What First Glider to own?

"Sparkorama" wrote in message ...

I'm getting back into the sport after a long hiatus and flying in the
Boston area. I'll be putting some winter flying time in and I'm
considering buying my first glider once I'm back to comfortable solos
and my private license. (Naturally, I won't fly anything until I am
competent and ready). Any suggestions on a first glider? Because of my
price range, I realize I'll be looking at some older birds. I would say
my preferences are as follows. Under 20k, easy to fly, easy to maintain
and safe. Naturally, I'd like to see some decent glide performance, just
thinking that some future performance would be good for keeping the
plane for some time. (currently I'm considering an IS29D2 Lark)
My club has competent instructors and the following fleet (winter flying
in only the 2-33):
1 Puchacz (two place, 30/1 performance; advanced trainer, aerobatic)
3 Blanik L-23 (two place, 30/1 performance; advanced trainer,
sightseeing)
1 Blanik L-33 solo (single place, 30/1 performance; cross-country,
sightseeing)
1 Schweitzer 1-34 (single place, 34/1 performance)
1 Pilatus B-4 (single place, 35/1 performance; cross-country,
aerobatic)
1 Schweizer 2-33A (two place, 23/1 performance; trainer)
1 Schweizer 1-26E (single place, 23/1 performance; aerobatic)
Your thoughts would be appreciated.
--
Sparkorama

I started out with a Ka-6. The controls are well coordinated, has adequate performance for cross-country flight and are inexpensive.
http://www.soaridaho.com/photogallery/valley/Ka-6E.jpg

Wayne
http://www.soaridaho.com/Schreder

On Dec 2, 2:05*pm, Sparkorama
wrote:

Your thoughts would be appreciated.

Cheap, Fast, Good: Pick two.

But no need to rush. You'll get to see a lot of equipment and get to
know the owners at GBSC.

-Evan Ludeman / T8

On Dec 2, 2:05*pm, Sparkorama
wrote:
I'm getting back into the sport after a long hiatus and flying in the
Boston area. I'll be putting some winter flying time in and I'm
considering buying my first glider once I'm back to comfortable solos
and my private license. (Naturally, I won't fly anything until I am
competent and ready). Any suggestions on a first glider? Because of my
price range, I realize I'll be looking at some older birds. I would say
my preferences are as follows. Under 20k, easy to fly, easy to maintain
and safe. Naturally, I'd like to see some decent glide performance, just
thinking that some future performance would be good for keeping the
plane for some time. *(currently I'm considering an IS29D2 Lark)
My club has competent instructors and the following fleet (winter flying
in only the 2-33):
1 Puchacz (two place, 30/1 performance; advanced trainer, aerobatic)
3 Blanik L-23 (two place, 30/1 performance; advanced trainer,
sightseeing)
1 Blanik L-33 solo (single place, 30/1 performance; cross-country,
sightseeing)
1 Schweitzer 1-34 (single place, 34/1 performance)
1 Pilatus B-4 (single place, 35/1 performance; cross-country,
aerobatic)
1 Schweizer 2-33A (two place, 23/1 performance; trainer)
1 Schweizer 1-26E (single place, 23/1 performance; aerobatic)
Your thoughts would be appreciated.

--
Sparkorama

Sparky,
A few years ago I made a quasi-scientific weighted chart to determine
the best glider to buy, and in your price range it's a Libelle. Very
good value, light and easy to rig. Might give it a look.

My club has competent instructors and the following fleet (winter flying
in only the 2-33):
1 Puchacz (two place, 30/1 performance; advanced trainer, aerobatic)
3 Blanik L-23 (two place, 30/1 performance; advanced trainer,
sightseeing)
1 Blanik L-33 solo (single place, 30/1 performance; cross-country,
sightseeing)
1 Schweitzer 1-34 (single place, 34/1 performance)
1 Pilatus B-4 (single place, 35/1 performance; cross-country,
aerobatic)
1 Schweizer 2-33A (two place, 23/1 performance; trainer)
1 Schweizer 1-26E (single place, 23/1 performance; aerobatic)
Your thoughts would be appreciated.


What everyone else said, but with the caveat that you should spend the
next season flying all the good equipment in your club, and then you
will be infinitely better informed. Also, If you fly less than 30 hrs
in the next year, you should consider the old saying "If it floats,
flies or _____, RENT, don't own!

aerodyne

We could have a new acronym for this -

There is no substitute for owning your own glider = TINSFOYOG, not
exactly catchy. But true.

It matters a lot less how good the performance is of the glider - than
that you have access to something you can explore in whenever madame
opportunity winks at you. Look at how much fun Tony Condon has had with
a Cherokee.

I know that my own flying was transformed by getting into a Std Cirrus
partnership. That was probably the best way to do it. A partner who
disliked the handling on the Cirrus but paid half the costs and gladly
did maintenance because he enjoys it. So 100% access to fly, and lots of
help along the way.

No more club haggling to fly on the good days, no more insurance issues
(it costs but on your own terms)

Bruce

On 2010/12/03 6:44 AM, wrote:
My club has competent instructors and the following fleet (winter flying
in only the 2-33):
1 Puchacz (two place, 30/1 performance; advanced trainer, aerobatic)
3 Blanik L-23 (two place, 30/1 performance; advanced trainer,
sightseeing)
1 Blanik L-33 solo (single place, 30/1 performance; cross-country,
sightseeing)
1 Schweitzer 1-34 (single place, 34/1 performance)
1 Pilatus B-4 (single place, 35/1 performance; cross-country,
aerobatic)
1 Schweizer 2-33A (two place, 23/1 performance; trainer)
1 Schweizer 1-26E (single place, 23/1 performance; aerobatic)
Your thoughts would be appreciated.


What everyone else said, but with the caveat that you should spend the
next season flying all the good equipment in your club, and then you
will be infinitely better informed. Also, If you fly less than 30 hrs
in the next year, you should consider the old saying "If it floats,
flies or _____, RENT, don't own!

aerodyne

--
Bruce Greeff
T59D #1771 & Std Cirrus #57

Plenty of advice, not many real suggestions.
A Libelle was mentioned, beautiful glider, Glasflugel workmanship and
design, easiest ever to rig, slightly tight cockpit if you are well fed,
brakes not the best, need getting used to.
ASW15, same performance as Libelle, bigger cockpit, better brakes, not
quite so easy to rig.
Std Cirrus, elevator very light, apart from that very good.
ASW 19/Pegase better performance than those above, excellent gliders.
If you can find one at your price, a Discus in a Cobra trailer.
Almost as easy to rig as the Libelle, excellent performance (43), good
cockpit, quite good brakes, very easy to fly, I think some clubs used them
as first solo when they came out, but could be wrong on that. If you get
ambitious, they will carry lots of water.
BTW Mike, I had a Jantar 19 for 15 years or so, and rigged it single
handed, (preference not necessity) unless it was windy, with 3 trestles
and two dollies.
Basically you won't go far wrong with any European series production
glass glider, so get the best you can afford. I can't comment on those
made in the USA, as I know nothing about them. However general advice
would be initially, stick to 15 metres and no flaps.
Dave




At 19:05 02 December 2010, Sparkorama wrote:

I'm getting back into the sport after a long hiatus and flying in the
Boston area. I'll be putting some winter flying time in and I'm
considering buying my first glider once I'm back to comfortable solos
and my private license. (Naturally, I won't fly anything until I am
competent and ready). Any suggestions on a first glider? Because of my
price range, I realize I'll be looking at some older birds. I would say
my preferences are as follows. Under 20k, easy to fly, easy to maintain
and safe. Naturally, I'd like to see some decent glide performance,
just
thinking that some future performance would be good for keeping the
plane for some time. (currently I'm considering an IS29D2 Lark)
My club has competent instructors and the following fleet (winter flying
in only the 2-33):
1 Puchacz (two place, 30/1 performance; advanced trainer, aerobatic)
3 Blanik L-23 (two place, 30/1 performance; advanced trainer,
sightseeing)
1 Blanik L-33 solo (single place, 30/1 performance; cross-country,
sightseeing)
1 Schweitzer 1-34 (single place, 34/1 performance)
1 Pilatus B-4 (single place, 35/1 performance; cross-country,
aerobatic)
1 Schweizer 2-33A (two place, 23/1 performance; trainer)
1 Schweizer 1-26E (single place, 23/1 performance; aerobatic)
Your thoughts would be appreciated.




--
Sparkorama

Bucks for glide angle - Discus
Good handling qualities - Discus
Easy to rig- Discus
Good spares availability -Discus

If however you are looking for a pretty glider, with excellent
performance, excellent handling qualities, and are strong enough to rig
it: ASW17. Don't let the flaps put you off, the handling is simplicity in
itself and it does what it says on the tin. Bucks for glide angle, nothing
comes anywhere near :-)






At 06:33 03 December 2010, BruceGreeff wrote:
We could have a new acronym for this -

There is no substitute for owning your own glider = TINSFOYOG, not
exactly catchy. But true.

It matters a lot less how good the performance is of the glider - than
that you have access to something you can explore in whenever madame
opportunity winks at you. Look at how much fun Tony Condon has had with
a Cherokee.

I know that my own flying was transformed by getting into a Std Cirrus
partnership. That was probably the best way to do it. A partner who
disliked the handling on the Cirrus but paid half the costs and gladly
did maintenance because he enjoys it. So 100% access to fly, and lots of

help along the way.

No more club haggling to fly on the good days, no more insurance issues
(it costs but on your own terms)

Bruce

On 2010/12/03 6:44 AM, wrote:
My club has competent instructors and the following fleet (winter
flying
in only the 2-33):
1 Puchacz (two place, 30/1 performance; advanced trainer, aerobatic)
3 Blanik L-23 (two place, 30/1 performance; advanced trainer,
sightseeing)
1 Blanik L-33 solo (single place, 30/1 performance; cross-country,
sightseeing)
1 Schweitzer 1-34 (single place, 34/1 performance)
1 Pilatus B-4 (single place, 35/1 performance; cross-country,
aerobatic)
1 Schweizer 2-33A (two place, 23/1 performance; trainer)
1 Schweizer 1-26E (single place, 23/1 performance; aerobatic)
Your thoughts would be appreciated.


What everyone else said, but with the caveat that you should spend the
next season flying all the good equipment in your club, and then you
will be infinitely better informed. Also, If you fly less than 30 hrs
in the next year, you should consider the old saying "If it floats,
flies or _____, RENT, don't own!

aerodyne

--
Bruce Greeff
T59D #1771 & Std Cirrus #57

On Dec 3, 5:16*am, Don Johnstone wrote:
Bucks for glide angle *- Discus
Good handling qualities - Discus
Easy to rig- Discus
Good spares availability -Discus


I have never seen a Discus for under 20K. of course 20K would make a
good partnership interest if thats what he's into

"David Salmon" wrote in message
...
Plenty of advice, not many real suggestions.
A Libelle was mentioned, beautiful glider, Glasflugel workmanship and
design, easiest ever to rig, slightly tight cockpit if you are well fed,
brakes not the best, need getting used to.

All the above is true. Unfortunately the non-hinged canopy on the older
Libelles makes it difficult, perhaps impossible, for you button yourself up into
your own glider without help. Depending on where you launch from, this may or
may not be a problem for you.

Vaughn

I second the ASW 15 suggestion. Pros - They can be had for much less
than 20K, have good (but not great) performance. Easy to rig. My wings
go on much easier than most gliders I've seen. Roomy/comfortable
cockpit.

Cons - Check the cockpit payload on any you might look at. If you're
above average size you might be over max gross. The B model has a
higher max gross. Canopy does not have a hinge, it comes off
completely. Its a minor annoyance. Controls are not auto hook ups. For
some that's a deal breaker. I don't see it as a big thing. Safety
them, check them and check them again. Some have an off center tow
hook that can be an issue in a crosswind takeoff. Mine has a more
forward centerline release. They have an all-flying tail that some
people seem to not like. I don't know why. From what I've read,
twitchy pitch control on all flying tails is mostly a myth. There may
be some issue at high speeds but I rarely go more than 75-80 kts (like
I said - good but not great performance) I can't tell the difference
but I've never flown any other glass single seat glider.

Reading the above it may seem like more cons than pros but the cons
are mostly non-issues, in my opinion. Of course, its a biased opinion
since a 15 is what I own. In the "bang for the buck" category the ASW
15 and Libelle are hard to beat. If you have another $5-10K or go
partners the possibilities really open up.