Phoebus C - why so cheap?

On Jul 21, 6:50*pm, Greg Arnold wrote:
On 7/21/2010 6:44 PM, brian whatcott wrote:





On 7/21/2010 1:49 PM, Tony wrote:
On Jul 21, 1:00 pm, jim wrote:
A year or two ago, there was a Phoebus that sold for under $7k on
Wings and Wheels. Now there's another (without a trailer) for $7k.
How does the value of a 17 meter, 42:1 glider NOT exceed that of a
1-26? I already have a glider I love, but I still like to look at
OTHER gliders (don't tell UF).

Jim

i've heard there can be issues with the balsa core that may be
difficult or impossible to inspect. they're basically first
generation glass. don't forget that there were 700 1-26's built,
there is tons of expertise, spare parts, a strong type organization,
and they are robust as hell. I do find a nice webpage from Bruno
Vassel that he had about his Phoebus and also a Yahoo Group, but have
a feeling that doesn't really compare with the 1-26 association.
Resale value involves a lot more than performance.

In case there may be some slight relevance, it's observed that the
first generation of glass sailboats were helluva stout - but where wood
was imbedded as stringers etc., they can be expected to have rotted out....

Brian W

Another data point -- some incredibly expensive boats are built with
balsa coring below the waterline. *See, for example, Baltic Yachts,
which has an excellent reputation for high quality.http://www.balticyachts.fi/- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Also insulation/flotation in LPG tankers, floors in airliners (alum/
balsa sandwich).
After the Logan contest is over I'm going to ping Bruno about his
experience with the Phoebus.

On Jul 23, 10:28*am, Grider Pirate wrote:
On Jul 21, 6:50*pm, Greg Arnold wrote:





On 7/21/2010 6:44 PM, brian whatcott wrote:

On 7/21/2010 1:49 PM, Tony wrote:
On Jul 21, 1:00 pm, jim wrote:
A year or two ago, there was a Phoebus that sold for under $7k on
Wings and Wheels. Now there's another (without a trailer) for $7k.
How does the value of a 17 meter, 42:1 glider NOT exceed that of a
1-26? I already have a glider I love, but I still like to look at
OTHER gliders (don't tell UF).

Jim

i've heard there can be issues with the balsa core that may be
difficult or impossible to inspect. they're basically first
generation glass. don't forget that there were 700 1-26's built,
there is tons of expertise, spare parts, a strong type organization,
and they are robust as hell. I do find a nice webpage from Bruno
Vassel that he had about his Phoebus and also a Yahoo Group, but have
a feeling that doesn't really compare with the 1-26 association.
Resale value involves a lot more than performance.

In case there may be some slight relevance, it's observed that the
first generation of glass sailboats were helluva stout - but where wood
was imbedded as stringers etc., they can be expected to have rotted out...

Brian W

Another data point -- some incredibly expensive boats are built with
balsa coring below the waterline. *See, for example, Baltic Yachts,
which has an excellent reputation for high quality.http://www.balticyachts.fi/-Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Also insulation/flotation in LPG tankers, floors in airliners (alum/
balsa sandwich).
After the Logan contest is over I'm going to ping Bruno about his
experience with the Phoebus.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

I helped John Campbell work on his Phoebus C way back in 1987 or
1988. At that time, it was a 25 year old glider. I don't recall
any major issues or quirks, other than some slight problems with some
wooden covers (non-structural). These were related more to poor
maintenance than any design issues. The glider flew wonderfully,
though it looked kinda funky at higher speed with wing tips that
drooped due to the washout.

It's like any of the older ships. The ratio of flying to maintenance
will be worse. But if you have some time and talent, it's probably a
great deal.

P3

You know, I knew there was something familiar about the tail number on
that Phoebus that is on Wings and Wheels. I couldn't place it though.
N121TT. Hmmmm

Well I am watching the Sunship Games tonight and there it is! N121TT
pulling into Marfa for the 1969 Nationals! I knew I'd seen it
somewhere!

On Jul 29, 10:10*pm, Tony wrote:
You know, I knew there was something familiar about the tail number on
that Phoebus that is on Wings and Wheels. *I couldn't place it though.
N121TT. Hmmmm

Well I am watching the Sunship Games tonight and there it is! N121TT
pulling into Marfa for the 1969 Nationals! I knew I'd seen it
somewhere!

Soaring Junkie!

On Jul 29, 11:09*pm, Mike wrote:
On Jul 29, 10:10*pm, Tony wrote:

You know, I knew there was something familiar about the tail number on
that Phoebus that is on Wings and Wheels. *I couldn't place it though..
N121TT. Hmmmm

Well I am watching the Sunship Games tonight and there it is! N121TT
pulling into Marfa for the 1969 Nationals! I knew I'd seen it
somewhere!

Soaring Junkie!

NOT! A soaring junkie would have told us who was flying it, how they
placed, and perhaps posted the daily results.

NOT! A soaring junkie would have told us who was flying it, how they
placed, and perhaps posted the daily results.

well the daily results are in the SSA Soaring Magazine archive,
September 1969 edition Page 22 and 23 in the actual magazine (20 and
21 in the archive). 4 Phoebus's (or is that Phoebii?) were entered
and not noted as Standard Class gliders. One of the 4 was designated
a Phoebus C while the rest were just plain Phoebus. the Phoebus C
placed 21st, pilots last name was Ryan.

On Jul 30, 10:20*am, Tony wrote:
NOT! A soaring junkie would have told us who was flying it, how they
placed, and perhaps posted the daily results.

well the daily results are in the SSA Soaring Magazine archive,
September 1969 edition Page 22 and 23 in the actual magazine (20 and
21 in the archive). *4 Phoebus's (or is that Phoebii?) were entered
and not noted as Standard Class gliders. *One of the 4 was designated
a Phoebus C while the rest were just plain Phoebus. *the Phoebus C
placed 21st, pilots last name was Ryan.

Soaring Junkie!