
|
| Cecil E. Chapman
| CFI-A, CP-ASEL-IA
|
| Check out my personal flying adventures from my first
flight to the
| checkride AND the continuing adventures beyond!
| Complete with pictures and text at:
www.bayareapilot.com
|
| "I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of
petty things."
| - Antoine de Saint-Exupery -
|
| "We who fly, do so for the love of flying. We are alive
in the air with
| this miracle that lies in our hands and beneath our
feet"
| - Cecil Day Lewis -
|
| Thanks, we had been wondering about you. Fate is the
hunter, sometimes
| it strikes VERY close to home. Hang in there.
|
| Al G
|
|

The sad facts is that many airplanes will not recover from a
fully developed spin with the CG aft of the utility category
limit or with three people onboard or any baggage. If a
student gets into a spin and there is any delay in recovery
or any "fight" over the controls, the outcome will be
tragic.

Some maneuvers should not be done with any passengers, even
an observer or CFI in the back seats.


The meeting was a good thing as was the decision not to fly
that day. The boss's support was good too.

The crash occurred in a Beechcraft Travelair (a multi-engine airplane) and
there is no published procedure on how to even recover from a spin in one of
these aircraft should a spin develop.

None of us were going to fly the day after and you're quite right that the
chief pilot was right on about honoring our feelings and those of our
students in the matter. Shoki was a very good friend of his and you could
see as he was telling us how deeply affected by the loss (and those of the
students) he was.

--
--
=-----
Good Flights!

Cecil E. Chapman
CFI-A, CP-ASEL-IA

Check out my personal flying adventures from my first flight to the
checkride AND the continuing adventures beyond!
Complete with pictures and text at: www.bayareapilot.com

"I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things."
- Antoine de Saint-Exupery -

"We who fly, do so for the love of flying. We are alive in the air with
this miracle that lies in our hands and beneath our feet"
- Cecil Day Lewis -

"Don Tuite" wrote in message
...
Appalling, but hard to ignore.

http://sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cg...AGU8N26CP4.DTL

Don

Maybe it was suicide. The pilots last words were, "I am tired of all this
sh..".

Danny Deger

"Cecil Chapman" wrote in message
. net...
snip

This was a profound loss that will be felt for some time.



Thanks for the nice post.

Do you know what happened? Was it caused by praticing single engine out
flight?

Danny Deger

"Cecil Chapman" wrote in message
news:NuAih.5082$
snip
The sad facts is that many airplanes will not recover from a
fully developed spin with the CG aft of the utility category
limit or with three people onboard or any baggage. If a
student gets into a spin and there is any delay in recovery
or any "fight" over the controls, the outcome will be
tragic.

Some maneuvers should not be done with any passengers, even
an observer or CFI in the back seats.


The meeting was a good thing as was the decision not to fly
that day. The boss's support was good too.

The crash occurred in a Beechcraft Travelair (a multi-engine airplane) and
there is no published procedure on how to even recover from a spin in one
of these aircraft should a spin develop.


My understanding is most multi-engine planes will not recover from a spin.
They tend to spin flat without a chance of recovery.

Danny Deger