Force feedback versus real piloting?

To all: Be advised that mxsmanic (Anthony Atkielski) is not a pilot and
never has been one.

In fact he has never flown in a small plane at all, or been at the
controls of anything other than a game.

He certainly doesn't know anything about avionics. His only connection to
flying is sitting in a chair and playing MSFS. This is his only reference
point to actual flying.

To all: Be advised that mxsmanic (Anthony Atkielski) is not a pilot and
never has been one. In fact he has never flown in a small plane at all, or
been at the
controls of anything other than a game.

He certainly doesn't know anything about avionics, let alone flying anything
from a Cessna 150 to an F-16 or anything in between.

I told you, one flies and the othr one sits there.

Well, we now know that Bertie is an engineer...

;-)
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

I've had trouble with motion sickness in slew mode on the sim. Then again,
I've had the same trouble with some video games, such as Doom. Apparently it
is quite common. If the movements on the screen exceed those of real life,
motion sickness is quite a risk. It obviously could still make someone sick
if the sim is showing motion that would make someone sick in real life.

Yeah, I used to play Quake (one of the early first-person shooters),
and could easily make myself nauseated by "running" through
buildings.

I never have the problem in the Kiwi when I'm flying, even when doing
aerobatics in an Extra 300 (Yes, Viperdoc, it's got your plane in it!
Actually Patty Wagstaff's, but I digress...). I have felt queasy
*watching* others fly, though, especially ham-fisted newbies who over-
control in all three axes...

We had one little girl puke when her dad (a non-pilot) simply could
NOT stop over-controlling the roll axis. Back, and forth, and back,
and forth, and...**urp**.
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

On Sun, 7 Oct 2007 17:05:07 +0000 (UTC), Bertie the Bunyip
wrote:

You're as qualified from flying those as would be some kid running around
with a dinky toy making airplane noises.

What if there's no toy, but he has his arms out and he's running
around the back yard? G

On Sun, 07 Oct 2007 09:42:29 -0700, Mike Granby
wrote:

I comment on this to his dad later, and we both
wondered if his sim training had giving him this skill...

I personally think PC sims are great for instrument training and
procedure practice. Note how the FAA allows certain non-motion sims
to be logged for IFR training and currency. There is some value
there.

It's the VFR flying and actual aircraft handling, like the transition
from an ILS approach to the hand-flown landing where the PC falls
short.

Since IFR has a large procedural component, sims can be of great
value.

I've tried MSFS with the Extra 300 model. Unfortunately, it came pretty
short. The roll and pitch rates were too slow, and not very responsive.

Also, much of acro is visceral, a sense of how hard you need to push or
pull, and this just doesn't across well with MSFS.

I have used it to practice approaches in the Baron, and it seems to be more
useful here. It was especially good in reviewing approaches in different
environments and locations.

I've tried MSFS with the Extra 300 model. Unfortunately, it came pretty
short. The roll and pitch rates were too slow, and not very responsive.

Hmmm... Next time you guys fly down we'll have to try it. With the
rudder pedals/yoke (no stick yet, sorry) set up, I can get the roll
rate of the Extra way beyond the point where I can tell which way is
up. The 104" screen is just a big, spinning blur...

It's hard to imagine the real deal being any faster, but you'll have
to be the judge of that...

Also, much of acro is visceral, a sense of how hard you need to push or
pull, and this just doesn't across well with MSFS.

Agreed. I've only flown aerobatics once, but it seemed to be mostly
"feel", with visual cues used to help you get the maneuver set up.
With no motion to provide G forces, MSFS is pretty useless for
simulating this kind of flying. (Although it IS fun...)

I'm sure with practice that feeling of "just hang on!" goes away
some....right?

I have used it to practice approaches in the Baron, and it seems to be more
useful here. It was especially good in reviewing approaches in different
environments and locations.

Yep, approaches, both VFR and IFR, are where MSFS really shines. It's
a great procedures trainer.
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

The :just hang on" goes away pretty quickly (it better!). I am far from
expert, but the airplane simply does what you want- if you over rotate on a
snap or roll, it isn't the plane that has the problem.

Jay Honeck wrote in news:1191785185.692659.24160
@v3g2000hsg.googlegroups.com:

I told you, one flies and the othr one sits there.

Well, we now know that Bertie is an engineer...


Bertie wishes.

Bertie