B-52 Re-engining?

On Fri, 26 Sep 2003 23:19:54 GMT, Chad Irby wrote:

"Tarver Engineering" wrote:

"BUFDRVR" wrote:

It'll be like Christmas in (insert month of first operational
re-engined BUFF arriving here). The proposal will also give us an
upgraded avionics, which will be worth as much to the average
crewdog as the engines themselves.

Consider it a ten year life extension, in 2030.

At the rate they're going, you could be frozen for a thousand years,
wake up, and the only thing that you'll recognize will be made by
Boeing...

"Yeah, we kept upgrading them. The 2045 AD mods made them sentient, and
we had to keep them up to spec or they'd get cranky..."


The thing that amzes me is a couple guys designed it in a hotel room
over a weekend. (Obviously they didn't do all the detail work but
still)

"Scott Ferrin" wrote in message
...
On Fri, 26 Sep 2003 23:19:54 GMT, Chad Irby wrote:

"Tarver Engineering" wrote:

"BUFDRVR" wrote:

It'll be like Christmas in (insert month of first operational
re-engined BUFF arriving here). The proposal will also give us an
upgraded avionics, which will be worth as much to the average
crewdog as the engines themselves.

Consider it a ten year life extension, in 2030.

At the rate they're going, you could be frozen for a thousand years,
wake up, and the only thing that you'll recognize will be made by
Boeing...

"Yeah, we kept upgrading them. The 2045 AD mods made them sentient, and
we had to keep them up to spec or they'd get cranky..."


The thing that amzes me is a couple guys designed it in a hotel room
over a weekend. (Obviously they didn't do all the detail work but
still)

All aircraft and aircraft systems begin as napkin drawings.

From: "Tarver Engineering"
aol.com wrote:
snip

All aircraft and aircraft systems begin as napkin drawings.


Another pronouncement from the deep.

Dan, U. S. Air Force, retired

On 27 Sep 2003 05:20:41 GMT, (B2431) wrote:

From: "Tarver Engineering"
aol.com wrote:
snip

All aircraft and aircraft systems begin as napkin drawings.

Another pronouncement from the deep.

I thought it was true. How else would you do it?

I'm willing to posit that the napkin may be present only symbolically,
but every airplane starts with a quick sketch on something.

Mary
--
Mary Shafer
"There are only two types of aircraft--fighters and targets"
Major Doyle "Wahoo" Nicholson, USMC

"Mary Shafer" wrote in message
...
On 27 Sep 2003 05:20:41 GMT, (B2431) wrote:

From: "Tarver Engineering"
aol.com wrote:
snip

All aircraft and aircraft systems begin as napkin drawings.

Another pronouncement from the deep.

I thought it was true. How else would you do it?

I'm willing to posit that the napkin may be present only symbolically,
but every airplane starts with a quick sketch on something.

The napkin drawings are great fun to do.

On Fri, 26 Sep 2003 16:41:04 -0700, "Tarver Engineering"
wrote:


"Scott Ferrin" wrote in message
.. .
On Fri, 26 Sep 2003 23:19:54 GMT, Chad Irby wrote:

"Tarver Engineering" wrote:

"BUFDRVR" wrote:

It'll be like Christmas in (insert month of first operational
re-engined BUFF arriving here). The proposal will also give us an
upgraded avionics, which will be worth as much to the average
crewdog as the engines themselves.

Consider it a ten year life extension, in 2030.

At the rate they're going, you could be frozen for a thousand years,
wake up, and the only thing that you'll recognize will be made by
Boeing...

"Yeah, we kept upgrading them. The 2045 AD mods made them sentient, and
we had to keep them up to spec or they'd get cranky..."


The thing that amzes me is a couple guys designed it in a hotel room
over a weekend. (Obviously they didn't do all the detail work but
still)

All aircraft and aircraft systems begin as napkin drawings.



They built a model to go with it that weekend too. Hardly a napkin
and I doubt many (any actually) manufactures use napkin drawings for
their presentation to the brass.

Scott Ferrin wrote:


They built a model to go with it that weekend too. Hardly a napkin
and I doubt many (any actually) manufactures use napkin drawings for
their presentation to the brass.

That's really quite a silly suggestion Scott...of course they
don't, doesn't preclude the initial idea being roughed out by a
hand drawn sketch does it?
--

-Gord.

"Gord Beaman" wrote
Scott Ferrin wrote:


They built a model to go with it that weekend too. Hardly a napkin
and I doubt many (any actually) manufactures use napkin drawings
for
their presentation to the brass.

That's really quite a silly suggestion Scott...of course they
don't, doesn't preclude the initial idea being roughed out by a
hand drawn sketch does it?

Scott's refering to the original pitch that sold the B-52 to the Air
Force. According to Gunston, a team of Boeing engineers initially
pitched a turboprop B-52. When it became plain that the Air Force
thought a developed B-36 was preferable, the USAF types handed Boeing
a draft set of requirements for a jet bomber, the Boeing guys retired
to a hotel in Dayton and over a long weekend, developed the concept of
the BUFF from scratch, generated enough drawings and description,
including a wooden model to sell the concept. They had a great deal of
supporting data with them that was developed in a study that resulted
in the B-47 but it's still an amazing feat.

"Paul Austin" wrote in message
...

"Gord Beaman" wrote
Scott Ferrin wrote:


They built a model to go with it that weekend too. Hardly a napkin
and I doubt many (any actually) manufactures use napkin drawings
for
their presentation to the brass.

That's really quite a silly suggestion Scott...of course they
don't, doesn't preclude the initial idea being roughed out by a
hand drawn sketch does it?

Scott's refering to the original pitch that sold the B-52 to the Air
Force. According to Gunston, a team of Boeing engineers initially
pitched a turboprop B-52. When it became plain that the Air Force
thought a developed B-36 was preferable, the USAF types handed Boeing
a draft set of requirements for a jet bomber, the Boeing guys retired
to a hotel in Dayton and over a long weekend, developed the concept of
the BUFF from scratch,

Where else do you suppose new airplanes come from besides "from scratch"?

There is nothing different about the B-52.

"Tarver Engineering" wrote in message
...

"Paul Austin" wrote in message
...

"Gord Beaman" wrote
Scott Ferrin wrote:


They built a model to go with it that weekend too. Hardly a
napkin
and I doubt many (any actually) manufactures use napkin
drawings
for
their presentation to the brass.

That's really quite a silly suggestion Scott...of course they
don't, doesn't preclude the initial idea being roughed out by a
hand drawn sketch does it?

Scott's refering to the original pitch that sold the B-52 to the
Air
Force. According to Gunston, a team of Boeing engineers initially
pitched a turboprop B-52. When it became plain that the Air Force
thought a developed B-36 was preferable, the USAF types handed
Boeing
a draft set of requirements for a jet bomber, the Boeing guys
retired
to a hotel in Dayton and over a long weekend, developed the
concept of
the BUFF from scratch,

Where else do you suppose new airplanes come from besides "from
scratch"?

There is nothing different about the B-52.

Those kinds of proposals are much more often done by a cast of dozens
back at the plant with all the resources the company can bring to
bear, rather than in a hotel room. That's the remarkable thing about
the history of the B-52. Every great invention starts out as a vision
distilled by one or a few people, as often as not through informal
discussions that ghasp may involve beer lubricants.

The B-52 isn't the only airplane that was radically different from
what the customer originally had in mind. The A4D was even more wildly
different from what the procuring agency (NAVAIR in this case) though
they would be buying. Ed Heinemann didn't do the conceptual design in
a hotel room though. He used every resource that Douglas could muster,
back at the plant before he went to Washington to pitch it.