Mounting 396

OK, I have a 496, and an air gizmo mount, which I'd like to put on my
panel. I'm curious to the signoffs needed:

The Air gizmo I think should be allowed to be installed by the
owner/pilot as an interior decoration as long as it doesn't involve
drilling or cutting the panel. Correct? If I have to cut the panel or
drill holes, do I need an A&P signature? The W&B change is negligible I
believe.

In order to wire the power into the aircraft power (not through a cigar
lighter plug), I think I need an A&P signature, and all work has to
conform to 43.13, nothing more correct?

How about running extension wires for the XM USB and remote antenna to
the top of the glareshield with the wires behind the panel? I imagine
that needs an A&P sign-off if the wires are tie-wrapped into place?

OK, and the final question: It looks like in order to fit it in, I'll
need to pull the ancient Foster Loran and it's tray out. That's surely
going to need somebody's sign-off. Does that have to be pulled by an
avionics shop (it does have a connection to the autopilot switch), or
can that be done under an A&P's supervision and signature as well? I
figure I'll replace the Loran antenna with a comm antenna and leave the
end available on the panel for my handheld.

To make a long story short, see your local avionics shop for guidance. Each
FSDO is forming their own opinion on the Air Gizmos panel mounting
requirements and these opinions should be well-known to the avionics shops
of their respective jurisdictions.

Marco


"Ray Andraka" wrote in message
...
OK, I have a 496, and an air gizmo mount, which I'd like to put on my
panel. I'm curious to the signoffs needed:

The Air gizmo I think should be allowed to be installed by the owner/pilot
as an interior decoration as long as it doesn't involve drilling or
cutting the panel. Correct? If I have to cut the panel or drill holes,
do I need an A&P signature? The W&B change is negligible I believe.

In order to wire the power into the aircraft power (not through a cigar
lighter plug), I think I need an A&P signature, and all work has to
conform to 43.13, nothing more correct?

How about running extension wires for the XM USB and remote antenna to the
top of the glareshield with the wires behind the panel? I imagine that
needs an A&P sign-off if the wires are tie-wrapped into place?

OK, and the final question: It looks like in order to fit it in, I'll need
to pull the ancient Foster Loran and it's tray out. That's surely going
to need somebody's sign-off. Does that have to be pulled by an avionics
shop (it does have a connection to the autopilot switch), or can that be
done under an A&P's supervision and signature as well? I figure I'll
replace the Loran antenna with a comm antenna and leave the end available
on the panel for my handheld.

To make a long story short, see your local avionics shop for guidance. Each
FSDO is forming their own opinion on the Air Gizmos panel mounting
requirements and these opinions should be well-known to the avionics shops
of their respective jurisdictions.

This is quite true. We've got our 496 panel docked, and one avionics
shop (in Illinois) said we needed a 337 and a whole gob of paperwork
to install it.

Our other shop (located in Iowa) said all we needed was a signoff,
which they happily (and cheaply) did.

Different FSDOs apparently have different opinions, which means
different shops will charge HUGELY different amounts for the AirGizmo
installation. Shop around.
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

Jay Honeck wrote:
To make a long story short, see your local avionics shop for guidance. Each
FSDO is forming their own opinion on the Air Gizmos panel mounting
requirements and these opinions should be well-known to the avionics shops
of their respective jurisdictions.


This is quite true. We've got our 496 panel docked, and one avionics
shop (in Illinois) said we needed a 337 and a whole gob of paperwork
to install it.

Our other shop (located in Iowa) said all we needed was a signoff,
which they happily (and cheaply) did.

Different FSDOs apparently have different opinions, which means
different shops will charge HUGELY different amounts for the AirGizmo
installation. Shop around.
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"


Here in the Northeast, the FSDO will not approve an Air Gizmo at all,
and the avionics shop I talked to won't install it as a result. It
seems to me the airgizmo itself is a minor modification that shouldn't
be on a 337 at all, and perhaps that is why the FSDO is turning them
down. My local A&P/IA is of the opinion that it falls under the
category of decorative fixtures in the cabin, and can therefore be
signed off by the pilot/owner. I personally think that is stretching
it. Basically I want to get it installed legally enough that I won't
get a hassle about it down the line. If that takes getting a 337 then
so be it, I'll have to go somewhere else to get it installed then.

OK, forgetting about the panel dock for the moment, wiring a connector
and fuse for ship's power is an A&P sign-off isn't it? Same for
securing extension wires behind the panel with both ends left out for
access but not connected to anything on the aircraft electrical system.
If I went with a RAM mount, if it is a suction cup or clamp mount then
nothing is needed for the mount itself. If it is screwed to the
airframe, then its an A&P sign-off, right? Nothing here that goes to a
FSDO or needs a 337, I'm pretty sure. Someone jump in and correct me if
wrong.

So it seems the real issue is whether the panel dock itself requires a
337, since it seems none of the rest does if the GPS is put on a RAM
mount. Frankly, I don't see where a case could be made that the panel
dock needs a 337 when a ram mount doesn't, but then this is the FAA we
are talking about.

So the other thing was pulling out the Foster Loran. Does removal of
avionic equipment require an avionics shop, or can that be done by an A&P?

Ray Andraka wrote:


Here in the Northeast, the FSDO will not approve an Air Gizmo at all,
and the avionics shop I talked to won't install it as a result.


Why would they even ask FSDO in the first place? Don't they know how to
read?



It
seems to me the airgizmo itself is a minor modification that shouldn't
be on a 337 at all, and perhaps that is why the FSDO is turning them
down.


Bingo.

Newps writes:

Here in the Northeast, the FSDO will not approve an Air Gizmo at
all, and the avionics shop I talked to won't install it as a
result.

Why would they even ask FSDO in the first place? Don't they know
how to read?

Maybe because they are concerned about their livelihoods, should the
FSDO go after them for reading the regs differently than they do. The
usenet assurances of a pseudonymous "expert" won't serve as useful data.

- FChE

On Mon, 20 Aug 2007 16:00:17 -0400, Ray Andraka
wrote in :

Here in the Northeast, the FSDO will not approve an Air Gizmo at all,
and the avionics shop I talked to won't install it as a result.

Apparently Air Gizmo's products are not intended for installation in
certified aircraft:

http://www.airgizmos.com/paneldock.asp
All products on this site are intended for use on experimental
aircraft. Installation in a production aircraft may require an
FAA field approval. Copyright © 2005-2007, AirGizmos, LLC. All
Rights Reserved.

On Aug 21, 5:33 am, Larry Dighera wrote:
Here in the Northeast, the FSDO will not approve an Air Gizmo at all,
and the avionics shop I talked to won't install it as a result.

Apparently Air Gizmo's products are not intended for installation in
certified aircraft:

http://www.airgizmos.com/paneldock.asp
All products on this site are intended for use on experimental
aircraft. Installation in a production aircraft may require an
FAA field approval. Copyright © 2005-2007, AirGizmos, LLC. All
Rights Reserved.

Insurance company boilerplate. Lawyers dictating life, yet again.

Installing the AirGizmo is simplicity itself. It enhances flight
safety by removing the clutter from the cockpit, and makes the 496 a
much more usable tool. For the FAA to be doing anything but embracing
this innovative device shows precisely how stupid a government agency
can be.

But that's no surprise.

Ray, c'mon back to the Midwest, where common sense prevails. Any of a
dozen shops will install it for ya, properly, with an A&P sign-off and
logbook entry.
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

Jay Honeck wrote:



Insurance company boilerplate. Lawyers dictating life, yet again.

Installing the AirGizmo is simplicity itself. It enhances flight
safety by removing the clutter from the cockpit, and makes the 496 a
much more usable tool. For the FAA to be doing anything but embracing
this innovative device shows precisely how stupid a government agency
can be.

But that's no surprise.

Ray, c'mon back to the Midwest, where common sense prevails. Any of a
dozen shops will install it for ya, properly, with an A&P sign-off and
logbook entry.
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"



Jay, I will if that's what it takes. My first preference would be to
install it myself under supervision of my A&P. I just have to make sure
he's willing to sign it off rather than having me either not log it or
sign it off as owner/pilot, neither of which is acceptable to me.