New Nationwide Squawk Code

On Apr 6, 9:34*am, Darryl Ramm wrote:
On Apr 5, 8:32*am, soarski wrote:





On Apr 3, 8:58*am, Fred wrote:

Dave asks a good question here. He and I discussed this in the hangar
before he posted it, and I didn't have a good answer then. *After
giving it more thought I tend to lean in favor of 1200 because he is
flying in airspace where gliders are not a common experience (into and
out of San Jose's busy airspace) and he can maneuver differently than
I am able to do in a Duo Discus -- which I wouldn't fly into San Jose
or the Bay Area in any case.

But I'd be interested in other thoughts on this question.

Fred LaSor
SoaringNV
Minden, NV

Did I not just read in the FAA rules Code 1201 if not in contact with
ATC, which would mean in many cases that
we stay with 1200 as long as we take off at controlled airports or
similar. Leaving the area we might report switching to
1201??? *......Awaiting a possible question about that *code? *This
would apply to many motorgliders.

Dieter, Stemme S10V

This may be confusing the matter more than it needs to be. Putting
aside the question about motorgliders, "in contact with ATC" in this
case implies a facility with/providing radar services, i.e. situations
in which you were on a flight plan or flight following and would be
assigned a discrete squawk code, if you are just taking off say from a
typical Class D airport you are not receiving radar services

Darryl- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Not quite so....Initially when I flew my S10 out of my airport, I did
not turn on my Transponder since I did not have to and do not have the
batteries for it. One day testing it, the tower found out that I had
one and pleaded to at least have it on while under power, since we
have an incredible amount of jet traffic here. They are very
appreciative about it. I am never on a flightplan or am asigned my own
code, just 1200! Tower controlers hardly look outside anymore, they
depend on their screens. Happily will point out traffic etc. I do not
see a big deal about all this. Remember Gliders do not need a TXponder
yet. So If one is used in a glider, you have a choice now, 1200 or
1201. If you use the later, it will help who ever is looking at you.
Wait till all of us have to use Mode S....Then ATC will know who you
are no matter what you are squaking including your phone #. Some
wheels turn slower than others, nothing to get exited about.
Most likely by the end of summer, leaving the local airspace, tower
might say as I climb thru 15000... You may squak 1201 now. If I am
behind Capitol Peak he wont see me anymore anyway, but some "fast
Heavy" arriving from the west
will or may not, depending what stage of the game my transponder and
my batteries are in.
BTW Tower and approach control is ATC also

soarski

soarski wrote:
On Apr 6, 9:34 am, Darryl Ramm wrote:
On Apr 5, 8:32 am, soarski wrote:





On Apr 3, 8:58 am, Fred wrote:
Dave asks a good question here. He and I discussed this in the hangar
before he posted it, and I didn't have a good answer then. After
giving it more thought I tend to lean in favor of 1200 because he is
flying in airspace where gliders are not a common experience (into and
out of San Jose's busy airspace) and he can maneuver differently than
I am able to do in a Duo Discus -- which I wouldn't fly into San Jose
or the Bay Area in any case.
But I'd be interested in other thoughts on this question.
Fred LaSor
SoaringNV
Minden, NV
Did I not just read in the FAA rules Code 1201 if not in contact with
ATC, which would mean in many cases that
we stay with 1200 as long as we take off at controlled airports or
similar. Leaving the area we might report switching to
1201??? ......Awaiting a possible question about that code? This
would apply to many motorgliders.
Dieter, Stemme S10V
This may be confusing the matter more than it needs to be. Putting
aside the question about motorgliders, "in contact with ATC" in this
case implies a facility with/providing radar services, i.e. situations
in which you were on a flight plan or flight following and would be
assigned a discrete squawk code, if you are just taking off say from a
typical Class D airport you are not receiving radar services

Darryl- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Not quite so....Initially when I flew my S10 out of my airport, I did
not turn on my Transponder since I did not have to and do not have the
batteries for it. One day testing it, the tower found out that I had
one and pleaded to at least have it on while under power, since we
have an incredible amount of jet traffic here. They are very
appreciative about it. I am never on a flightplan or am asigned my own
code, just 1200! Tower controlers hardly look outside anymore, they
depend on their screens. Happily will point out traffic etc. I do not
see a big deal about all this. Remember Gliders do not need a TXponder
yet. So If one is used in a glider, you have a choice now, 1200 or
1201. If you use the later, it will help who ever is looking at you.
Wait till all of us have to use Mode S....Then ATC will know who you
are no matter what you are squaking including your phone #. Some
wheels turn slower than others, nothing to get exited about.
Most likely by the end of summer, leaving the local airspace, tower
might say as I climb thru 15000... You may squak 1201 now. If I am
behind Capitol Peak he wont see me anymore anyway, but some "fast
Heavy" arriving from the west
will or may not, depending what stage of the game my transponder and
my batteries are in.
BTW Tower and approach control is ATC also

soarski

Actually, I don't believe 1200 is just for powered aircraft. 1200
signifies "VFR" flight. ANY type of aircraft can fly VFR...ultralights,
airships, gliders, rotorcraft, etc. Granted 1201 might be nice to help
ATC determine who has "right of way" in any situation...

On Apr 6, 3:40*pm, soarski wrote:
On Apr 6, 9:34*am, Darryl Ramm wrote:



On Apr 5, 8:32*am, soarski wrote:

On Apr 3, 8:58*am, Fred wrote:

Dave asks a good question here. He and I discussed this in the hangar
before he posted it, and I didn't have a good answer then. *After
giving it more thought I tend to lean in favor of 1200 because he is
flying in airspace where gliders are not a common experience (into and
out of San Jose's busy airspace) and he can maneuver differently than
I am able to do in a Duo Discus -- which I wouldn't fly into San Jose
or the Bay Area in any case.

But I'd be interested in other thoughts on this question.

Fred LaSor
SoaringNV
Minden, NV

Did I not just read in the FAA rules Code 1201 if not in contact with
ATC, which would mean in many cases that
we stay with 1200 as long as we take off at controlled airports or
similar. Leaving the area we might report switching to
1201??? *......Awaiting a possible question about that *code? *This
would apply to many motorgliders.

Dieter, Stemme S10V

This may be confusing the matter more than it needs to be. Putting
aside the question about motorgliders, "in contact with ATC" in this
case implies a facility with/providing radar services, i.e. situations
in which you were on a flight plan or flight following and would be
assigned a discrete squawk code, if you are just taking off say from a
typical Class D airport you are not receiving radar services

Darryl- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Not quite so....Initially when I flew my S10 out of my airport, I did
not turn on my Transponder since I did not have to and do not have the
batteries for it. One day testing it, the tower found out that I had
one and pleaded to at least have it on while under power, since we
have an incredible amount of jet traffic here. They are very
appreciative about it. I am never on a flightplan or am asigned my own
code, just 1200! *Tower controlers hardly look outside anymore, they
depend on their screens. Happily will point out traffic etc. I do not
see a big deal about all this. Remember Gliders do not need a TXponder
yet. So If one is used in a glider, you have a choice now, 1200 or
1201. If you use the later, it will help who ever is looking at you.
Wait till all of us have to use Mode S....Then ATC will know who you
are no matter what you are squaking including your phone #. Some
wheels turn slower than others, nothing to get exited about.
Most likely by the end of summer, leaving the local airspace, tower
might say as I climb thru 15000... You may squak 1201 now. If I am
behind Capitol Peak he wont see me anymore anyway, but some "fast
Heavy" arriving from the west
will or may not, depending what stage of the game my transponder and
my batteries are in.
BTW Tower and approach control is ATC also

soarski

No. No and No. Can I be any clearer?

Technically you are required to turn your transponder on if installed.
And the tower folks probably were bemused why you were not. A Stemme
should have lots of power available for a modern low-power transponder
(Becker, Trig etc). And for God's sake if it's installed and you are
flying near heavy traffic, turn it on.

Do you know for sure that the tower controllers have radar? Which
class D do you fly out of? The tower may well want to make sure you
are visible to approach/tracon radar services once you leave the
airport vicinity.

You won't get assigned a discreet code unless you file a flight plan
or use flight following. Just departing a class D airport VFR with no
flight plan you will not get a unique code, that's expected. You would
normally get a discrete code for flight following if you contact
approach or a similar facility providing radar services once airborne
and request flight following. It seems you are flying around traffic
near controlled airspace and maybe could do with sitting down with
somebody, maybe an power instructor, and going over how ATC operates,
how to use things like flight following, etc.

I am well aware what ATC is but I was trying to explain to you how it
was being used in what you were reading. The document was referring to
radar services when saying ATC and your question about squawking 1200
if in touch with a tower was confusing this discussion.

If is at all not clear that 1201 will automatically "help whoever is
looking at you". Did you miss the people in this thread warning to
check with your local ATC facilities (e.g. likely approach/TRACON not
tower) about wether they can handle 1201. I know some will treat 1201
exactly the same as 1200 and just see the "V" for VFR symbol on their
display (confirmed today that is the situation with Oakland ARTCC).
Some others facilities may have problems with 1201 and not want that
squawked. Clearly everybody has been caught hopping by this
announcement of the allocation, but it's an allocation of a national
code, not an national announcement that facilities are ready to handle
this or to pilots what to do.

Darryl

On Apr 6, 3:40*pm, soarski wrote:
On Apr 6, 9:34*am, Darryl Ramm wrote:



On Apr 5, 8:32*am, soarski wrote:

On Apr 3, 8:58*am, Fred wrote:

Dave asks a good question here. He and I discussed this in the hangar
before he posted it, and I didn't have a good answer then. *After
giving it more thought I tend to lean in favor of 1200 because he is
flying in airspace where gliders are not a common experience (into and
out of San Jose's busy airspace) and he can maneuver differently than
I am able to do in a Duo Discus -- which I wouldn't fly into San Jose
or the Bay Area in any case.

But I'd be interested in other thoughts on this question.

Fred LaSor
SoaringNV
Minden, NV

Did I not just read in the FAA rules Code 1201 if not in contact with
ATC, which would mean in many cases that
we stay with 1200 as long as we take off at controlled airports or
similar. Leaving the area we might report switching to
1201??? *......Awaiting a possible question about that *code? *This
would apply to many motorgliders.

Dieter, Stemme S10V

This may be confusing the matter more than it needs to be. Putting
aside the question about motorgliders, "in contact with ATC" in this
case implies a facility with/providing radar services, i.e. situations
in which you were on a flight plan or flight following and would be
assigned a discrete squawk code, if you are just taking off say from a
typical Class D airport you are not receiving radar services

Darryl- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Not quite so....Initially when I flew my S10 out of my airport, I did
not turn on my Transponder since I did not have to and do not have the
batteries for it. One day testing it, the tower found out that I had
one and pleaded to at least have it on while under power, since we
have an incredible amount of jet traffic here. They are very
appreciative about it. I am never on a flightplan or am asigned my own
code, just 1200! *Tower controlers hardly look outside anymore, they
depend on their screens. Happily will point out traffic etc. I do not
see a big deal about all this. Remember Gliders do not need a TXponder
yet. So If one is used in a glider, you have a choice now, 1200 or
1201. If you use the later, it will help who ever is looking at you.
Wait till all of us have to use Mode S....Then ATC will know who you
are no matter what you are squaking including your phone #. Some
wheels turn slower than others, nothing to get exited about.
Most likely by the end of summer, leaving the local airspace, tower
might say as I climb thru 15000... You may squak 1201 now. If I am
behind Capitol Peak he wont see me anymore anyway, but some "fast
Heavy" arriving from the west
will or may not, depending what stage of the game my transponder and
my batteries are in.
BTW Tower and approach control is ATC also

soarski

BTW to be clear about the 1201 and TCAS and that fast-heavy.... TCAS
won't care whether you squawk 1200, 1201 or a discrete code. TCAS only
interrogates Mode C or Mode S, and does not and cannot see your Mode A/
C transponder's squawk code.


Darryl