Cheap German gliding

No hourly fees for glider-usage, but any active member of the club
pays an all-inclusive price that covers ALL the winch launches and
ALL the flying time (at the moment 259 Euro/year).

That's significantly less than any "beginner to solo" package I have
ever seen. The total (fees plus the all-inclusive price) is also lower
than the annual fee at many clubs.
So, given that - after the fees - flying is essentially free, how do
you balance supply and demand? Time limits? Long queues on good days?

Bartek

On Mon, 08 Oct 2007 11:09:46 -0700, brtlmj wrote:

So, given that - after the fees - flying is essentially free, how do
you balance supply and demand? Time limits? Long queues on good days?

Yes - usually there's a time limit per flight, depending on the demand
on the glider in question (usually between on eand three hours). It's
seldom that not all of our gliders are in use.


Bye
Andreas

Andreas belongs to a WONDERFUL club in a beautiful part of Germany
(what part isn't beautiful?). It's in the Rhine valley, although it's
a few kilometers from the river, probably dozens. But it's almost
surrounded by vineyards. Riesling, mostly, I guess.

Of course, I haven't been there in WAY TOO LONG, but my memories are
nothing but the fondest.

Duties for this club member were to help other students launch and
retrieve gliders. We did it all by manual labor, no golf carts or
tractors or cars to go retrieve the Ka7 that landed long down the
runway. Just a bunch of kids getting their daily workout of pushing
the glider back. There was kitchen duty for some members too. I
don't know where this club got all their members, but the ones in the
kitchen knew how to make GREAT meals. They took one look at me and
"allowed" me in the kitchen only once.

Time restrictions on a glider? I don't remember being told, but I do
know when I was flying the K8 or the Standard Astir, there was usually
nobody else waiting, and I could fly as long as I wanted. If anyone
complained, I never knew about it.

I know the knowledgeable members did maintenance on everything, from
the winch to the towplane to the gliders and to the clubhouse. I
always thought the club was pretty self-sufficient. Once, I wondered
why the clubhouse had an "electic" shape. Not square or rectangular,
but many-sided with a lot of glass. I was told the large picture
windows were donated and they built the club house to make use of the
big glass. Oh, it was great!

The club probably made some money on the meals they served, with the
largest meal served Saturday nights and a large meal offered on
Sunday's at noon. Also, they served cake and coffee around 1600 hrs
on Saturday and Sunday. The club did not operate during the week.

As previously mentioned, we payed yearly dues which covered the costs
of winching and flying. Only aero tows were extra. Since I launched
mainly with the winch, I didn't have to pay much extra. This was
during the mid 1980's, when the dollar to Mark hit a high of 3.47:1, I
think. You don't want to know how much an LS4 with a Cobra would have
cost in dollars.

Yea, I'm sure a winch would help our club reduce it's costs. Wish we
had a good one! With a good Lepo!

Ray Lovinggood
Carrboro, North Carolina, USA
Former Member, DJK Segelfluggemeinschaft, Landau

On Oct 8, 5:41 pm, Andreas Maurer wrote:
On Mon, 08 Oct 2007 11:09:46 -0700, brtlmj wrote:
So, given that - after the fees - flying is essentially free, how do
you balance supply and demand? Time limits? Long queues on good days?

Yes - usually there's a time limit per flight, depending on the demand
on the glider in question (usually between on eand three hours). It's
seldom that not all of our gliders are in use.

Bye
Andreas

On Tue, 09 Oct 2007 06:31:47 -0700, rlovinggood
wrote:



Ray Lovinggood
Carrboro, North Carolina, USA
Former Member, DJK Segelfluggemeinschaft, Landau


Hi Ray,

things haven't changed at all (apart from the fact that nowadays we
host several private gliders and have plenty of flying during the
week).
The club house has grown considerably (we needed more room - and
finally could afford to buy new windows!), the quality of the meals
still depends on the cook (are they are made by 16-year-olds or a
professional cook... err... wive...).

When did you say you come to Europe again?

Bye
Andreas

Yes - usually there's a time limit per flight, depending on the demand
on the glider in question (usually between one and three hours).

Not bad. How many flights can a club member expect to get on a typical
soarable Saturday?

Bartek

On Tue, 09 Oct 2007 08:57:40 -0700, brtlmj wrote:

Yes - usually there's a time limit per flight, depending on the demand
on the glider in question (usually between one and three hours).

Not bad. How many flights can a club member expect to get on a typical
soarable Saturday?

One.
Wich is as long as his comrades allow.

Student pilots who still fly with an instructor typically get between
one and three flights on a Saturday.



Bye
Andreas

I started flying and got my license in the Netherlands. Pretty much the same story as already stated by many others above. Around 1994, 600Euro's per year, no launch charges (except for aero tow), no hourly charges, 40 work hours mandatory per year.
Morning sessions were training sessions with 1 hour max, Afternoon sessions were XC with revolving allocation of the XC fleet.
On a good day I managed to get 5 launches in. The first 4 early in the morning training sled rides. The 5th often after noon when the lift started.
I did around 100 take-off per year. (my currency was much better then it is now)

There was only 1 commercial operator in the Netherlands. All clubs were supported by the military in the far past. They got winches and fuel and other military surplus. (like start line vehicle) Some clubs are still mixed public /military clubs.
Reason for the military support: The Dutch airforce recruited many of the kids with good elementary flying skills.
Many clubs are still located at military (or ex-military) bases. The subsidies are pretty much gone I think, but there is still the advantage of closed airfield, guarded parking maybe even a donated jerrycan of diesel for the winch.

I now fly in California at lets say "an increased spending level"
But then, for a flatlander flying over Lake Tahoe remains a special experience.

Hans Van Weersch