I give up, after many, many years!

Michael wrote in
:

On May 22, 8:12*pm, "Jay Honeck" wrote:
This is the most cogent explanation yet of MX's power over some of
the regulars here. *It perfectly explains how he -- a known non-pilot
-- is
able
to throw many known pilots into apoplectic fits simply by posting a
few relatively innocuous comments.

You know, MX is simply the far end of the curve. I've seen lots of
students/potential students here asking questions. It was far from
rare that they got incomplete, internally inconsistent, and otherwise
problematic replies - almost invariably from certificated pilots.
Those that had the temerity to question the reply caught ****. I
guess they decided it wasn't worthwhile sticking around - they would
find out what they needed from their instructors and other pilots at
the airport. The sad thing is, these days that's likely not a bad
bet. The average quality of the discussion here has degenerated to
the point that it isn't any better than it is at the airport lounge -
and the airport lounge is a good deal more civil.

MX doesn't have that option, so he deals with usenet as it is. Here's
how I see it. He asks questions that are, for the most part, entirely
reasonable and on-topic. He gets a variety of replies, and the
majority are incomplete, internally inconsistent, and/or contradict
other sources. He points out the incompleteness, internal
inconsistency, and contradiction. He argues that the reply must be
wrong (often correctly). (Some of) the people who responded to him in
the first place take umbrage at this - how dare he, a non-pilot,
question their 'superior' knowledge. They become abusive, and he
becomes abusive in return - though I must say he generally gives just
a little less than he gets.

It's pretty sad - handled correctly, these could be discussions that
would be educational for many. It's always useful to examine what you
think you know from a different perspective, and MX provides an
interesting one. But what I've found is that as usenet became
progressively less academic, the number of people interested in having
their views challenged and examined, and of looking at what they think
they know from a different perspective has shrunk to where they are a
very small minority. Too bad - that's the only way you ever get to
really understand anything.

Since you're on a roll, I'd love to hear your theories about Bertie.
*To
me,
he is twice the mystery of MX, since he's obviously a real (or, at
least, former) pilot -- yet he has an apparently irresistable urge to
troll the group.

That's a tougher one. MX has a somewhat rational motivation - to
learn more about aviation without subjecting himself to the risk and
expense of actually flying an aircraft. That makes him unusual here.
Most of us have much fuzzier motivations. For example, what's my
motivation? In a sense, I'm a troll too. I tell people things
(usually about aviation, but in this thread about the aviation groups)
that they don't particularly want to hear. I used to think I was
actually teaching some people things they might need to know to get
some utility out of their flying and survive the experience by
dispelling some dangerous myths, but it gets harder and harder to
believe that with every year. So why do I bother? I used to get
intelligent and thoughtful people who would intelligently and
thoughtfully argue with my positions, thus helping me clarify,
correct, and solidify them, or occasionally discard some, but I don't
really get that anymore either. It's a lot of effort to argue that
way, and the people who were interested in making the effort are
mostly gone from here. So what do I get out of being here? I think
I'm mostly still here out of inertia - the way you will keep going
someplace you've been going for many years, even though it has changed
and the things that drew you there in the first place are all gone. I
think Bertie is sort of in the same boat, but there is an interesting
difference.

You see, despite all my certificates and ratings, I am fundamentally a
private pilot. I don't fly for a living, and though I do occasionally
make a few bucks doing aviation odd jobs (instructing, ferrying
airplanes, etc.) that's mostly because I think it's fun, and the
pocket money is just a bonus. I suspect that Bertie, like most
airline pilots, has a fundamental contempt for most private pilots.



Moi? Nope. I don;'t have contempt for private pilots at all. I am,
primarily, an amateur who hapens to make his living doing it too. i have
contempt for the ignorant, though. And by the ignorant, I mean that in
the truest sense of the word. Those who do not want to know...

I got my ATP.
I tell you this to give you some insight into the way Bertie probably
thinks of those who populate this group, and to somewhat explain why
he feels his rudeness is acceptable.


You might notice I;m not rude to more than a select few and they, quite
literally, ask for it.


Bertie

Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
i have
contempt for the ignorant, though. And by the ignorant, I mean that in
the truest sense of the word. Those who do not want to know...
....
You might notice I;m not rude to more than a select few and they, quite
literally, ask for it.

Find a dictionary. Look up the definition of "literally". It doesn't mean
what you think it means.

You don't strike me as the sort of person who engages in self-contempt,
though. You are probably just confused by your own motivations and
rationalizations.

Jim Logajan wrote in
:

Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
i have
contempt for the ignorant, though. And by the ignorant, I mean that
in the truest sense of the word. Those who do not want to know...
...
You might notice I;m not rude to more than a select few and they,
quite literally, ask for it.

Find a dictionary. Look up the definition of "literally". It doesn't
mean what you think it means.


Oh it means exactly what I think it means. And I meant exactly what I
said.

You don't strike me as the sort of person who engages in
self-contempt, though. You are probably just confused by your own
motivations and rationalizations.


Mebbe, but I doubt it. In any case, I'm not rationalising.



Bertie

Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
Jim Logajan wrote in
:

Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
i have
contempt for the ignorant, though. And by the ignorant, I mean that
in the truest sense of the word. Those who do not want to know...
...
You might notice I;m not rude to more than a select few and they,
quite literally, ask for it.

Find a dictionary. Look up the definition of "literally". It doesn't
mean what you think it means.


Oh it means exactly what I think it means. And I meant exactly what I
said.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ilvy7Ob6fZ0

I think you made the common mistake of using "literally" when you meant
"figuratively". But maybe you didn't just totally futz that up and can show
me to be pathetically wrong. All you have to do is provide, say, a Google
Groups archive link to a message where some ignoramous posted to
rec.aviation.piloting and literally asked you to be rude to them. Of course
I'll be kind and not ask for proof that you got "literal" requests from
everyone you've been rude to (e.g. "Mxsmanic", Jay Honeck, "Maxwell", and
whoever else you rag on.)

"Bertie the Bunyip" wrote in message
...


You might notice I;m not rude to more than a select few and they, quite
literally, ask for it.


Bertie

And you lie as fast as you can type.

"Maxwell" luv2^fly99@cox.^net wrote in news:X0l%j.24$U_5.15
@newsfe15.lga:


"Bertie the Bunyip" wrote in message
...


You might notice I;m not rude to more than a select few and they,
quite
literally, ask for it.


Bertie

And you lie as fast as you can type.




Ask and you shall receive...



Bertie

"Bertie the Bunyip" wrote in message
...


And you lie as fast as you can type.




Ask and you shall receive...



Bertie

I didn't ask for anything dumbass. Are you stoned again?

"Maxwell" luv2^fly99@cox.^net wrote in news:NSl%j.36$U_5.8
@newsfe15.lga:


"Bertie the Bunyip" wrote in message
...


And you lie as fast as you can type.




Ask and you shall receive...



Bertie

I didn't ask for anything dumbass.


Oh yes you did! Don't worry about it though. You're incapable of seeing
that so don't let it bother your pointy head.

Are you stoned again?




Nope.

Oh, and BTW, everyone can see it but you. Therein lies the beauty...


Bertie

"Bertie the Bunyip" wrote in message
.. .

Nope.

Oh, and BTW, everyone can see it but you. Therein lies the beauty...


Bertie

Lame and incorrect again, F.

"Maxwell" luv2^fly99@cox.^net wrote in news:7zm%j.57$kR5.16
@newsfe24.lga:


"Bertie the Bunyip" wrote in message
.. .

Nope.

Oh, and BTW, everyone can see it but you. Therein lies the beauty...


Bertie

Lame and incorrect again, F.




Nope. What is that someonw wiht boken glasses?


Bertie