How to compare/valuation of features

In article ,
"Douglas Paterson" wrote:

- Engine time. Seems simple enough--divide the time on the motor by TBO
and multiply by overhaul cost ($25K, I seem to be hearing? [oops! I'm
trying to join this club, better get used to the jargon: make that 25AMU
]). Throw in some English based on the average annual usage (more is
better), and you can compare two different time engines. Fair enough?

There is a fudge factor (totally guess work) to account for the type of time
on the engine. Did the airplane sit for months and months between long
flights? 300 hours in ten years isn't as good as 300 hours in 2-3 years.

Also, some engines have a calendar time between overhauls.

I didn't follow your whole thread, did anyone suggest you think about
whether you want an airplane with a run-out engine (you overhaul it and
know that you have a fresh overhaul), mid-time engine (will it really make
TBO?), or fresh overhaul (was it a cheapo overhaul?)?

I ended up buying (and paying for) an airplane with a low-time engine.
It had about 300 hours on it, and only got to around 600 hours before
a couple of cylinders cracked.


- Avionics--the big one. Conventional wisdom seems to be to get the
What's
a soup-to-nuts panel cost, brand new, installed? Is 50AMU in the ballpark?

What's your definition of soup-to-nuts?


- Paint. What's a quality paint job cost? 5AMU?

Around here, 10 AMU.


- Interior. What's a new interior cost? 5AMU?

and possibly more. Less if you do the work yourself.

good luck

--
Bob Noel
Looking for a sig the
lawyers will hate

Valuing similar aircraft is not straight forward, especially so if you have
not flown that make and model often.
Essentially, if you have decided to buy a specific model, the most important
task now is to become the dreaded tyre kicker !
Go look at every aircraft that are accessible to you, no matter the asking
price, that is the only way you will build the knowledge to eventually make
the decision which is right for you.
Test fly as many that will allow you and pay for the fuel !
Take your digital camera and photograph every bird you look at, in detail,
especially the panel.
Go home and study those photographs ......... build your knowledge of that
model and marks of it.
When you know that make and model really well, you are ready to seriously
consider dumping your cash into your very own money pit.
There is a lot of junk sitting on the market, you just have to know enough
to make sure you don't buy one of those.

When you have gone through this process you will know which aircraft
represents the condition and equipment that you are prepared to pay for.
You can use all the valuation aids available, but nothing will beat having
sound knowledge of the condition and equipment in the aircraft on sale and
their asking prices.

You already know that upgrading an aircraft with new avionics, engine work,
interior and exterior work is a costly exercise.
And if you go that route you will need to fly that value out of your bird.

The choice for me, was easier. I had lots of hours both flying and helping
to maintain Piper Archers. So an Archer would become my first airplane.

What should I do though ?
Buy a $95,000 Archer with decent avionics, up to half time engine and good
interior etc or buy an Archer with run-out engine, and more or less as it
left the Piper factory in all departments at a cost of $50,000.

I chose the expensive route, I bought the $50,000 bird and have spent the
last 2 years having a great time fixing it up so everything is as I want it
to be.
I am a mechanical engine and a licensed Radio Amateur, so have good
mechanical and avionic understanding.
When finished I will have about $110,000 in the bird, BUT ...... .....
It now is all new firewall forward, with a top notch engine, complete Garmin
530 Stack with Dacint RSS and all new under panel and avionic wiring.
The "all leather" interior cost $7,000, and stripping and painting gets done
in February at $9,000 plus.
I fitted new flight control cables and Knots 2U wing tips with landing
lights, gap seals and wing root fairings.
And a host of other upgrades to ensure the aircraft is in the very best
mechanical condition. In fact most moving parts are new.

I could have just overhauled the engine, and happily flown this minimum
squawk clean Archer with its factory avionics for many years.
But I relished the enjoyment of planning the work, negotiating the costs and
getting it all done.
So I cannot get back anywhere near the $110,000 that I have spent, but it is
equipped with the best, it flies really nice and will look great after the
paint job.

Would I go this route again ?
Well if I discount buying a new aircraft, yes, I think I would do it this
way again
I did not want a bird sitting in the hanger which had bits and pieces thrown
in by a dozen different owners who never spent the cash needed to properly
gut out the old and replace it all with new. I would have had to live and
maintain with what they left for me.

Know the model you intend to buy really well.
Know the current market prices, and eventually you will make a good decision
when you buy your aircraft.

--
Roy
Piper Archer N5804F


"Bob Noel" wrote in message
...

In article ,
"Douglas Paterson" wrote:

- Engine time. Seems simple enough--divide the time on the motor by TBO
and multiply by overhaul cost ($25K, I seem to be hearing? [oops! I'm
trying to join this club, better get used to the jargon: make that 25AMU
]). Throw in some English based on the average annual usage (more is
better), and you can compare two different time engines. Fair enough?

There is a fudge factor (totally guess work) to account for the type of
time
on the engine. Did the airplane sit for months and months between long
flights? 300 hours in ten years isn't as good as 300 hours in 2-3 years.

Also, some engines have a calendar time between overhauls.

I didn't follow your whole thread, did anyone suggest you think about
whether you want an airplane with a run-out engine (you overhaul it and
know that you have a fresh overhaul), mid-time engine (will it really make
TBO?), or fresh overhaul (was it a cheapo overhaul?)?

I ended up buying (and paying for) an airplane with a low-time engine.
It had about 300 hours on it, and only got to around 600 hours before
a couple of cylinders cracked.


- Avionics--the big one. Conventional wisdom seems to be to get the
What's
a soup-to-nuts panel cost, brand new, installed? Is 50AMU in the
ballpark?

What's your definition of soup-to-nuts?


- Paint. What's a quality paint job cost? 5AMU?

Around here, 10 AMU.


- Interior. What's a new interior cost? 5AMU?

and possibly more. Less if you do the work yourself.

good luck

--
Bob Noel
Looking for a sig the
lawyers will hate

In article ,
Bob Noel wrote:


and another thing... I always figured if you plan on keeping your airplane
for a long time, then the benefit of fixing the way you want it outweighs the
cost of the upgrades vs buying an airplane already equipped.

--
Bob Noel
Looking for a sig the
lawyers will hate