Bomber-jacket leather and our law

jacket. The biggest diffence (aside from the slash pockets) is the
cheap lambskin being used in the Chinese version (if a leather jacket
is selling for $99, it's not quality stuff), while a military jacket
is goat or cow.

Isn't shearling by definition lambskin? By the spring of 1942, the
majority of AVGs were wearing shearling jackets, as in the 3rd Sq
ground crew photo I mentioned.

Both of my Airborne Leathers jackets are cowhide, same thickness as
the MIL spec jacket, but the leather is a bit more stiff and it
lacks the brightness of finish of my well-worn issue jacket.

Sounds good to me.

all the best -- Dan Ford
email: www.danford.net/letters.htm#9

see the Warbird's Forum at www.warbirdforum.com
and the Piper Cub Forum at www.pipercubforum.com

Cub Driver wrote in message . ..
jacket. The biggest diffence (aside from the slash pockets) is the
cheap lambskin being used in the Chinese version (if a leather jacket
is selling for $99, it's not quality stuff), while a military jacket
is goat or cow.

Isn't shearling by definition lambskin? By the spring of 1942, the
majority of AVGs were wearing shearling jackets, as in the 3rd Sq
ground crew photo I mentioned.

Yes, shearling is sheep or lambskin, and the B-3, B-6, D-1, M-444 and
M-445 were made out of sheepskin. The A-2 and M422/G-1 were not. The
A-2 was horse, goat or cow and the M-422 was goat.

~Michael

Subject: Bomber-jacket leather and our law
From: Cub Driver
Date: 9/22/03 2:33 AM Pacific Daylight Time
Message-id:


jacket. The biggest diffence (aside from the slash pockets) is the
cheap lambskin being used in the Chinese version (if a leather jacket
is selling for $99, it's not quality stuff), while a military jacket
is goat or cow.

Isn't shearling by definition lambskin? By the spring of 1942, the
majority of AVGs were wearing shearling jackets, as in the 3rd Sq
ground crew photo I mentioned.

Both of my Airborne Leathers jackets are cowhide, same thickness as
the MIL spec jacket, but the leather is a bit more stiff and it
lacks the brightness of finish of my well-worn issue jacket.

Sounds good to me.

all the best -- Dan Ford
email: www.danford.net/letters.htm#9

see the Warbird's Forum at www.warbirdforum.com
and the Piper Cub Forum at www.pipercubforum.com


Anybody remember the designation of those big sheepskin lined winter flying
suites we wore? I wish I still had mine. (sigh)


Arthur Kramer
344th BG 494th BS
England, France, Belgium, Holland, Germany
Visit my WW II B-26 website at:
http://www.coastcomp.com/artkramer

(ArtKramr) wrote in message ...
Subject: Bomber-jacket leather and our law
From: Cub Driver
Date: 9/22/03 2:33 AM Pacific Daylight Time
Message-id:


jacket. The biggest diffence (aside from the slash pockets) is the
cheap lambskin being used in the Chinese version (if a leather jacket
is selling for $99, it's not quality stuff), while a military jacket
is goat or cow.

Isn't shearling by definition lambskin? By the spring of 1942, the
majority of AVGs were wearing shearling jackets, as in the 3rd Sq
ground crew photo I mentioned.

Both of my Airborne Leathers jackets are cowhide, same thickness as
the MIL spec jacket, but the leather is a bit more stiff and it
lacks the brightness of finish of my well-worn issue jacket.

Sounds good to me.

all the best -- Dan Ford
email: www.danford.net/letters.htm#9

see the Warbird's Forum at www.warbirdforum.com
and the Piper Cub Forum at www.pipercubforum.com


Anybody remember the designation of those big sheepskin lined winter flying
suites we wore? I wish I still had mine. (sigh)

The B-6 was the intermediate weight sheepskin jacket and the B-3 and
AN-J-4 were the heavy weight sheepskin jackets. What clothing (and
how many layers) did you usually wear on missions? From the photos
I've seen, it doesn't look like the B-26s crews wore a ton of clothes
or were issued electric flight suits or sheepskin (very often).

~Michael

Subject: Bomber-jacket leather and our law
From: (Michael)
Date: 9/22/03 5:28 PM Pacific Daylight Time
Message-id:

The B-6 was the intermediate weight sheepskin jacket and the B-3 and
AN-J-4 were the heavy weight sheepskin jackets. What clothing (and
how many layers) did you usually wear on missions?

For winter flying we were issued elecric suits, heavy sheepskin jackets and bib
pants and quileted long johns as well as 4 pairs of gloves

From the photos
I've seen, it doesn't look like the B-26s crews wore a ton of clothes
or were issued electric flight suits or sheepskin (very often).

~Michael

Very often? I am not sure what you mean by very often?



..
Arthur Kramer
344th BG 494th BS
England, France, Belgium, Holland, Germany
Visit my WW II B-26 website at:
http://www.coastcomp.com/artkramer

(ArtKramr) wrote in message ...
Subject: Bomber-jacket leather and our law
From: (Michael)
Date: 9/22/03 5:28 PM Pacific Daylight Time
Message-id:

The B-6 was the intermediate weight sheepskin jacket and the B-3 and
AN-J-4 were the heavy weight sheepskin jackets. What clothing (and
how many layers) did you usually wear on missions?

For winter flying we were issued elecric suits, heavy sheepskin jackets and bib
pants and quileted long johns as well as 4 pairs of gloves

From the photos
I've seen, it doesn't look like the B-26s crews wore a ton of clothes
or were issued electric flight suits or sheepskin (very often).

~Michael

Very often? I am not sure what you mean by very often?

Sorry for the confusion. I'm assuming since there is little
photographic evidence of sheepskin jackets being used by B-26 crews,
that they weren't something the entire group of aircrew was outfitted
with. That's what I meant by not "very often".

So how did it work? Was every flyer in your group issued a heavy
sheepskin jacket? And would they have gotten it stateside before they
shipped out or when they arrived at their assigned group? It seems
like an A-2 or B-10 jacket or B-11 parka over a flight suit and wool
uniform was the most common outfit worn by B-26 crews, even during the
winter.

~Michael

Subject: Bomber-jacket leather and our law
From: (Michael)
Date: 9/23/03 7:01 AM Pacific Daylight Time

So how did it work? Was every flyer in your group issued a heavy
sheepskin jacket? And would they have gotten it stateside before they
shipped out or when they arrived at their assigned group? It seems
like an A-2 or B-10 jacket or B-11 parka over a flight suit and wool
uniform was the most common outfit worn by B-26 crews, even during the
winter.

~Michael


Every flier in the group was issued sheepskin pants and jacket, quilted long
Johns, electric suit and 4 pairs of gloves. They were issued to us in England.
The clothing you describe would only be worn in summer. And we were never
issued a parka of any kind. It would have been useless. Imagine a chute harness
over a parka for example. During the bitter record setting winter of 1944 (
Battle of the Bulge) we flew in the sheepskins and after the missions we kept
them on and slept in them to keep from freezing. The electric suits were of
limited use since if it was really cold on the ground you couldn't bail out in
an elctric suit. You would freeze to death. Also the electric suits had "hot
spots" in them. After a while they would burn under the armpits and behind the
knees and elbows and they had to be turned off until those areas cooled. And by
the time they cooled the rest of you was shivering. So you would fly missions
in an electric suit turning it on and off and on and off all the way out and
back.


Arthur Kramer
344th BG 494th BS
England, France, Belgium, Holland, Germany
Visit my WW II B-26 website at:
http://www.coastcomp.com/artkramer

(ArtKramr) wrote in message ...
Every flier in the group was issued sheepskin pants and jacket, quilted long
Johns, electric suit and 4 pairs of gloves. They were issued to us in England.

Thanks for the info. It's interesting (at least to me) to hear about
stuff like this. I've heard of guys getting all new gear before they
ship out, and guys getting equiped when they reach their theatre. I
guess there was no set system of who would get what, when or where.

The clothing you describe would only be worn in summer. And we were never
issued a parka of any kind. It would have been useless. Imagine a chute harness over a parka for example.

I've seen photos and the harness fits over them. I'm sure they would
have been a pain, but they did issue B-7, B-9 & B-11 parkas to aircrew
for flight use. The B-11 got lots of use later in the war, and was
issued to everyone from glider pilots to heavy bomber crews.

During the bitter record setting winter of 1944 (
Battle of the Bulge) we flew in the sheepskins and after the missions we kept
them on and slept in them to keep from freezing.

I can only imagine how harsh the conditions were. Did you ever get
warm? I had a great uncle in the 101st during the Battle of the
Bulge. Unfortunately he died before I was born so I never got to hear
of his experiences.

The electric suits were of
limited use since if it was really cold on the ground you couldn't bail out in
an elctric suit. You would freeze to death. Also the electric suits had "hot
spots" in them. After a while they would burn under the armpits and behind the
knees and elbows and they had to be turned off until those areas cooled. And by
the time they cooled the rest of you was shivering. So you would fly missions
in an electric suit turning it on and off and on and off all the way out and
back.

Do you know what type you were issued? Your comments echo exactly
those I've heard and read about the one piece F-1 blue bunny suits.
Sometimes they wouldn't work at all and other times they'd burn you.
They were better left off and just used as another layer of clothing.
The two piece F-3 suit supposedly fixed those problems of hot spots,
breaking wires, etc. and was worn under the B-10/A-9 combo to protect
you if the electric suit failed or you bailed out. Seems like heavy
bomber crews just about always wore an F-3 suit from late summer '44
onward and they were used extensively during the Korean War too by
Invader and B-29 crews.

Thank you for taking the time to discuss this stuff with me. I really
appreciate it. If I could bother you with one other question which
I've always wonder about (but nothing is ever written)... what was
life like between missions? i.e. What responsibilities would aircrew
have between missions? What did they do to fill up the day when they
weren't flying?

Thanks,

~Michael