Coordinated turns without rudder, and autopilots

Mxsmanic wrote in
:

How do autopilots make coordinated turns even when they cannot control
the rudder?


They don't fjukkktard.



Just like you can't.


Bertie

Hey Anthony you butthead- your basic premise is incorrect: the autopilot in
small planes (like the Baron I've flown for around 500 hours) does not do
coordinated turns. Just because there might be some anomalous behavior in
your game does not make is so in real life.

However, so little rudder is needed at speed, it makes no difference if the
ball is halfway out, in terms of comfort. Also, a standard rate turn is not
necessarily a coordinated turn, although some of your statements suggested
that you do not know the difference.

As good as you might think it is, do not mistake the flying model of a $50
computer game with real flying. Your presumed knowledge and the basis of
your questions are obviously limited by the shortcomings of MSFS.

Viperdoc writes:

Hey Anthony you butthead- your basic premise is incorrect: the autopilot in
small planes (like the Baron I've flown for around 500 hours) does not do
coordinated turns. Just because there might be some anomalous behavior in
your game does not make is so in real life.

There is no anomaly in the game. The only anomaly I see is that nobody here
knows the answer. Lots of people strutting about and claiming to be experts,
and calling each other stupid, but nobody really knows, and that is pretty
glaringly obvious to the observer.

However, so little rudder is needed at speed, it makes no difference if the
ball is halfway out, in terms of comfort.

Then my attempts to keep it centered with the rudder are not necessary,
either.

Also, a standard rate turn is not
necessarily a coordinated turn, although some of your statements suggested
that you do not know the difference.

I know the difference.

As good as you might think it is, do not mistake the flying model of a $50
computer game with real flying. Your presumed knowledge and the basis of
your questions are obviously limited by the shortcomings of MSFS.

Do not assume that every anomaly is a simulator defect. The simulator is a
lot better than you think. Indeed, it predicts the behavior of an aircraft a
lot better than anyone here does.

"Mxsmanic" wrote in message
...

Then my attempts to keep it centered with the rudder are not necessary,
either.

That's correct, and if you sim doesn't work that way, it's wrong.


Also, a standard rate turn is not
necessarily a coordinated turn, although some of your statements
suggested
that you do not know the difference.

I know the difference.

Apparently not.


As good as you might think it is, do not mistake the flying model of a
$50
computer game with real flying. Your presumed knowledge and the basis of
your questions are obviously limited by the shortcomings of MSFS.

Do not assume that every anomaly is a simulator defect. The simulator is
a
lot better than you think. Indeed, it predicts the behavior of an
aircraft a
lot better than anyone here does.

Only in your mind, moron, only in you mind.

Mxsmanic wrote in
:

Viperdoc writes:

Hey Anthony you butthead- your basic premise is incorrect: the
autopilot in small planes (like the Baron I've flown for around 500
hours) does not do coordinated turns. Just because there might be
some anomalous behavior in your game does not make is so in real
life.

There is no anomaly in the game. The only anomaly I see is that
nobody here knows the answer.

Yeah, right, fjukktyard


Berti e

Just to reiterate- the autopilot does not do a coordinated turn. It may do
so in your game. It may be different when hand flying versus while on
autopilot, but this is in your game.

I have many hours in a real Baron and this is how it works. Some real
planes require more or less rudder, as others have pointed out. My Extra
takes a little rudder pressure for a coordinated turn, while even with my
limited time in F-16's, it's pretty much feet on the floor.

You try to look for answers based upon some premise that your game is a real
representation of an actual flying experience. Yet, MSFS is notably week in
some areas, like the Extra, where the roll rate and flying model are nowhere
close to reality. The Baron model is far from accurate, and even the
multimillion dollar one I rode in at Simcomm wasn't that close.

Why can't you accept this and stop trolling? As good as it might be, it is
still just a game you're playing.
..

Viperdoc writes:

Just to reiterate- the autopilot does not do a coordinated turn.

Yes, it does, at least according to the turn indicator.

I have many hours in a real Baron and this is how it works. Some real
planes require more or less rudder, as others have pointed out. My Extra
takes a little rudder pressure for a coordinated turn, while even with my
limited time in F-16's, it's pretty much feet on the floor.

I was talking about the autopilot, not the human pilot.

You try to look for answers based upon some premise that your game is a real
representation of an actual flying experience.

Some try to conceal their lack of answers by claiming that a simulation isn't
like real life. But my simulator predicts the behavior of an aircraft a lot
better than anyone here apparently can.

Yet, MSFS is notably week in
some areas, like the Extra, where the roll rate and flying model are nowhere
close to reality.

I'm not flying an Extra.

The Baron model is far from accurate, and even the
multimillion dollar one I rode in at Simcomm wasn't that close.

What errors are there in the simulated model? Be specific.

Why can't you accept this and stop trolling? As good as it might be, it is
still just a game you're playing.

Because I know I'm right. The more huffing and puffing I see here, the more
proof I see that I'm right.

Someone who actually knows doesn't have to pretend.

Mxsmanic wrote:

Because I know I'm right. The more huffing and puffing I see here,
the more proof I see that I'm right.


What are you right about? You asked a question. Several folks answered it.

Mxsmanic wrote in
:

Viperdoc writes:

Just to reiterate- the autopilot does not do a coordinated turn.

Yes, it does, at least according to the turn indicator.

no it doesn,t and that's not a turn coordintsaor it';s a bunch of
electrons.


I have many hours in a real Baron and this is how it works. Some
real planes require more or less rudder, as others have pointed out.
My Extra takes a little rudder pressure for a coordinated turn, while
even with my limited time in F-16's, it's pretty much feet on the
floor.

I was talking about the autopilot, not the human pilot.

No, you;'re toaling about a computer.


You try to look for answers based upon some premise that your game is
a real representation of an actual flying experience.

Some try to conceal their lack of answers by claiming that a
simulation isn't like real life. But my simulator predicts the
behavior of an aircraft a lot better than anyone here apparently can.

Yet, MSFS is notably week in
some areas, like the Extra, where the roll rate and flying model are
nowhere close to reality.

I'm not flying an Extra.

You're not flying anything.


The Baron model is far from accurate, and even the
multimillion dollar one I rode in at Simcomm wasn't that close.

What errors are there in the simulated model? Be specific.

Why can't you accept this and stop trolling? As good as it might be,
it is still just a game you're playing.

Because I know I'm right. The more huffing and puffing I see here,
the more proof I see that I'm right.

You're an idiot.


Bertie

"Mxsmanic" wrote ...

What errors are there in the simulated model? Be specific.


MSFS has for a long time been known to have a rather inaccurate flight
model. MS tends to focus on the eye candy aspects of simulation.

In my own experience, the stall/spin entry behavior is an easily explored
area which quite clearly reveals the inadequacies of MSFS' flight modeling
as compared to the real world. And it reflects of course as well in other
areas of the flight envelope.

Years ago I flew extensively with a popular WWII networked combat airplane
simulator (Warbirds). One of its claims to fame was that its flight dynamics
model was based on actual real-time calculation of the motional differential
equations that govern the flight dynamics of an aircraft. This in contrast
to the "simplistic table-driven flight dynamics model of the mainstream PC
simulators" probably referring to MSFS.
Marketing talk aside, I found that simulator MUCH more realistic in the
flight dynamics modeling than MSFS. Especially at the edges of the flight
envelope, where the differences between different airplanes were very
significant. Different airplanes bite you in different ways ;-)