Aug 6th B738 and Glider Near Miss. Frankfurt

On 10/20/2010 12:20 AM, Mike I Green wrote:
Mike - It is common procedure for controllers in the Reno area to route
heavies away from transponder equipped gliders. I find it difficult to
comprehend why you are so antagonistic towards what many others and I
feel is common sense.

MG

I think that you misinterpret my attitude. My view is that see and
avoid is obsolete in today's airspace environment and that the FARs need
to be changed so that ALL ATC controllers are responsible to provide
separation services between VFR and IFR aircraft.

As things stand today in the US, technically, ATC only provides
separation services between IFR aircraft outside of Class A and B
airspace. It is up to the IFR pilots to see and avoid VFR aircraft at
all times. If the IFR pilots get a verbal traffic advisory that's a
marginally helpful plus. If they get rerouted, that's ideal.

We need to work on getting the local procedures that you have negotiated
with your controllers in RENO implemented nation wide.

Mike Schumann


Mike Schumann wrote:
On 10/17/2010 4:43 AM, Mark Dickson wrote:
Sorry, but thermalling gliders will almost always show on radar.

At 23:39 16 October 2010, John Smith wrote:
Mark Dickson wrote:
No, it's Ryanair. They always look for direct routings, even if it
takes them outside controlled airspace.

They can ask as much as they want, it's the controller authority to
allow it or not. But how can I explain this to somebody who
doesn't even
know that class E airspace is controlled?

Contrary to popular myth, gliders show
as a primary return on radar displays

Contrary to popular myth, stationary primary targets are filtered
out by
the radar software, hence thermalling gliders don't show on the
controller's display.


Even if non-equipped gliders show up, there is no altitude info. In
the US, standard procedure is that IFR traffic is not routed around
VFR airplanes, even if they are transponder equipped. If you are
lucky, the IFR traffic will get a traffic advisory. Keep your fingers
crossed that the IFR traffic has TCAS and that the pilots follow the
RA instructions.