Piloting is the second most dangerous occupation

Gattman wrote:

wrote in message
...


If you take out the few high risk piloting occupatations such as
crop dusting and fire fighting, aviation is hardly dangerous.

The general public should continue to believe professional flying is
dangerous, and the danger should equate to better pay for professional
pilots.

While I can agree with the sentiment, there are two things wrong with
this.

First, pilots aren't payed by the general public so for that part
what they believe is irrelevant.

Second, if the general public believes flying is dangerous, flying
goes down the tubes along with the pilot jobs.


--
Jim Pennino

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On Mon, 13 Aug 2007 17:20:58 +0200, Martin
wrote:

On Mon, 13 Aug 2007 07:02:02 +0200, Mxsmanic wrote:

Judah writes:

What I find interesting is this: You have expressed that you choose not to
believe anything published online by pilots unless it is already in line with
your existing preconceived notions - even in the face of supporting evidence.
Yet you believe (and even spread) information presented online as truth
because it was published by CNN, even though no supporting documentation was
provided.

I never said anything about what I believed or didn't believe. I said
"according to." I thought the news item would be of interest to people here.

What I find interesting is that almost this entire thread is consumed by
dscussion of me and personal attacks against me, rather than discussion of the
news item that I posted. Whose fault is that?

It happens to you on every group you post to.


Hmmmmm.... (scratching head)

That's really strange. I mean, what are the odds??

--
************* DAVE HATUNEN ) *************
* Tucson Arizona, out where the cacti grow *
* My typos & mispellings are intentional copyright traps *

On Sun, 12 Aug 2007 01:27:02 +0200, Mxsmanic
wrote:

According to numbers released by the Bureau of Labor Statistics and CNN, being
a pilot is the second most dangerous occupation in the country (being a
fisherman is in first place).

Apparently "Flyers" moved up from third to second place since last
years CNN article.

http://money.cnn.com/2006/08/16/pf/2...jobs/index.htm

So CNN, which is it? Are we in second place or third place. Please
make up your mind.

Gattman writes:

The general public should continue to believe professional flying is
dangerous, and the danger should equate to better pay for professional
pilots.

Unfortunately, since the general public is aboard the same aircraft as the
pilots, danger for pilots equates to danger for passengers, and that isn't
good for commercial aviation. And the public cares nothing about what pilots
are paid, nor does it have any influence on their salaries.

Gig 601XL Builder writes:

Because as a licenced pilot he has at least a basic understanding of the
FARs.

How would that give him a basic understanding of the BLS?

KAE wrote:
On Sun, 12 Aug 2007 01:27:02 +0200, Mxsmanic
wrote:

According to numbers released by the Bureau of Labor Statistics and CNN, being
a pilot is the second most dangerous occupation in the country (being a
fisherman is in first place).

Apparently "Flyers" moved up from third to second place since last
years CNN article.

http://money.cnn.com/2006/08/16/pf/2...jobs/index.htm

So CNN, which is it? Are we in second place or third place. Please
make up your mind.

The BLS numbers are updated every year about this time.

The CNN article is just the usual breathless media hype with no
analysis of the data and an eye catching conclusion.

By far the "most dangerous" occupation by industry is construction,
but if you break it down to specific occupations such as brick layer,
electrician, etc. you find the specific rates aren't that high.

It is the same for aviation.

When you lump all commercial pilots together, the rate is high.

The BLS just breaks pilots down to two sub-groups; airline pilots,
which has a low rate, and all other commercial pilots, which has
a rate about three times higher.

Of course, all other commercial pilots includes crop dusters, Alaska
bush pilots, aerial fire fighters and other such high risk stuff
as well as the commuter stuff, so one would expect the rate to be
higher.

You also have to keep in mind that the total number of work-related
fatalities for the year was 5,702, which is everyone not in the
military, while the number of traffic deaths was 42,642.

So, on the average, you are about 7.5 times more likely go get
killed driving to and from the airport as you are flying.

And, if you concider there are about 300,000,000 people in the US,
your chance of getting killed in traffic is about 1 in 7000.

When you get down to the detail, life is actually pretty safe no
matter what you do for a living, at least as a civilian.

--
Jim Pennino

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"Dudley Henriques" wrote in message
...

I guess we went to different marketing schools :-)
If the general public feels professional flying is dangerous, my
experience as a professional pilot would indicate to me that the gain in
professional pay will be more than offset by the loss in customer revenue.

Yeah, you definately need to spin your statistics depending on the target.
(As virtually all businesses do.)

IE, firefighting, cropdusting, flight instruction, test piloting etc are
extremely dangerous but the airlines are safe. Similarly, cruise ships and
passenger ferryboat operations are statistically nowhere near as dangerous
as operating a fishing boat, but they all have a skipper.

I saw the report that this is about when it aired on TV. We paused report
(gotta love DVRs) and viewed it again just because I couldn't believe my
eyes. Let's see...it's more dangerous than firefighting, law enforcement,
kick boxing; naturally, though the statistic was backed by nothing
substantial.

-c

wrote in message
...

First, pilots aren't payed by the general public so for that part
what they believe is irrelevant.

Second, if the general public believes flying is dangerous, flying
goes down the tubes along with the pilot jobs.

Well, those are valid points but to the latter I'd reiterate what I told
Dudley, which is that statistics can demonstrate that passenger airline
service is still the safest way to travel. Commercial aviation should be
separated from Air Transport Piloting, but of course I understand I'm asking
a hell of a lot of the media statisticians and anti-GA types.

-c

Mxsmanic wrote:
Gig 601XL Builder writes:

Because as a licenced pilot he has at least a basic understanding of the
FARs.

How would that give him a basic understanding of the BLS?

Proficiency in reading the English language.


--
Jim Pennino

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Mxsmanic wrote in
:

Gattman writes:

The general public should continue to believe professional flying is
dangerous, and the danger should equate to better pay for
professional pilots.

Unfortunately, since the general public is aboard the same aircraft as
the pilots, danger for pilots equates to danger for passengers,


Then they should **** off and take the bus



Bertie