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Scary Icing ATC tape



 
 
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  #51  
Old February 4th 07, 02:25 AM posted to rec.aviation.piloting
Capt. Geoffrey Thorpe
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Posts: 790
Default Scary Icing ATC tape

"Mxsmanic" wrote in message
...
...
She seemed a bit clueless. He mentions icing regularly and suggests
possible solutions, but she doesn't appear to hear him, and doesn't
seem to understand what the possible cause of her problem is herself.

...

I wouldn't normally do this, but...

HELLO - ANTHONY!!!!

WHO THE **** DO YOU THINK CLEARED THE ICE WITH THE BOOTS AND HEAT??? THE
CONTROLLER?????

You have gone ON AND ON claiming that she didn't understand that there was
ice - I have to conclude that you A) didn't listen to the tape or B) DIDN'T
UNDERSTAND WHAT WAS SAID- _WERE_ _YOU_ _PAYING_ _ATTENTION_???????

SHE CLEARLY DETERMINED THAT SHE HAD ICE. IF YOU HAD LISTENED TO THE TAPE
YOU WOULD HAVE HEARD HER _C_L_E_A_R_L_Y_ SAY THAT SHE HAD TURNED ON THE
BOOTS AND HEAT AND WAS ABLE TO REGAIN CONTROL!!!!

BOOTS AND HEAT - BOOTS AND HEAT - BOOTS AND HEAT - DO YOU KNOW WHAT THAT
MEANS?

AM I MAKING MYSELF CLEAR? DO YOU UNDERSTAND ENGLISH? SHE SAID SHE KNEW SHE
HAD ICE. AND! SHE! DID! SOMETHING! ABOUT! IT!!! BOOTS! AND! HEAT!!!!!!

hellLLLLOOOoooo PAY ATTENTION DUDE!!!!

There. Now I feel better.

We now return you to your regularly scheduled program, already in progress
--
Geoff
The Sea Hawk at Wow Way d0t Com
remove spaces and make the obvious substitutions to reply by mail
When immigration is outlawed, only outlaws will immigrate.


  #52  
Old February 4th 07, 02:29 AM posted to rec.aviation.piloting
DaveB
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 36
Default Scary Icing ATC tape

On Sat, 3 Feb 2007 21:25:16 -0500, "Capt. Geoffrey Thorpe" The Sea
Hawk at wow way d0t com wrote:

"Mxsmanic" wrote in message
.. .
...
She seemed a bit clueless. He mentions icing regularly and suggests
possible solutions, but she doesn't appear to hear him, and doesn't
seem to understand what the possible cause of her problem is herself.

...

I wouldn't normally do this, but...

HELLO - ANTHONY!!!!

WHO THE **** DO YOU THINK CLEARED THE ICE WITH THE BOOTS AND HEAT??? THE
CONTROLLER?????

You have gone ON AND ON claiming that she didn't understand that there was
ice - I have to conclude that you A) didn't listen to the tape or B) DIDN'T
UNDERSTAND WHAT WAS SAID- _WERE_ _YOU_ _PAYING_ _ATTENTION_???????

SHE CLEARLY DETERMINED THAT SHE HAD ICE. IF YOU HAD LISTENED TO THE TAPE
YOU WOULD HAVE HEARD HER _C_L_E_A_R_L_Y_ SAY THAT SHE HAD TURNED ON THE
BOOTS AND HEAT AND WAS ABLE TO REGAIN CONTROL!!!!

BOOTS AND HEAT - BOOTS AND HEAT - BOOTS AND HEAT - DO YOU KNOW WHAT THAT
MEANS?

AM I MAKING MYSELF CLEAR? DO YOU UNDERSTAND ENGLISH? SHE SAID SHE KNEW SHE
HAD ICE. AND! SHE! DID! SOMETHING! ABOUT! IT!!! BOOTS! AND! HEAT!!!!!!

hellLLLLOOOoooo PAY ATTENTION DUDE!!!!

There. Now I feel better.

We now return you to your regularly scheduled program, already in progress
--
Geoff
The Sea Hawk at Wow Way d0t Com
remove spaces and make the obvious substitutions to reply by mail
When immigration is outlawed, only outlaws will immigrate.


what are boots
Daveb
  #53  
Old February 4th 07, 02:34 AM posted to rec.aviation.piloting
Tony
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 312
Default Scary Icing ATC tape

The transcript clearly has her saying she turned on boots and heat.

Maybe it's the water in Paris, at least the water or water substitute
Anthony drinks.
..




On Feb 3, 7:15 pm, Mxsmanic wrote:
buttman writes:
Has there EVER been a voice recording of an incident where the
consensus is that the pilot handled the situation in the WRONG way? It
seems that every time one of these are posted, no matter how much the
pilot freaks out, people always respond with "Oh that pilot stayed so
calm, what a great job. I'd fly with him/her!!".


I wouldn't fly with this pilot, or with any pilot who couldn't keep
his cool in an emergency.

When in danger, the leader (or PIC in this case) should not lose their
cool. That doesn't mean they have to be stone faced, but a good leader
resists the urge to go into all-out panic mode.


Yes. Panic is counter-productive.

Honestly, comparing this one to other similar voice recordings I've
heard, this woman went bonkers.


Agreed.

I wouldn't say she is a terrible
pilot, but at the same time, I don't think she handled this situation
as best as she could have. I think this woman was lucky. Going by what
I heard on the MP3, if things had been a little different, she may not
have made it. It's my opinion that she was saved by dumb luck. All
though with more info I may be proven wrong.


I agree. She got lucky. She did nothing to recover, she just had
some random luck. She didn't even seem to know what had happened.
She ignored every mention of icing, and her actions indicate that she
wasn't concerned about icing, even though she didn't really know what
was wrong.

--
Transpose mxsmanic and gmail to reach me by e-mail.



  #54  
Old February 4th 07, 02:48 AM posted to rec.aviation.piloting
Morgans
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 146
Default Scary Icing ATC tape


DaveB wrote

what are boots?


They are those things you put on your feet when it is cold and wet outside.

g

Sorry, but I couldn't resist!

Really, they are on some planes, usually midsized to smaller sizes that have
ice protection. They are a rubber skin that sits tightly on the leading
edge of the wing, and back over the top a ways. When ice builds up, they
are inflated with air, either manually, or automatically, and the ice cracks
and blows away.

Ice building up on the front and front top of the wing has a larger
detrimental effect on an airfoil than other places on the wing, but it isn't
good, anywhere. The heat referred to was the heat on the probe that
measures airspeed, and possibly on a few other places, like windshield and
propeller.

Google deicing boots.
--
Jim in NC

  #55  
Old February 4th 07, 02:54 AM posted to rec.aviation.piloting
Matt Whiting
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 2,232
Default Scary Icing ATC tape

Capt. Geoffrey Thorpe wrote:
"Mxsmanic" wrote in message
...
...

She seemed a bit clueless. He mentions icing regularly and suggests
possible solutions, but she doesn't appear to hear him, and doesn't
seem to understand what the possible cause of her problem is herself.


...

I wouldn't normally do this, but...

HELLO - ANTHONY!!!!

WHO THE **** DO YOU THINK CLEARED THE ICE WITH THE BOOTS AND HEAT??? THE
CONTROLLER?????

You have gone ON AND ON claiming that she didn't understand that there was
ice - I have to conclude that you A) didn't listen to the tape or B) DIDN'T
UNDERSTAND WHAT WAS SAID- _WERE_ _YOU_ _PAYING_ _ATTENTION_???????

SHE CLEARLY DETERMINED THAT SHE HAD ICE. IF YOU HAD LISTENED TO THE TAPE
YOU WOULD HAVE HEARD HER _C_L_E_A_R_L_Y_ SAY THAT SHE HAD TURNED ON THE
BOOTS AND HEAT AND WAS ABLE TO REGAIN CONTROL!!!!

BOOTS AND HEAT - BOOTS AND HEAT - BOOTS AND HEAT - DO YOU KNOW WHAT THAT
MEANS?

AM I MAKING MYSELF CLEAR? DO YOU UNDERSTAND ENGLISH? SHE SAID SHE KNEW SHE
HAD ICE. AND! SHE! DID! SOMETHING! ABOUT! IT!!! BOOTS! AND! HEAT!!!!!!

hellLLLLOOOoooo PAY ATTENTION DUDE!!!!

There. Now I feel better.

We now return you to your regularly scheduled program, already in progress
--


Is the Ritalin running low? :-)

Matt
  #56  
Old February 4th 07, 02:58 AM posted to rec.aviation.piloting
Capt. Geoffrey Thorpe
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 790
Default Scary Icing ATC tape

DaveB wrote in message ...
...
what are boots
Daveb


Rubber "boots" are applied to the leading edge of wings and other surfaces -
they can be inflated from underneath to crack off any accumulated ice.
Essentally they are a thin layer of rubber sealed around the edges that
wraps around the leading edge and goes back a short way on the upper surface
of the wing.

Aircraft with them installed look like the leading edge of the wing was
painted black.

Now, as far as this particular incident is concerned, I suspect that she
should have had them turned on earlier...

--
Geoff
The Sea Hawk at Wow Way d0t Com
remove spaces and make the obvious substitutions to reply by mail
When immigration is outlawed, only outlaws will immigrate.


  #57  
Old February 4th 07, 03:27 AM posted to rec.aviation.piloting
Owen Roberts
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 2
Default Scary Icing ATC tape



Mxsmanic wrote:

buttman writes:

Has there EVER been a voice recording of an incident where the
consensus is that the pilot handled the situation in the WRONG way? It
seems that every time one of these are posted, no matter how much the
pilot freaks out, people always respond with "Oh that pilot stayed so
calm, what a great job. I'd fly with him/her!!".


I wouldn't fly with this pilot, or with any pilot who couldn't keep
his cool in an emergency.


Oh please. I've heard a lot of people sound a lot more excited than that
riding a roller coaster at Six Flags. One's attention and nerves should be
focused on flying the damn airplane, not their tone inflection while on the
radio. If there's anything to fault her for, it is not landing as soon as
possible to check everything out. Maybe she did after the clip ended, who
knows.



When in danger, the leader (or PIC in this case) should not lose their
cool. That doesn't mean they have to be stone faced, but a good leader
resists the urge to go into all-out panic mode.


Yes. Panic is counter-productive.


That's good. You listened to a tape where nobody panicked and therefore
stayed alive.


  #58  
Old February 4th 07, 03:31 AM posted to rec.aviation.piloting
Philip S.
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 18
Default Scary Icing ATC tape

in article , Matt Whiting at
wrote on 2/3/07 6:54 PM:

Capt. Geoffrey Thorpe wrote:
"Mxsmanic" wrote in message
...
...

She seemed a bit clueless. He mentions icing regularly and suggests
possible solutions, but she doesn't appear to hear him, and doesn't
seem to understand what the possible cause of her problem is herself.


...

I wouldn't normally do this, but...

HELLO - ANTHONY!!!!

WHO THE **** DO YOU THINK CLEARED THE ICE WITH THE BOOTS AND HEAT??? THE
CONTROLLER?????

You have gone ON AND ON claiming that she didn't understand that there was
ice - I have to conclude that you A) didn't listen to the tape or B) DIDN'T
UNDERSTAND WHAT WAS SAID- _WERE_ _YOU_ _PAYING_ _ATTENTION_???????

SHE CLEARLY DETERMINED THAT SHE HAD ICE. IF YOU HAD LISTENED TO THE TAPE
YOU WOULD HAVE HEARD HER _C_L_E_A_R_L_Y_ SAY THAT SHE HAD TURNED ON THE
BOOTS AND HEAT AND WAS ABLE TO REGAIN CONTROL!!!!

BOOTS AND HEAT - BOOTS AND HEAT - BOOTS AND HEAT - DO YOU KNOW WHAT THAT
MEANS?

AM I MAKING MYSELF CLEAR? DO YOU UNDERSTAND ENGLISH? SHE SAID SHE KNEW SHE
HAD ICE. AND! SHE! DID! SOMETHING! ABOUT! IT!!! BOOTS! AND! HEAT!!!!!!

hellLLLLOOOoooo PAY ATTENTION DUDE!!!!

There. Now I feel better.

We now return you to your regularly scheduled program, already in progress
--


Is the Ritalin running low? :-)

Matt


Frankly, I was impressed by his restraint.

  #59  
Old February 4th 07, 03:45 AM posted to rec.aviation.piloting
Jay Honeck
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 3,573
Default Scary Icing ATC tape

Several years ago there was an mp3 circulated I guess in an attempt to show how
vauable ATC is. A guy was calling mayday because he was in a spin (apparently)
but survived after popping out of the bottom of the clouds.

I don't think many people would say the "pilot stayed so calm"


That would be this one, from Ft. Dodge, IA Flight Service station, via
our website:

http://alexisparkinn.com/photogaller...ightassist.mp3

Although most of it is an infomercial for Flight Service, the audio
portion of the out-of-control pilot should be required listening for
all new pilots.
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

  #60  
Old February 4th 07, 04:16 AM posted to rec.aviation.piloting
Morgans
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 146
Default Scary Icing ATC tape


"Philip S." wrote

Frankly, I was impressed by his restraint.


I remember back about 20 years, I had a T-shirt that said something like
this:

Self-control: the ability to keep yourself from choking the crap out of a
person who desperately needs, and deserves it.

I'm afraid that would have to be the case with me.
--
Jim in NC

 




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