Way off topic, but it has do to with the French

Jay Honeck schrieb:
Or do you
think that by visiting three cities in the US you now "know" America better
than if you had actually spent time in school *studying* American history?

Yes, I do. Else I'd still think that you are alltogether ignorant idiots
- like many people think here about Americans. So now I only think that
- as everywhere else - only a minority are ignorant idiots, but one
hears not too much of the other folks with a clue.

It's just like in this group: one reads too much from you and one might
think that all here are like you.

Besides it was more than 3 cities. But as you have not answered my
question I am sure that you never have been abroad and that you don't
hold a valid passport. It's typically for your ignorance that you try to
insult if you're out of arguments.

My only hope is that your kids are different and that they sometime try
to search for their names, so they will find your postings on this group
and they hopefully will see what an ignorant you are. You said your son
makes a trip to spain (?): hopefully he get's an idea of how things work
"in the rest of the world".

#m

On 2008-03-06, Martin Hotze wrote:
Yes, I do. Else I'd still think that you are alltogether ignorant idiots
- like many people think here about Americans.

Quite frankly, I don't care whether the rest of the world thinks well of
Americans as a whole or not. Perhaps that's because I got tired of such
things as the London newspaper's famous headline after George W. Bush's
reelection. Any candidate who puts other countries' opinion of the US ahead
of our own national interests, such as Kerry, is a candidate who I will
never support.
--
Jay Maynard, K5ZC http://www.conmicro.com
http://jmaynard.livejournal.com http://www.tronguy.net
http://www.hercules-390.org (Yes, that's me!)
Buy Hercules stuff at http://www.cafepress.com/hercules-390

Yes, I do. Else I'd still think that you are alltogether ignorant idiots -
like many people think here about Americans. So now I only think that - as
everywhere else - only a minority are ignorant idiots, but one hears not
too much of the other folks with a clue.

I wish my father was still alive, so his generation could come over there
and kick your asses -- again. Oh, wait -- we "rescued" Austria from the
Nazis... Right.

My only hope is that your kids are different and that they sometime try to
search for their names, so they will find your postings on this group and
they hopefully will see what an ignorant you are. You said your son makes
a trip to spain (?): hopefully he get's an idea of how things work "in the
rest of the world".

Yep, Joe's going to Spain in a couple of weeks. He will be living with a
family there for the better part of two weeks, completely immersed in
Spanish culture. It should be a great experience for him.

That said, I've been amazed at what his school has been teaching him in
advance of this trip. The dire warnings against doing things that are
considered to be entirely innocuous and normal here fall somewhere between
scary and appalling. They've even gone so far as to tell our kids not to
bring t-shirts with American flags on them, lest they be seen as people who
are proud of their country of origin. (Apparently to the
less-than-self-confident Europeans, this would be seen as an affront?)

Interestingly, we've all told Joe that we want Spanish-flag t-shirts as
souvenirs. We might even wear them. Shocking!

Due to budget constraints, the kids will also be riding those infamous
subways around Madrid -- something we are less than happy about. I trust
that since the Spanish Army fled Iraq after the last round of subway
bombings, my kid will be entirely safe. Not!

As for our passport status, yep, we've got 'em. But I don't foolishly
believe that by visiting a few tourist attractions in a country that I will
"know" it any better than if I had paid attention in school. Hell, I've
spent almost fifty years exploring the Northern Hemisphere from
coast-to-coast, and STILL don't "know" it.
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

Jay Honeck wrote:
They've even gone so far as to tell our kids not to
bring t-shirts with American flags on them, lest they be seen as people who
are proud of their country of origin. (Apparently to the
less-than-self-confident Europeans, this would be seen as an affront?)

In my experience of current european perspective, I think they would like the
confidence to know their spanish bus will not be blown up cuz there is an
american nationalist on it.

--
Message posted via AviationKB.com
http://www.aviationkb.com/Uwe/Forums...ation/200803/1

On 2008-03-06, Jay Honeck wrote:
Due to budget constraints, the kids will also be riding those infamous
subways around Madrid -- something we are less than happy about. I trust
that since the Spanish Army fled Iraq after the last round of subway
bombings, my kid will be entirely safe. Not!

Hold on.. I didn't think you bought into this whole 'terrist' lets all
be terrified all the time bravo-sierra.

More people die in traffic accidents in a month in Spain than have died
in Madrid metro bombings in the last 10 years. As a pilot, you should
know better than this, and to get your risk assessments in proportion!

Travelling on the metro in Spain is probably two orders of magnitude
than taking your son flying in a light plane. I find it odd that you're
fretting about this.

--
From the sunny Isle of Man.
Yes, the Reply-To email address is valid.

Travelling on the metro in Spain is probably two orders of magnitude
than taking your son flying in a light plane. I find it odd that you're
fretting about this.

Oh, hell -- I wouldn't be letting him go to Spain if I was really worried.
I'm sure he'll be fine, as long as he can remember how to ask where the
bathroom is...

;-)

But I *do* find it aggravating and disconcerting that he's had to attend not
one, but THREE separate 2-hour classes on "how to behave in Spain" -- and
those instructions include basically hiding the fact that the kids are
American.
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

"Jay Honeck" wrote in
news:BLnAj.13119$TT4.1674@attbi_s22:

Travelling on the metro in Spain is probably two orders of magnitude
than taking your son flying in a light plane. I find it odd that
you're fretting about this.

Oh, hell -- I wouldn't be letting him go to Spain if I was really
worried. I'm sure he'll be fine, as long as he can remember how to ask
where the bathroom is...


Well, that should be a piece of cake, but he'll probably tel them to clean
it by mistake out of force of habit.


Bertie

Jay Honeck schrieb:
Travelling on the metro in Spain is probably two orders of magnitude
than taking your son flying in a light plane. I find it odd that you're
fretting about this.

Oh, hell -- I wouldn't be letting him go to Spain if I was really worried.
I'm sure he'll be fine, as long as he can remember how to ask where the
bathroom is...

there are some basic differences as Europeans (not all, I'm
generalising) tend to be not so we-wee about sex etc, so we don't ask
for a bathroom (the bathroom is for taking a shower or brushing your
teeth etc.) but for the toilet (or other words to that effect). So there
might come the situation for your son where he is confronted with things
in public he might not see in the US like an openly displayed female
nude breast in advertising, nudity on TV before 8pm, breastfeeding in a
bus, etc. - I have no idea how you handle these things these days or
what changed in the last 5 years.
Not that we are all little perverts, but Europeans _tend_ to be more
open in these matters (generalising, again). Of course it might be the
case that he'll live in a rather conservative family and he might be
confronted with rather weired or old-fashioned views.

;-)

But I *do* find it aggravating and disconcerting that he's had to attend not
one, but THREE separate 2-hour classes on "how to behave in Spain" -- and
those instructions include basically hiding the fact that the kids are
American.

hm, who gave the instructions? People from Spain?

#m

there are some basic differences as Europeans (not all, I'm generalising)
tend to be not so we-wee about sex etc, so we don't ask for a bathroom
(the bathroom is for taking a shower or brushing your teeth etc.) but for
the toilet (or other words to that effect). So there might come the
situation for your son where he is confronted with things in public he
might not see in the US like an openly displayed female nude breast in
advertising, nudity on TV before 8pm, breastfeeding in a bus, etc.

Thanks for the tips. I know Joe is hoping to see all those liberal European
women gallivanting around Spain with their breasts exposed -- but I told him
not to get his hopes up.

Conversely, at the orientation meeting we attended the girls were told in NO
uncertain terms not to "dress like you do here" because Spanish boys have an
"interesting" idea of what American girls are like. In other words, they
think they're all "loose" because of what they've seen in Hollywood
movies...

But I *do* find it aggravating and disconcerting that he's had to attend
not one, but THREE separate 2-hour classes on "how to behave in Spain" --
and those instructions include basically hiding the fact that the kids
are American.

hm, who gave the instructions? People from Spain?

Nope, the chaperones -- who between the three of them have been to Spain
over 30 times in the last 15 years.
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

Jay Honeck schrieb:
there are some basic differences as Europeans (not all, I'm generalising)
tend to be not so we-wee about sex etc, so we don't ask for a bathroom
(the bathroom is for taking a shower or brushing your teeth etc.) but for
the toilet (or other words to that effect). So there might come the
situation for your son where he is confronted with things in public he
might not see in the US like an openly displayed female nude breast in
advertising, nudity on TV before 8pm, breastfeeding in a bus, etc.

Thanks for the tips. I know Joe is hoping to see all those liberal European
women gallivanting around Spain with their breasts exposed -- but I told him
not to get his hopes up.

well, it all ends up in stereotypes (as you wrote below about spanish
men). Spain (hm, it depends heavily on the area where he is in Spain; it
is a rather small country in your terms, but it has many different
cultural areas, besides the differences living in a city or on the
country or close to the beach with heavy tourism) as a southern country
is for sure more relaxed than northern countries (compared to Florida
and states in the north) - it is (remember, I'm generalising!) a more
easy-living, taking it more relaxed, etc.
But there aren't Spanish girls walking around topless everywhere. You
might see that on the beaches (this is nothing really special beeing
topless at the beach). But there are also strict rules like for walking
into churches (don't do it with shorts etc.) etc..

Conversely, at the orientation meeting we attended the girls were told in NO
uncertain terms not to "dress like you do here" because Spanish boys have an
"interesting" idea of what American girls are like. In other words, they
think they're all "loose" because of what they've seen in Hollywood
movies...

as above, everybody loves to feed his stereotypes. What most see here is
what they 'learn' from the TV-soaps, and then many take it for ganted
that Americans are the same like the folks in TV-soaps. :-)
But the spanish climate for sure opens your mind and it is easier for
some close encounters (oh well, I remember some beach nights on a
Spanish beach ... hmmmm ... yummie ... those where the days ...).

One of the - IMHO - biggest differences between USA and Europe are the
topics of discussions (again, generalising, bear that in mind!):
in the USA it is OK to talk about:
- job, salaries, cost of your house, ...
and not so OK:
- family, health, religion, sex, ...
in Europe one does not want to talk about salaries, but it is easier to
talk about more private things. Also sex is seen more open minded. Don't
talk about politics if you don't really have a good knowing about
details and if you are good in real discussions, you easily may find
people who are fit in US politics. Talkink about politics is not a no-no
itself.
(So) it is harder to make friendship in Europe, but once you made
friendship it is a real friendship where you can talk about everything.

It might sound harsh, but the _stereotypes_ are this way: Tell your son
that he should not walk around as "hey, I'm American, you're nothing!"
but more as "Hey, I know you might have a bad picture about us
Americans, but I'm here to see and try to understand your point of
view". Hope you get the idea (he still can think whatever he wants, but
presenting him the other way makes these 2 weeks easier for him). And he
should try to speak Spanish, at least for a greeting and a good bye. He
might be offered a cheek for a welcome-kiss and/or a big hug. This might
be disturbing for him, especially after 20 hours or so en-route with
7(?) hours time difference.

#m