A tower-induced go-round

On Sun, 18 Mar 2007 15:57:15 -0700, Jay Honeck wrote:

I'll take an uncontrolled airport over non-radar Class D, any day of the
week.

I don't see it that way. Class D can be no worse than an uncontrolled
airport. It can be better.

But I do agree that a pilot is not absolved of situational awareness by
being in class D airspace, and too many pilot's fail to realize this.

I've posted this here before, but I think it worth repeating: the last
flight I took right-seat with a particular someone was when we were
approaching a class D and we'd a clear view of traffic on climb-out that
we knew from radio calls was closed traffic. That traffic and we were
destined to reach downwind at about the same time.

I suggested to my friend that he deviate a little so as to come into the
pattern behind that traffic. He said that it wasn't necessary as the
tower would keep us apart.

- Andrew

I don't see it that way. Class D can be no worse than an uncontrolled
airport. It can be better.

Class Delta can be MUCH worse than "uncontrolled", in my experience,
because:

a) You've got a guy in the tower with binoculars trying to see and
control too many things going on.

b) You've got too many pilots reporting "5 north of the field" when
they are *really* 5 EAST of the field (for example), making it
impossible for our hapless binocular-equipped controller to keep track
of traffic effectively.

At an uncontrolled airport, everyone KNOWS they are on their own, and
events transpire accordingly and (mostly) predictably. In Class D'oh
airspace, on the other hand, too many pilots believe that the
controller is actually controlling the airspace, when, in fact, he is
not.

This type of confusion is a recipe for conflicts -- and I've seen them
often.
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

"Jay Honeck" wrote in message
ups.com...

That's why I contend that Class D stands for "D'oh!", and is the most
dangerous airspace in America.

I'll take an uncontrolled airport over non-radar Class D, any day of
the week.


Why would the presence of a control tower render airspace unsafe?

Steven P. McNicoll wrote:
Why would the presence of a control tower render airspace unsafe?

I wouldn't agree with that, but it could be a risk factor.

There's a phenomenon that's been observed that people change their safety
margins in the face of safety equipment. People wearing bicycle helmets
tend to cycle in a riskier manner; people with ABS brakes drive a little
faster, and a little more aggressively, trusting the brakes to save them
if needed.

I suspect this is also a factor when there's a tower -- people let up on
their traffic scan, and lose some common sense, assuming the controller
won't let anything bad happen to them.

.... Alan
--
Alan Gerber
PP-ASEL
gerber AT panix DOT com

On Mar 18, 4:43 pm, Tim wrote:
Jay Honeck wrote:
Except when requested by the controller or in
emergency situations, a 360 degree turn should never be executed in the
traffic pattern or when receiving radar service without first advising the
controller.

Yep, although I couldn't quote chapter and verse, this is what I
figured the rules were.
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"
A tower controller has NEVER been killed because of their screw up. It is always the pilot who bites the dust. When I stated a 360 for spacing was my first choice I never said I wasn't going to make a radio report to the tower, in fact That has happened to me before and as I started my 360 the tower was notified by me, it is then up to them to fix the mess they created. I am going home alive, **** on the incompetent tower controller who stuffed a plane right in front of me after I was cleared to land. Funny ol Steven P. Mc Nicoll threw in the side line of tower operators not making enough money, and there will be a shortage of them because of it. One day he might even admit a controller actually made a mistake and a pilot fixed it and lived to fly again. I have to admit he can quote all the rules and seems up to speed on traffic flows and probably was a great controller before he became mighter then the rest of us. !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!




I did a 360 once in the pattern at a class D airport. the tower and the
conflicting traffic forgot about me. I was on final. he turned traffic
following me inthe pattern in front of me. The other traffic had no
awareness... I keyed the mike to let them know what was going on...
doh. got stepped on. did a 360 and then called AFTER. I was not
worried about doing something wrong - I was worried about getting killed
by the controller who dropped the ball and two pilots in the other plane
who were not paying attention to what the heck was going on in the pattern.

It happens too often. Do what you need to do to stay alive.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

wrote in message
oups.com...

A tower controller has NEVER been killed because of their screw up. It is
always the
pilot who bites the dust. When I stated a 360 for spacing was my first
choice I never
said I wasn't going to make a radio report to the tower, in fact That has
happened to
me before and as I started my 360 the tower was notified by me, it is then
up to them
to fix the mess they created.


Yup, just as it's up to them to fix the messes pilots create.



I am going home alive, **** on the incompetent tower controller who
stuffed a plane
right in front of me after I was cleared to land.


Was spacing a problem?



Funny ol Steven P. Mc Nicoll threw in the side line of tower operators not
making
enough money, and there will be a shortage of them because of it. One day
he might
even admit a controller actually made a mistake and a pilot fixed it and
lived to fly
again.


Me? Admit a controller made a mistake? I'm as likely to do that as you are
to admit a pilot made a mistake.



I have to admit he can quote all the rules and seems up to speed on
traffic flows
and probably was a great controller before he became mighter then the rest
of
us. !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


He still is.