History Channel

Talking about "The Sound Barrier" as a work of fiction showing the British
achieving supersonic flight, I seem to recall reading/hearing somewhere that
in actual fact the British were well advanced in researching this and had
designed and built an aeroplane - the Miles M52 I think - which could well
have achieved this. Then the US and British Governments decided they would
pool their research to achieve it. So the British handed over all their
info to the US who then refused to hand over their info, due to "security
reasons". The British did not proceed any further but the US continued on
(now with the benefit of all the British research and design) and eventually
produce the Bell X-1 - which looks suspiciously like the Miles M52 - and do
the deed!





For military movie fiction you can't "The Sound Barrier"
showing the British being the first to achieve supersonic
flight.


I remember seeing "The Sound Barrier" in the year of its release, and my
memories of it stretch back that far. If you have access to a VHS or DVD
home version, please correct me ... but ... the film presents a
disclaimer
that it is a piece of fiction, and if despite that it seems more truthful
than most works of fiction then that may be due to the skill of the
director, David Lean; it was acknowledged in the film that the sound
barrier
had already been overcome by an American aviator, without, as I remember,
any mention being made that the American aircraft was not jet- but
rocket-powered; and the whole thing is really about Geoffrey de
Havilland's
fatal semi-success in the DH 108 Swallow, when he tickled Mach 1 but
didn't
survive.

--
Moving things in still pictures!

"Graham Sheldon" wrote in message
...
Talking about "The Sound Barrier" as a work of fiction showing the
British achieving supersonic flight, I seem to recall reading/hearing
somewhere that in actual fact the British were well advanced in
researching this and had designed and built an aeroplane - the Miles M52 I
think - which could well have achieved this. Then the US and British
Governments decided they would pool their research to achieve it. So the
British handed over all their info to the US who then refused to hand over
their info, due to "security reasons". The British did not proceed any
further but the US continued on (now with the benefit of all the British
research and design) and eventually produce the Bell X-1 - which looks
suspiciously like the Miles M52 - and do the deed!

Yes that was the case. The British were PROMISED
all the data and designs gained by US experiments
in this field, but wonder of wonders the British
got NOTHING.

Graham Sheldon wrote:
Talking about "The Sound Barrier" as a work of fiction showing the British
achieving supersonic flight, I seem to recall reading/hearing somewhere that
in actual fact the British were well advanced in researching this and had
designed and built an aeroplane - the Miles M52 I think - which could well
have achieved this. Then the US and British Governments decided they would
pool their research to achieve it. So the British handed over all their
info to the US who then refused to hand over their info, due to "security
reasons". The British did not proceed any further but the US continued on
(now with the benefit of all the British research and design) and eventually
produce the Bell X-1 - which looks suspiciously like the Miles M52 - and do
the deed!

Sounds a bit like the atomic bomb development with Britain and Canada
having been major contributors, then being told to p*ss off by the Yanks.

The British, using Canadian uranium and plutonium and the worlds largest
stockpile of heavy water and hydro-electric power, had actually done the
majority of the leg-work already, leaving the American-funded Manhatten
Project to do the rest.

President Truman the reneged on FDR's promise to Churchill to share the
atom bombs.



For military movie fiction you can't "The Sound Barrier"
showing the British being the first to achieve supersonic
flight.

I remember seeing "The Sound Barrier" in the year of its release, and my
memories of it stretch back that far. If you have access to a VHS or DVD
home version, please correct me ... but ... the film presents a
disclaimer
that it is a piece of fiction, and if despite that it seems more truthful
than most works of fiction then that may be due to the skill of the
director, David Lean; it was acknowledged in the film that the sound
barrier
had already been overcome by an American aviator, without, as I remember,
any mention being made that the American aircraft was not jet- but
rocket-powered; and the whole thing is really about Geoffrey de
Havilland's
fatal semi-success in the DH 108 Swallow, when he tickled Mach 1 but
didn't
survive.

--
Moving things in still pictures!



--
Moving things in still pictures!

"®i©ardo" wrote in message
...
Graham Sheldon wrote:
Talking about "The Sound Barrier" as a work of fiction showing the
British achieving supersonic flight, I seem to recall reading/hearing
somewhere that in actual fact the British were well advanced in
researching this and had designed and built an aeroplane - the Miles M52
I think - which could well have achieved this. Then the US and British
Governments decided they would pool their research to achieve it. So the
British handed over all their info to the US who then refused to hand
over their info, due to "security reasons". The British did not proceed
any further but the US continued on (now with the benefit of all the
British research and design) and eventually produce the Bell X-1 - which
looks suspiciously like the Miles M52 - and do the deed!

Sounds a bit like the atomic bomb development with Britain and Canada
having been major contributors, then being told to p*ss off by the Yanks.

The British, using Canadian uranium and plutonium and the worlds largest
stockpile of heavy water and hydro-electric power, had actually done the
majority of the leg-work already, leaving the American-funded Manhatten
Project to do the rest.

President Truman the reneged on FDR's promise to Churchill to share the
atom bombs.



For military movie fiction you can't "The Sound Barrier"
showing the British being the first to achieve supersonic
flight.

I remember seeing "The Sound Barrier" in the year of its release, and
my
memories of it stretch back that far. If you have access to a VHS or
DVD
home version, please correct me ... but ... the film presents a
disclaimer
that it is a piece of fiction, and if despite that it seems more
truthful
than most works of fiction then that may be due to the skill of the
director, David Lean; it was acknowledged in the film that the sound
barrier
had already been overcome by an American aviator, without, as I
remember,
any mention being made that the American aircraft was not jet- but
rocket-powered; and the whole thing is really about Geoffrey de
Havilland's
fatal semi-success in the DH 108 Swallow, when he tickled Mach 1 but
didn't
survive.

--
Moving things in still pictures!



--
Moving things in still pictures!

I seem to remember also after WW2 the British were well advanced with jet
engine technology and virtually handed all the plans, etc over for the
Russians to have a look at. And then the world was shocked when the
Mig-15 showed up in Korea with a Russian copy of the British jet engine.
What is it with the poms? And then there was Duncan Sands (or however he
spells it) and his infamous white paper which destroyed the British aero
industry almost overnight...

Graham Sheldon wrote:
"®i©ardo" wrote in message
...
Graham Sheldon wrote:
Talking about "The Sound Barrier" as a work of fiction showing the
British achieving supersonic flight, I seem to recall reading/hearing
somewhere that in actual fact the British were well advanced in
researching this and had designed and built an aeroplane - the Miles M52
I think - which could well have achieved this. Then the US and British
Governments decided they would pool their research to achieve it. So the
British handed over all their info to the US who then refused to hand
over their info, due to "security reasons". The British did not proceed
any further but the US continued on (now with the benefit of all the
British research and design) and eventually produce the Bell X-1 - which
looks suspiciously like the Miles M52 - and do the deed!

Sounds a bit like the atomic bomb development with Britain and Canada
having been major contributors, then being told to p*ss off by the Yanks.

The British, using Canadian uranium and plutonium and the worlds largest
stockpile of heavy water and hydro-electric power, had actually done the
majority of the leg-work already, leaving the American-funded Manhatten
Project to do the rest.

President Truman the reneged on FDR's promise to Churchill to share the
atom bombs.


For military movie fiction you can't "The Sound Barrier"
showing the British being the first to achieve supersonic
flight.

I remember seeing "The Sound Barrier" in the year of its release, and
my
memories of it stretch back that far. If you have access to a VHS or
DVD
home version, please correct me ... but ... the film presents a
disclaimer
that it is a piece of fiction, and if despite that it seems more
truthful
than most works of fiction then that may be due to the skill of the
director, David Lean; it was acknowledged in the film that the sound
barrier
had already been overcome by an American aviator, without, as I
remember,
any mention being made that the American aircraft was not jet- but
rocket-powered; and the whole thing is really about Geoffrey de
Havilland's
fatal semi-success in the DH 108 Swallow, when he tickled Mach 1 but
didn't
survive.

--
Moving things in still pictures!

--
Moving things in still pictures!

I seem to remember also after WW2 the British were well advanced with jet
engine technology and virtually handed all the plans, etc over for the
Russians to have a look at. And then the world was shocked when the
Mig-15 showed up in Korea with a Russian copy of the British jet engine.
What is it with the poms? And then there was Duncan Sands (or however he
spells it) and his infamous white paper which destroyed the British aero
industry almost overnight...


Not *all* the plans. The Russians were provided with an example of the
Rolls Royce Nene and Derwent jet engines.

Britain handed over far, far more to America in that line.

America's first jet fighter, the XP-59A Airocomet, only got off the
ground thanks to the engine and technology provided by Britain.

--
Moving things in still pictures!

"®i©ardo" wrote in message
...
Graham Sheldon wrote:





I seem to remember also after WW2 the British were well advanced with jet
engine technology and virtually handed all the plans, etc over for the
Russians to have a look at. And then the world was shocked when the
Mig-15 showed up in Korea with a Russian copy of the British jet engine.
What is it with the poms? And then there was Duncan Sands (or however
he spells it) and his infamous white paper which destroyed the British
aero industry almost overnight...
Not *all* the plans. The Russians were provided with an example of the
Rolls Royce Nene and Derwent jet engines.

Britain handed over far, far more to America in that line.

And Britain's reward from the U$$A was the same
as the reward from the USSR!




America's first jet fighter, the XP-59A Airocomet, only got off the ground
thanks to the engine and technology provided by Britain.

"Graham Sheldon" wrote in message
...
Talking about "The Sound Barrier" as a work of fiction showing the
British achieving supersonic flight, I seem to recall reading/hearing
somewhere that in actual fact the British were well advanced in
researching this and had designed and built an aeroplane - the Miles M52 I
think - which could well have achieved this. Then the US and British
Governments decided they would pool their research to achieve it. So the
British handed over all their info to the US who then refused to hand over
their info, due to "security reasons". The British did not proceed any
further but the US continued on (now with the benefit of all the British
research and design) and eventually produce the Bell X-1 - which looks
suspiciously like the Miles M52 - and do the deed!

http://www.aerospaceweb.org/question...y/q0198a.shtml

Design of the M.52 was nearly complete by 1944, and the UK government
approved the construction of three prototypes. By the end of World War II in
mid-1945, the first prototype was over half-built and may have been ready to
begin flight testing within a year. Unfortunately, a new government had been
elected in 1945 when conservative Prime Minister Winston Churchill was
defeated by the Labour party. The new Labour government felt that too much
money was being wasted on defense-related projects now that the war had been
won, and widespread funding cuts were instituted. One of the projects
eliminated was the M.52, cancelled in February 1946 by Sir Ben Lockspeiser,
the Director of Scientific Research








For military movie fiction you can't "The Sound Barrier"
showing the British being the first to achieve supersonic
flight.


I remember seeing "The Sound Barrier" in the year of its release, and my
memories of it stretch back that far. If you have access to a VHS or
DVD
home version, please correct me ... but ... the film presents a
disclaimer
that it is a piece of fiction, and if despite that it seems more
truthful
than most works of fiction then that may be due to the skill of the
director, David Lean; it was acknowledged in the film that the sound
barrier
had already been overcome by an American aviator, without, as I
remember,
any mention being made that the American aircraft was not jet- but
rocket-powered; and the whole thing is really about Geoffrey de
Havilland's
fatal semi-success in the DH 108 Swallow, when he tickled Mach 1 but
didn't
survive.

--
Moving things in still pictures!