Anyone flown atn LPV yet?

Ron Rosenfeld wrote:
On Sun, 17 Dec 2006 06:59:39 -0800, Sam Spade wrote:



Well, I'm hand-flying most of the approaches, and the CDI is generally
centered prior to the FAF, so I wouldn't note a sudden change in
sensitivity on the final segment.

I do, of course, note the change going from enroute to terminal mode, and
from terminal to approach mode if I have any CDI deflection.
Ron (EPM) (N5843Q, Mooney M20E) (CP, ASEL, ASES, IA)

I am playing with the new Garmin 400/500W trainer and the needle
movement is very smooth.

I also verified the great difference between when the scaling becomes
localizer-like with VTF and own-nav.

I flew the LPV into KIXD Runway 36. Using VTF, I did an intercept 8
miles prior to JIKLA (the FAF). The CDI scaling was already well below
1 mile. Then I did an intercept at the same position with ANQUIM (the
IF) to JIKLA as the active leg. The needle came off the peg at 1 mile
crosstrack error.

The 530W also has a nice feature, not present in th 530. When there is
a course change at a waypoint it shows a broken magenta line, which is
the flyby course that will be flown if on autopilot. Positive course
gudiance in holds and procedure turns using highly accurate
roll-steering is great, too. (For FD or autopilot, those too need to
have roll steering to get the most out of these curved flight paths.)

On Fri, 22 Dec 2006 09:10:02 -0800, Sam Spade wrote:

Ron Rosenfeld wrote:
On Sun, 17 Dec 2006 06:59:39 -0800, Sam Spade wrote:



Well, I'm hand-flying most of the approaches, and the CDI is generally
centered prior to the FAF, so I wouldn't note a sudden change in
sensitivity on the final segment.

I do, of course, note the change going from enroute to terminal mode, and
from terminal to approach mode if I have any CDI deflection.
Ron (EPM) (N5843Q, Mooney M20E) (CP, ASEL, ASES, IA)

I am playing with the new Garmin 400/500W trainer and the needle
movement is very smooth.

I also verified the great difference between when the scaling becomes
localizer-like with VTF and own-nav.

I flew the LPV into KIXD Runway 36. Using VTF, I did an intercept 8
miles prior to JIKLA (the FAF). The CDI scaling was already well below
1 mile. Then I did an intercept at the same position with ANQUIM (the
IF) to JIKLA as the active leg. The needle came off the peg at 1 mile
crosstrack error.

The 530W also has a nice feature, not present in th 530. When there is
a course change at a waypoint it shows a broken magenta line, which is
the flyby course that will be flown if on autopilot. Positive course
gudiance in holds and procedure turns using highly accurate
roll-steering is great, too. (For FD or autopilot, those too need to
have roll steering to get the most out of these curved flight paths.)

I have no experience with anything other than the 480, so can't comment. I
also do not have a roll-steering a/p.

The 480 does show a solid curved magenta line for course changes at
waypoints representing the expected flight path.
Ron (EPM) (N5843Q, Mooney M20E) (CP, ASEL, ASES, IA)

"Sam Spade" wrote in message
...
The 530W also has a nice feature, not present in th 530. ......snip...
Positive course gudiance in holds and procedure turns using highly
accurate roll-steering is great, too. (For FD or autopilot, those too
need to have roll steering to get the most out of these curved flight
paths.)

According to the GNS430W manual, the unit does not provide positive course
guidance in holds except on the inbound leg, which is not a change from the
430, and does not provide positive course guidance on a PT except on the
outbound and inbound portions (not during the reversal itself), which is
also not a change from the 430.

Regarding roll steering, it says "For roll steering autopilots: roll
steering is terminated when approach mode is selected on the autopilot and
is available once the missed approach is initiated." I don't really
understand this statement.

I didn't read the 530W manual. Is it different?

Stan Prevost wrote:
"Sam Spade" wrote in message
...

The 530W also has a nice feature, not present in th 530. ......snip...
Positive course gudiance in holds and procedure turns using highly
accurate roll-steering is great, too. (For FD or autopilot, those too
need to have roll steering to get the most out of these curved flight
paths.)


According to the GNS430W manual, the unit does not provide positive course
guidance in holds except on the inbound leg, which is not a change from the
430, and does not provide positive course guidance on a PT except on the
outbound and inbound portions (not during the reversal itself), which is
also not a change from the 430.

Regarding roll steering, it says "For roll steering autopilots: roll
steering is terminated when approach mode is selected on the autopilot and
is available once the missed approach is initiated." I don't really
understand this statement.

I didn't read the 530W manual. Is it different?



It says the same thing.

I don't understand the limitation, either. It will have to be changed
if they want to take advantage of RF legs, which will eventually appear
in some Basic RNP IAPS, when the criteria are changed. High end birds
that have roll steering do not have such a limitation.

As to the PCG, in spite of what the manual says, it works in the
trainer. The trainer historically has been accurate.

Stan Prevost wrote:
"Sam Spade" wrote in message
...

The 530W also has a nice feature, not present in th 530. ......snip...
Positive course gudiance in holds and procedure turns using highly
accurate roll-steering is great, too. (For FD or autopilot, those too
need to have roll steering to get the most out of these curved flight
paths.)


According to the GNS430W manual, the unit does not provide positive course
guidance in holds except on the inbound leg, which is not a change from the
430, and does not provide positive course guidance on a PT except on the
outbound and inbound portions (not during the reversal itself), which is
also not a change from the 430.

Regarding roll steering, it says "For roll steering autopilots: roll
steering is terminated when approach mode is selected on the autopilot and
is available once the missed approach is initiated." I don't really
understand this statement.

I didn't read the 530W manual. Is it different?



I got the straight scoop from a Garmin soothsayer. First, with a Garmin
autopilot there would not be such a limitation. But, this manual is
written on the presumption the aircraft has Brand K or Brand S
autopilots that do have roll steering. But, those brands have to switch
to CDI steering to fly an ILS so roll steering is not allowed in the
final segment, even though it would be okay with RNAV.

"Sam Spade" wrote in message
news
Stan Prevost wrote:

I got the straight scoop from a Garmin soothsayer. First, with a Garmin
autopilot there would not be such a limitation. But, this manual is
written on the presumption the aircraft has Brand K or Brand S autopilots
that do have roll steering. But, those brands have to switch to CDI
steering to fly an ILS so roll steering is not allowed in the final
segment,

Interesting, but not totally clear. The implication is that the Garmin GPS
outputs roll steering commands derived from tracking the localizer signal.
Is that what the source was saying? Also, it implies that on the
non-brand-G autopilots, the entire ILS logic is based on using CDI steering
inputs. That may depend on whether the unit has "native" GPSS or add-on
GPSS. I have a brand-S unit without GPSS, but it can be added using the
external GPSS converter box that translates the roll steering commands into
inputs to the heading mode of the autopilot. I don't know how the add-on
box works on an ILS, probably can't be used.

even though it would be okay with RNAV.

How about VOR?

Stan Prevost wrote:

"Sam Spade" wrote in message
news
Stan Prevost wrote:

I got the straight scoop from a Garmin soothsayer. First, with a Garmin
autopilot there would not be such a limitation. But, this manual is
written on the presumption the aircraft has Brand K or Brand S autopilots
that do have roll steering. But, those brands have to switch to CDI
steering to fly an ILS so roll steering is not allowed in the final
segment,


Interesting, but not totally clear. The implication is that the Garmin GPS
outputs roll steering commands derived from tracking the localizer signal.
Is that what the source was saying? Also, it implies that on the
non-brand-G autopilots, the entire ILS logic is based on using CDI steering
inputs. That may depend on whether the unit has "native" GPSS or add-on
GPSS. I have a brand-S unit without GPSS, but it can be added using the
external GPSS converter box that translates the roll steering commands into
inputs to the heading mode of the autopilot. I don't know how the add-on
box works on an ILS, probably can't be used.


even though it would be okay with RNAV.


How about VOR?

He may have mention that but, if he did, I forget already. ;-)

Wouldn't folks normally use RNAV instead of VOR? (unlike ILS where you
are required to use the actual LOC and G/S)

"Sam Spade" wrote in message
...

Wouldn't folks normally use RNAV instead of VOR? (unlike ILS where you
are required to use the actual LOC and G/S)

Probably, when there is a suitable RNAV approach available.

Stan Prevost wrote:
"Sam Spade" wrote in message
...

Wouldn't folks normally use RNAV instead of VOR? (unlike ILS where you
are required to use the actual LOC and G/S)


Probably, when there is a suitable RNAV approach available.

If there isn't a suitable RNAV approach available, then the VOR approach
should be "...or GPS."

I wasnt aware Garmin makes an autopilot. Is this new?