VOR approach SMO

Once inside BEVEY you're good for 680. There is no glideslope and it's "Dive
and Drive." That's why the pros make it in with no trouble, they can read
charts.

Karl

Karl
"Hamish Reid" wrote in message
...
In article ,
"karl gruber" wrote:

I see no problem with the weather 800/3 as you point out. Inside BEVEY
drive
down to 680 outside CULVE, and have 3 miles to descend 505 feet. Any jet
will do that all day long.

So you'd drop below 1120 *outside* CULVE? Even if you were just cutting
things a little fine, the 2.4 miles from CULVE is from the *far end* of
the runway you're landing on... and if you were descending below 1120
just inside BEVEY in IMC, you might be in more trouble than you'd like.

Hamish

Right, dive to 1120 and drive to CULVE, then dive to 680.

karl gruber wrote:

Once inside BEVEY you're good for 680. There is no glideslope and it's "Dive
and Drive." That's why the pros make it in with no trouble, they can read
charts.

Karl

On Jul 23, 4:08 pm, B wrote:
Right, dive to 1120 and drive to CULVE, then dive to 680.

So, the question is still, how does the GulfStream get from CULVE at
1120 down to 0 at the numbers. I was in IMC with gear and flaps down,
power at idle and in a slip and I was still about 3/4 down when I
touched. Does a GulfStream drop faster than a Mooney?

-Robert

On Jul 23, 8:31 pm, "Robert M. Gary" wrote:
On Jul 23, 4:08 pm, B wrote:

Right, dive to 1120 and drive to CULVE, then dive to 680.

So, the question is still, how does the GulfStream get from CULVE at
1120 down to 0 at the numbers. I was in IMC with gear and flaps down,
power at idle and in a slip and I was still about 3/4 down when I
touched. Does a GulfStream drop faster than a Mooney?


I wouldn't be surprised...doesn't NASA use Gulfstreams albiet
modified) to train Shuttle pilots to be able to land the "flying
brick?" g

On Jul 23, 5:41 pm, Doug Semler wrote:
On Jul 23, 8:31 pm, "Robert M. Gary" wrote:

On Jul 23, 4:08 pm, B wrote:

Right, dive to 1120 and drive to CULVE, then dive to 680.

So, the question is still, how does the GulfStream get from CULVE at
1120 down to 0 at the numbers. I was in IMC with gear and flaps down,
power at idle and in a slip and I was still about 3/4 down when I
touched. Does a GulfStream drop faster than a Mooney?

I wouldn't be surprised...doesn't NASA use Gulfstreams albiet
modified) to train Shuttle pilots to be able to land the "flying
brick?" g

Yea, with thrust reverses in the descent!

-Robert

On Jul 23, 9:03 pm, "Robert M. Gary" wrote:
On Jul 23, 5:41 pm, Doug Semler wrote:

On Jul 23, 8:31 pm, "Robert M. Gary" wrote:
Does a GulfStream drop faster than a Mooney?

I wouldn't be surprised...doesn't NASA use Gulfstreams albiet
modified) to train Shuttle pilots to be able to land the "flying
brick?" g

Yea, with thrust reverses in the descent!

There's your answer... Guy behind you is a former shuttle pilot big
grin

"Robert M. Gary" wrote in message ups.com...

Yea, with thrust reverses in the descent!

-Robert


Reminds me of a story told me by a friend in school for his King Air.
A classmate asked if he could reverse the prop pitch in flight.
The instructor replied: "Yes, you can.
And if you do, you will fall out of the sky like a typewriter."

On Jul 23, 8:31 pm, "Robert M. Gary" wrote:
On Jul 23, 4:08 pm, B wrote:

Right, dive to 1120 and drive to CULVE, then dive to 680.

So, the question is still, how does the GulfStream get from CULVE at
1120 down to 0 at the numbers. I was in IMC with gear and flaps down,
power at idle and in a slip and I was still about 3/4 down when I
touched. Does a GulfStream drop faster than a Mooney?

FWIW, my quick and dirty math shows ~5.5 degree slope from CULVE to
threshold @ 1120. If you keep that slope, you would have broken
through the clouds about 6500 ft from the threshold at 800 (625 agl).
The Gulf's approach speed is something like 120 or 130. Calling it
130, that's a 1300-1400fpm descent rate at that slope. If the gulf
can do that, then they could keep a nice steady path to the threshold
@ 5.5 degrees.

Now if you dive at a 6.5 degree slope at CULVE, you are decreasing
your final angle to 5 degrees while extending your distance to
threshold another 500 ft when breaking out.

Of course, this all assumes that you are actually at 1120 when at
culve g

On Jul 24, 8:59 am, Doug Semler wrote:
On Jul 23, 8:31 pm, "Robert M. Gary" wrote:

On Jul 23, 4:08 pm, B wrote:

Right, dive to 1120 and drive to CULVE, then dive to 680.

So, the question is still, how does the GulfStream get from CULVE at
1120 down to 0 at the numbers. I was in IMC with gear and flaps down,
power at idle and in a slip and I was still about 3/4 down when I
touched. Does a GulfStream drop faster than a Mooney?

FWIW, my quick and dirty math shows ~5.5 degree slope from CULVE to
threshold @ 1120. If you keep that slope, you would have broken
through the clouds about 6500 ft from the threshold at 800 (625 agl).
The Gulf's approach speed is something like 120 or 130. Calling it
130, that's a 1300-1400fpm descent rate at that slope. If the gulf
can do that, then they could keep a nice steady path to the threshold
@ 5.5 degrees.

Now if you dive at a 6.5 degree slope at CULVE, you are decreasing
your final angle to 5 degrees while extending your distance to
threshold another 500 ft when breaking out.

Of course, this all assumes that you are actually at 1120 when at
culve g

And that your approach speed and threshold crossing speed are the same
(i,e. that you don't need additional room to slow down).

On Jul 24, 1:59 pm, "Robert M. Gary" wrote:
On Jul 24, 8:59 am, Doug Semler wrote:





On Jul 23, 8:31 pm, "Robert M. Gary" wrote:

On Jul 23, 4:08 pm, B wrote:

Right, dive to 1120 and drive to CULVE, then dive to 680.

So, the question is still, how does the GulfStream get from CULVE at
1120 down to 0 at the numbers. I was in IMC with gear and flaps down,
power at idle and in a slip and I was still about 3/4 down when I
touched. Does a GulfStream drop faster than a Mooney?

FWIW, my quick and dirty math shows ~5.5 degree slope from CULVE to
threshold @ 1120. If you keep that slope, you would have broken
through the clouds about 6500 ft from the threshold at 800 (625 agl).
The Gulf's approach speed is something like 120 or 130. Calling it
130, that's a 1300-1400fpm descent rate at that slope. If the gulf
can do that, then they could keep a nice steady path to the threshold
@ 5.5 degrees.

Now if you dive at a 6.5 degree slope at CULVE, you are decreasing
your final angle to 5 degrees while extending your distance to
threshold another 500 ft when breaking out.

Of course, this all assumes that you are actually at 1120 when at
culve g

And that your approach speed and threshold crossing speed are the same
(i,e. that you don't need additional room to slow down

Yes, I told you it was quick and dirty (I did it pretty much in my
head. there's *alot* of rounding in there g)

I did a search and can't find any performance characteristics of a
gulf on the web, except an accident report stating the probable cause
of an accident as the pilot's putting the plane in an unstabilized
2500fpm descent profile :-/