Congress Examines Pilot Medical Record Fraud

Larry Dighera wrote:

CONGRESS EXAMINES PILOT MEDICAL RECORD FRAUD
(http://www.avweb.com/eletter/archive...ll.html#195656)
Does the FAA need to do more to ensure that pilots are not lying
about dangerous medical problems so they can keep their
certification? That's the question that was discussed in
Washington, D.C., on Wednesday at a hearing

I was discussing the health of airline pilots with a recently retired
captain of a major airline. He commented that the flying public would be
upset if they knew the truth about medical conditions being hidden. He
also told of pilots going to MEs on the other side of the country from
home to get their physicals with sympathetic examiners.

"RomeoMike" wrote in message
...


Larry Dighera wrote:
CONGRESS EXAMINES PILOT MEDICAL RECORD FRAUD
(http://www.avweb.com/eletter/archive...ll.html#195656)
Does the FAA need to do more to ensure that pilots are not lying
about dangerous medical problems so they can keep their
certification? That's the question that was discussed in
Washington, D.C., on Wednesday at a hearing
I was discussing the health of airline pilots with a recently retired
captain of a major airline. He commented that the flying public would be
upset if they knew the truth about medical conditions being hidden. He
also told of pilots going to MEs on the other side of the country from
home to get their physicals with sympathetic examiners.

I'm curious: Is there an actual problem based on statistics suggesting that
pilots lying on their medical exams is
a significant contributor to accidents, or is this more likely driven by
paranoia, ignorance or politics?

-c

C Gattman wrote:
"RomeoMike" wrote in message
...


Larry Dighera wrote:
CONGRESS EXAMINES PILOT MEDICAL RECORD FRAUD
(http://www.avweb.com/eletter/archive...ll.html#195656)
Does the FAA need to do more to ensure that pilots are not lying
about dangerous medical problems so they can keep their
certification? That's the question that was discussed in
Washington, D.C., on Wednesday at a hearing
I was discussing the health of airline pilots with a recently retired
captain of a major airline. He commented that the flying public
would be upset if they knew the truth about medical conditions being
hidden. He also told of pilots going to MEs on the other side of the
country from home to get their physicals with sympathetic examiners.

I'm curious: Is there an actual problem based on statistics
suggesting that pilots lying on their medical exams is
a significant contributor to accidents, or is this more likely driven
by paranoia, ignorance or politics?

-c

No statisticly you are probably more likely to get shot in the face by the
Vice President. What SHOULD be ****ing folks off is that there are people
getting SSA payments who shouldn't be.

I had a look at a website that listed those items that would be
disqualifying for a medical certificate and really saw nothing that
was awful.

Some conditions, like loss of conciousness, seem fairly obvious. Many
things that would allow someone to collect disability (back problems
are an obvious example) are not reasons to lose one's medical.

I had really been looking to see if signing the medical certificate
also gave 'informed consent' for a waiver of privicy with respect to
medical records, but did not find that. You might remember whenever
you do have a medical condition that involves a third party payer you
sign away some rights so that the insurance company can get the
information they want.

If the FAA wants to 'send a message' all they need do is enforce this
a few hundred times.

"FAR 67.403 Falsification of the airman medical application form
8500-8 may result in adverse action including fines up to $250,000,
imprisonment up to 5 years and revocation of medical and all pilot
certificates."

On Sat, 21 Jul 2007 00:58:12 -0000, Tina wrote
in . com:

I had really been looking to see if signing the medical certificate
also gave 'informed consent' for a waiver of privicy with respect to
medical records, but did not find that.

I didn't see that either:

http://www.leftseat.com/8500.htm
http://www.leftseat.com/pdffiles/8500-8new.pdf

20. APPLICANT'S DECLARATION - Two declarations are contained
under this heading. The first authorizes the National Driver Register
to release adverse driver history information, if any, about the
applicant to the FAA. The second certifies the completeness and
truthfulness of the applicant's responses on the medical application.
The declaration section must be signed and dated by the applicant
after the applicant has read it.

You are being manipulated!
There is no herd of pilots flying over your head while impaired...
There is no crises other than the cynically created media blitz...
The public is not in danger - other than from special interest groups
(anti gun, anti GA, etc.)...


There is no pilot medical record fraud other than the isolated
incident that will always pop up now and then...
If you want fraud, better look at drivers - no licenses, expired
licenses, mis-tagged cars, drunk, stoned, epileptics, nearly blind,
psychotic, road ragers, arrest warrants, and on, and on... Both the
absolute numbers and the percentages vastly exceed anything that
general aviation has to offer...


And being disabled under SSI criteria does not necessarily mean that
you cannot and should not fly... The FAA has provisions in the
regulations that allow for demonstration of ability, fer cripes sake..
There are paraplegics flying and they certainly meet the SSI criteria
for disability... There are one arm pilots... There are diabetics
flying... There are one eyed pilots flying... There are post heart
attack pilots flying... There are post stroke pilots flying... And all
of them have valid medical certificates...

You are being manipulated - time to wake up and pay attention to who
is manipulating you and why...

denny

On Sat, 21 Jul 2007 04:31:14 -0700, Denny wrote
in . com:

There is no pilot medical record fraud other than the isolated
incident that will always pop up now and then...

This government document seems to contradict your subjective
assessment of the issue:


http://transportation.house.gov/Medi...7/SSM71707.pdf

In July 2005, a Department of Transportation Inspector General
("IG") investigation uncovered "egregious cases" of airmen lying
about debilitating medical conditions on their applications for
Airmen Medical Certificates. In a sample of 40,000 airmen
certificate-holders, the Inspector General found more than 3,200
airmen holding current medical certificates while simultaneously
receiving Social Security benefits, including those for medically
disabling conditions. While the U.S. Attorney's Office ultimately
prosecuted more than 40 cases, the IG believes that hundreds more
could have been pursued if the U.S. Attorney's resources had not
been constrained. These cases involved pilots with a variety of
medical conditions including schizophrenia and bipolar disorder.
The extent of the problem of falsified Airmen Medical Certificate
applications is unknown beyond the initial IG investigation.

It has been pointed out that collecting SSI benefits and holding a
valid medical certificate are not mutually exclusive. There was an
analysis of GA accidents (I posted the URL on the weekend insurance
thread, don't have it handy now) that looked at the causes of GA
accidents, and I don't remember medically unift pilots being high on
the list.

It may be a case of someone with authority solving a non-problem.

Tina

In article ,
Larry Dighera wrote:

On Sat, 21 Jul 2007 04:31:14 -0700, Denny wrote
in . com:

There is no pilot medical record fraud other than the isolated
incident that will always pop up now and then...

This government document seems to contradict your subjective
assessment of the issue:

"seems" is an important word here.

caveat: I'm not defending anyone falsifying information on their
medical application. My primary motiviation in this response is
to try to point out the egregious misuse of statistics and lack of
useful information in the hearing document.




http://transportation.house.gov/Medi...7/SSM71707.pdf

In July 2005, a Department of Transportation Inspector General
("IG") investigation uncovered "egregious cases" of airmen lying
about debilitating medical conditions on their applications for
Airmen Medical Certificates. In a sample of 40,000 airmen
certificate-holders, the Inspector General found more than 3,200
airmen holding current medical certificates while simultaneously
receiving Social Security benefits,

Which is not proof of a problem since receiving social security
benefits is not necessarily inconsistent with holding a valid medical
certificate.

including those for medically
disabling conditions.

What would be much more useful would be the number of those
with medically disabling conditions. Unfortunately the IG apparently
didn't bother to count those, implying that all 3200 had disqualifying
conditions. I hope people can understand that this is not necessarily
true.

The hearing document references a research study (without attribution)
where approximately 9% of the toxicology reports from fatal accidents
indicate an airment with a serious unreported medical condition. One flaw
in the document is that it doesn't indicate whether or not the fatal accident
was a result of the unreported medical condition. A second flaw is that
it doesn't indicate if the serious unreported medical condition should have
disqualified the airman from having a valid medical. A third flaw is that
there is no discussion of whether or not the unreported medical condition
had existed prior to the airmen's last medical (e.g., was the condition new?).

In any case, the document indicates some 9% of the pilots in fatals accidents
had a unreported serious medical condition. Then the document makes the
claim that since ~1/3 of the pilots held first or second class medical
certificates that "the falsification issue is not limited to recreational general
aviation pilots." The reality is that there is insufficient information
presented to determine whether or not ANY of the pilots with first or second
class medicals falsified anything. In fact, there isn't sufficient information
presented to determine if any of the "recreational" pilots falsified anything.
Someone had the information, why didn't they indicate how many people
with first class medicals failed to report their serious medical condition?
How many with second class failed to report? How many with third
class? And how many of each these contributed the fatal accident?

If that pdf file is representative of the information that will be provided
at the hearings and used for future policy changes (if any), then I have
zero confidence that anything of any value will come of the hearings.

--
Bob Noel
(goodness, please trim replies!!!)

Larry Dighera wrote:
http://transportation.house.gov/Medi...7/SSM71707.pdf

In July 2005, a Department of Transportation Inspector General
("IG") investigation uncovered "egregious cases" of airmen lying
about debilitating medical conditions on their applications for
Airmen Medical Certificates. In a sample of 40,000 airmen
certificate-holders, the Inspector General found more than 3,200
airmen holding current medical certificates while simultaneously
receiving Social Security benefits, including those for medically
disabling conditions. While the U.S. Attorney's Office ultimately
prosecuted more than 40 cases, the IG believes that hundreds more
could have been pursued if the U.S. Attorney's resources had not
been constrained. These cases involved pilots with a variety of
medical conditions including schizophrenia and bipolar disorder.
The extent of the problem of falsified Airmen Medical Certificate
applications is unknown beyond the initial IG investigation.

This is OLD news and contains the _deliberately_ misleading statement "the
Inspector General found more than 3,200 airmen holding current medical
certificates while simultaneously receiving Social Security benefits,
including those for medically disabling conditions."

It is deliberately misleading because the only important number, for
"including those for medically disabling conditions," was excluded. If they
had an estimate, they refused to disclose it. If they didn't have a number,
that didn't stop them from deliberately impugned the reputation of
thousands of retired aviators for their private political gain. It is
disgusting motivation and they should be held to account for it.

The closest the U.S. AG comes to stating the important number is where they
state "the IG believes that hundreds more could have been pursued...." So
the it appears even the IG believes the number is probably under 1000. That
means about 2.5% tops.