Low towing thought

Martin Gregorie wrote:
I did annual checks about a month ago, when we were encouraged to try
low position on the way up for spin checks. I decided that I like low
tow and will use it in future, but before I do so there's one thing I'd
like to ask the Aussies and other habitual low towers: when you release
do you just pull the bung in the low position or do you pop up above the
wake first?

In Oz it's a no-no to pop up into high tow as you release (with all due
respect to Oscar's experience and SA's rules) because it's been known to
initiate a kiting situation. I guess our experience is that a 'slow'
move through a turbulent slipstream into high tow isn't all that easy to
accomplish for ab initio and low experience pilots at the same time as
they're trying to stay in position, check for traffic before release,
think about which knob to pull and how to initiate a turn.

The current teaching in Oz is to tow in whatever position you prefer
(most choose low) BUT you release from the tow position you used for the
climb so you don't scare the tuggies. KISS principle.

In general, while all gliders in Oz should have a nose hook for aerotow,
in practice this isn't always possible and the few gliders with only
belly hooks usually high tow, while the rest have the luxury (as Martin
discovered, it's easier) of low tow. So Oscar's problem of the Ottfur
ring (?) breaking the canopy is not relevant.

I fly a Libelle, which normally tows with a lot of sag in the rope, even
with the wheel down, and it occurred to me that releasing in the low
position could cause the rings to pass close to the canopy or even hit
it. At least the Libelle has a nose hook: if this is an issue, would it
be even worse with a belly hook?

I've never heard of a problem with low towing Libelles with nose hooks.
Obviously it would be sensible to release when the rope is under
tension but this applies to all towing. For those with only belly hooks,
see above.

GC

"Graeme Cant" gcantinter@tnodedotnet wrote in message
...
Martin Gregorie wrote:
I did annual checks about a month ago, when we were encouraged to try low
position on the way up for spin checks. I decided that I like low tow and
will use it in future, but before I do so there's one thing I'd like to
ask the Aussies and other habitual low towers: when you release do you
just pull the bung in the low position or do you pop up above the wake
first?

In Oz it's a no-no to pop up into high tow as you release (with all due
respect to Oscar's experience and SA's rules) because it's been known to
initiate a kiting situation. I guess our experience is that a 'slow' move
through a turbulent slipstream into high tow isn't all that easy to
accomplish for ab initio and low experience pilots at the same time as
they're trying to stay in position, check for traffic before release,
think about which knob to pull and how to initiate a turn.

The current teaching in Oz is to tow in whatever position you prefer (most
choose low) BUT you release from the tow position you used for the climb
so you don't scare the tuggies. KISS principle.

In general, while all gliders in Oz should have a nose hook for aerotow,
in practice this isn't always possible and the few gliders with only belly
hooks usually high tow, while the rest have the luxury (as Martin
discovered, it's easier) of low tow. So Oscar's problem of the Ottfur
ring (?) breaking the canopy is not relevant.

I fly a Libelle, which normally tows with a lot of sag in the rope, even
with the wheel down, and it occurred to me that releasing in the low
position could cause the rings to pass close to the canopy or even hit
it. At least the Libelle has a nose hook: if this is an issue, would it
be even worse with a belly hook?

I've never heard of a problem with low towing Libelles with nose hooks.
Obviously it would be sensible to release when the rope is under tension
but this applies to all towing. For those with only belly hooks, see
above.

GC

We used to go from low tow up into high tow or level tow as some may prefer.

After a few TUG pilots were killed in and some nearly killed they stopped
high tow unless you only have a belly hook.

We turn right after release.

We have released without turning like in wave etc and just to experiment I
have never come into contact with the rings as the tug accelerates away.

http://www.mals.net/

"Graeme Cant" gcantinter@tnodedotnet wrote in message
...
In Oz it's a no-no to pop up into high tow as you release (with all due
respect to Oscar's experience and SA's rules) because it's been known to
initiate a kiting situation. I guess our experience is that a 'slow' move
through a turbulent slipstream into high tow isn't all that easy to accomplish
for ab initio and low experience pilots...

That trip up (and/or down) through the wake is part of the drill for the
"boxing the wake" manuver. I would never solo a student who couldn't do that.

Vaughn

Vaughn Simon wrote:
"Graeme Cant" gcantinter@tnodedotnet wrote in message
...
In Oz it's a no-no to pop up into high tow as you release (with all due
respect to Oscar's experience and SA's rules) because it's been known to
initiate a kiting situation. I guess our experience is that a 'slow' move
through a turbulent slipstream into high tow isn't all that easy to accomplish
for ab initio and low experience pilots...

That trip up (and/or down) through the wake is part of the drill for the
"boxing the wake" manuver. I would never solo a student who couldn't do that.

Vaughn

Good.

Your point is?

GC

"Graeme Cant" gcantinter@tnodedotnet wrote in message
...
Vaughn Simon wrote:
"Graeme Cant" gcantinter@tnodedotnet wrote in message
...
In Oz it's a no-no to pop up into high tow as you release (with all due
respect to Oscar's experience and SA's rules) because it's been known to
initiate a kiting situation. I guess our experience is that a 'slow' move
through a turbulent slipstream into high tow isn't all that easy to
accomplish for ab initio and low experience pilots...

That trip up (and/or down) through the wake is part of the drill for the
"boxing the wake" manuver. I would never solo a student who couldn't do
that.

Vaughn

Good.

Your point is?

My point is that the slow "trip through the wake" should not be a problem,
even for ab initio and low experience pilots. It is something that is easily
trained for and practiced.

Vaughn

Vaughn Simon wrote:
"Graeme Cant" gcantinter@tnodedotnet wrote in message
...
Vaughn Simon wrote:
"Graeme Cant" gcantinter@tnodedotnet wrote in message
...
In Oz it's a no-no to pop up into high tow as you release (with all due
respect to Oscar's experience and SA's rules) because it's been known to
initiate a kiting situation. I guess our experience is that a 'slow' move
through a turbulent slipstream into high tow isn't all that easy to
accomplish for ab initio and low experience pilots...
That trip up (and/or down) through the wake is part of the drill for the
"boxing the wake" manuver. I would never solo a student who couldn't do
that.

Vaughn
Good.

Your point is?

My point is that the slow "trip through the wake" should not be a problem,
even for ab initio and low experience pilots. It is something that is easily
trained for and practiced.

1. In my instructing experience boxing the wake is a moderately
difficult manoeuvre to carry out in a well-controlled way for ab initio
and low experience pilots. Many experienced pilots botch boxing the
wake on their annual check. That's why instructors set it as an
exercise. I suspect that's why you set it.

2. Boxing the wake doesn't actually involve a trip directly through the
slipstream.

GC

Vaughn

On Mar 8, 6:44 am, Graeme Cant gcantinter@tnodedotnet wrote:
1. In my instructing experience boxing the wake is a moderately
difficult manoeuvre to carry out in a well-controlled way for ab initio
and low experience pilots. Many experienced pilots botch boxing the
wake on their annual check. That's why instructors set it as an
exercise. I suspect that's why you set it.

Yes. And I stress *precision* in the exercise. The point is not to
get around the wake as fast as possible, it is to prove to the
instructor that you have the skill to make the various transitions
while maintaining control of the glider.

2. Boxing the wake doesn't actually involve a trip directly through the
slipstream.

Many people begin the exercise by dropping from high to low tow
through the wake. This help establish the reference for where the
bottom part of the box should be.

-Tom

Adding to Tom's point, there are "locational" variations to boxing the
wake. Where I learned, we would drop down to low tow, climb right back
up to high tow, then box the wake going clockwise around the wake.
Where I fly now, we drop to low tow, box the wake going clockwise
around the wake, then climb back up to high tow. I've heard that at
some sites the wake is boxed going counter-clockwise around the wake
instead of clockwise.

None of these variations really matter much - as 5Z says, the whole
point of the maneuver "is to prove to the instructor that you have the
skill to make the various transitions while maintaining control of the
glider."

-John

On Mar 8, 11:03 am, "5Z" wrote:
Many people begin the exercise by dropping from high to low tow
through the wake. This help establish the reference for where the
bottom part of the box should be.

-Tom

5Z wrote:
....snip
Many people begin the exercise by dropping from high to low tow
through the wake. This helps establish the reference for where the
bottom part of the box should be.

I've not seen that but it's an interesting thought. Being down under,
of course, we'd usually begin by climbing.

GC

-Tom