I give up, after many, many years!

In rec.aviation.piloting Mxsmanic wrote:
writes:

That sensation tells you that you are coordinated, which is the point.

No, it does not. Other things can produce the same sensation. You have no
way of knowing which movement produced the sensation unless you cross-check
against instruments or the world outside the window.

What part of you must spend as much time as possible looking out the
window in VFR are you failing to understand?

The choices are NOT

a) Stare out the window
b) Stare at the panel
c) Fly blindfolded.

I take back everything I ever said about you being intelligent with
psychological issues.

You are an idiot with psychological issues.


The sensation in real airplanes allows you to fly more precisely and
safer.

The sensation in real airplanes gives some pilots a false sense of security.

Yet another blazingly stupid comment that shows you know nothing about real
flight.

A blazingly stupid comment that shows you know nothing about real
flight.

I'll ask again: Can you fly safely with your eyes closed, relying only on
sensations, and selectively ignoring or accepting the sensations you feel?

What part of you must spend as much time as possible looking out the
window in VFR are you failing to understand?

The choices are NOT

a) Stare out the window
b) Stare at the panel
c) Fly blindfolded.

It only takes a couple of hours in a real airplane to learn to interpret
what they are and what they mean.

Sometimes it takes an accident to learn that you can't trust those sensations.

Yet another blazingly stupid comment that shows you know nothing about real
flight.

That's not what the "literature" says.

That's exactly what it says. Trust your instruments, ignore your sensations.

Yet another blazingly stupid comment that shows you know nothing about real
flight.


--
Jim Pennino

Remove .spam.sux to reply.

A blazingly stupid comment that shows you know nothing about real
flight.

I'll ask again: Can you fly safely with your eyes closed, relying only on
sensations, and selectively ignoring or accepting the sensations you
feel?

What part of you must spend as much time as possible looking out the
window in VFR are you failing to understand?

You guys are hilariously arguing right past each other. MX is arguing that
you can't fly in IMC ("with your eyes closed") by the seat of your pants --
which is 100% correct.

You, on the other hand, jrespond by arguing that of COURSE you can fly by
the seat of your pants, if only you look out the window!

God almighty, keep it up -- it's "Who's on first" all over again, and some
pretty damned good Saturday night entertainment!

:-)
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

On May 17, 6:37 pm, "Jay Honeck" wrote:
A blazingly stupid comment that shows you know nothing about real
flight.

I'll ask again: Can you fly safely with your eyes closed, relying only on
sensations, and selectively ignoring or accepting the sensations you
feel?

What part of you must spend as much time as possible looking out the
window in VFR are you failing to understand?

You guys are hilariously arguing right past each other. MX is arguing that
you can't fly in IMC ("with your eyes closed") by the seat of your pants --
which is 100% correct.
You, on the other hand, jrespond by arguing that of COURSE you can fly by
the seat of your pants, if only you look out the window!
God almighty, keep it up -- it's "Who's on first" all over again, and some
pretty damned good Saturday night entertainment!
:-)

After doing a weird manuever, it's hard to tell if you're
in a banking turn or a spiral dive, that's how I learned.
Maybe a good pilot could use VFR as a ref, but I was
clued in by my IAS needle going into yellow.

I was a fairly good gymnast, so my orientational
skills are likely a bit better than average.
Ken

On May 18, 1:59*pm, "Ken S. Tucker" wrote:
On May 17, 6:37 pm, "Jay Honeck" wrote:





A blazingly stupid comment that shows you know nothing about real
flight.

I'll ask again: Can you fly safely with your eyes closed, relying only on
sensations, and selectively ignoring or accepting the sensations you
feel?

What part of you must spend as much time as possible looking out the
window in VFR are you failing to understand?

You guys are hilariously arguing right past each other. * MX is arguing that
you can't fly in IMC ("with your eyes closed") by the seat of your pants --
which is 100% correct.
You, on the other hand, jrespond by arguing that of COURSE you can fly by
the seat of your pants, if only you look out the window!
God almighty, keep it up -- it's "Who's on first" all over again, and some
pretty damned good Saturday night entertainment!
:-)

After doing a weird manuever, it's hard to tell if you're
in a banking turn or a spiral dive, that's how I learned.
Maybe a good pilot could use VFR as a ref, but I was
clued in by my IAS needle going into yellow.


BS! In VFR the position of the horizon tells you the difference. In
many planes there is no AH 'cos you don't need it for VFR!
The engine noise also tells you if you are descending or climging.

Cheers

On May 17, 8:33 pm, More_Flaps wrote:
On May 18, 1:59 pm, "Ken S. Tucker" wrote:
....
After doing a weird manuever, it's hard to tell if you're
in a banking turn or a spiral dive, that's how I learned.
Maybe a good pilot could use VFR as a ref, but I was
clued in by my IAS needle going into yellow.

BS! In VFR the position of the horizon tells you the difference. In
many planes there is no AH 'cos you don't need it for VFR!
The engine noise also tells you if you are descending or climging.
Cheers

What you say is true, for a good experienced pilot,
who have flown disorientation exersizes.
But I'll provide this challenge, block off the speedometer
in your car and I'll bet you'll have a problem driving.
What happens to me is I drift up to 80 MPH, then
go "holy poop".
Ken

"Ken S. Tucker" wrote in news:becc28f3-ebc0-4793-
:

On May 17, 8:33 pm, More_Flaps wrote:
On May 18, 1:59 pm, "Ken S. Tucker" wrote:
...
After doing a weird manuever, it's hard to tell if you're
in a banking turn or a spiral dive, that's how I learned.
Maybe a good pilot could use VFR as a ref, but I was
clued in by my IAS needle going into yellow.

BS! In VFR the position of the horizon tells you the difference. In
many planes there is no AH 'cos you don't need it for VFR!
The engine noise also tells you if you are descending or climging.
Cheers

What you say is true, for a good experienced pilot,
who have flown disorientation exersizes.
But I'll provide this challenge, block off the speedometer
in your car and I'll bet you'll have a problem driving.
What happens to me is I drift up to 80 MPH, then
go "holy poop".
Ken

BULL ****.

There are only 3 required flight instruments. An AH is NOT one of them.
Many people learned to fly without an AH or DG. They were students, not
experienced pilots.

You are just as big an asshole as Anthony.

On May 18, 3:46*pm, "Ken S. Tucker" wrote:
On May 17, 8:33 pm, More_Flaps wrote:

On May 18, 1:59 pm, "Ken S. Tucker" wrote:
...
After doing a weird manuever, it's hard to tell if you're
in a banking turn or a spiral dive, that's how I learned.
Maybe a good pilot could use VFR as a ref, but I was
clued in by my IAS needle going into yellow.

BS! In VFR the position of the horizon tells you the difference. In
many planes there is no AH 'cos you don't need it for VFR!
The engine noise also tells you if you are descending or climging.
Cheers

What you say is true, for a good experienced pilot,
who have flown disorientation exersizes.
But I'll provide this challenge, block off the speedometer
in your car and I'll bet you'll have a problem driving.
What happens to me is I drift up to 80 MPH, then
go "holy poop".

As a matter of fact, during training my instructor regularly blanked
off the ASI in the circuit and yet I still managed to trim to the
correct final approach speed to within 4 knots (as revealed when the
papaer was removed). Explain that -and no I'm not a very gifted
pilot...

Cheers

On May 18, 1:03*am, WingFlaps wrote:

As *a matter of fact, during training my instructor regularly blanked
off the ASI in the circuit and yet I still managed to trim to the
correct final approach speed to within 4 knots (as revealed when the
papaer was removed). Explain that -and no I'm not a very gifted
pilot...

Very good excercise IMHO.

Friend of mine posted in these forums that the pitot tube ingested a
bug. While he may have had better odds hitting the lottery, things
happen IN FLIGHT.

On May 18, 6:03 pm, WingFlaps wrote:

As a matter of fact, during training my instructor regularly blanked
off the ASI in the circuit and yet I still managed to trim to the
correct final approach speed to within 4 knots (as revealed when the
papaer was removed). Explain that -and no I'm not a very gifted
pilot...

Power setting and attitude ?

On Sat, 17 May 2008 20:46:40 -0700 (PDT), "Ken S. Tucker"
wrote:

What you say is true, for a good experienced pilot,
who have flown disorientation exersizes.
But I'll provide this challenge, block off the speedometer
in your car and I'll bet you'll have a problem driving.
What happens to me is I drift up to 80 MPH, then
go "holy poop".

I disagree totally. You must be numb.

Both of my vehicles sound, feel, and act significantly different at 80
than they do at 65 MPH. In top gear of my Toyota, the RPM's are about
400 higher. On the same token, It's not all that difficult to tell
25 from 35, if I try.

The wind noise is different, the tach shows a different RPM, and the
corresponding engine pitch is noticeably different.

Back to the pilot...

The _change_ in sounds is a great clue, not just that it's all
different and steady.