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Bush AWOL Story - New theory comes to light



 
 
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  #1  
Old March 27th 04, 09:41 PM
David Hartung
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Posts: n/a
Default


"Republican Double Standard" wrote in message
. 1.4...
"David Hartung" wrote in
:


"Republican Double Standard" wrote in
message . 1.4...
Chad Irby wrote in
news
In article ,
Republican Double Standard wrote:

Why is that Kerry's statements to congress in 1971 are of critical
importance, but Bush AWOL/Desertion/HRP failure/failure to show up
for a drug test all "ancient history"?

Because there are documents and witnesses to *support* the Kerry
story, but all of the documents and witnesses *disprove* the Bush
story.


Well, in fairness, there is a dentist who can corroborate Bush's
presence at Danelly at least one day in that year. Unfortunately,
Bush's transfer

to
Dannelly was rejected.


Just out of curiosity, what military or Guard experience do you have?




I can see it now: "You were never in the guard so you are not allowed to
discuss this."

I was in the VA for several years. Does that count? Not that I care
either way, but what's your experience?


My experience is 11 years in the USAF, but it seems to me that one who has
not served in any branch of the military, is in no position to tell a
Guardsman how the Guard works.


  #2  
Old March 27th 04, 09:57 PM
Republican Double Standard
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

"David Hartung" wrote in
:


"Republican Double Standard" wrote in
message . 1.4...
"David Hartung" wrote in
:


"Republican Double Standard" wrote in
message . 1.4...
Chad Irby wrote in
news
In article ,
Republican Double Standard wrote:

Why is that Kerry's statements to congress in 1971 are of
critical importance, but Bush AWOL/Desertion/HRP
failure/failure to show up for a drug test all "ancient
history"?

Because there are documents and witnesses to *support* the Kerry
story, but all of the documents and witnesses *disprove* the
Bush story.


Well, in fairness, there is a dentist who can corroborate Bush's
presence at Danelly at least one day in that year. Unfortunately,
Bush's transfer
to
Dannelly was rejected.

Just out of curiosity, what military or Guard experience do you
have?




I can see it now: "You were never in the guard so you are not
allowed to discuss this."

I was in the VA for several years. Does that count? Not that I care
either way, but what's your experience?


My experience is 11 years in the USAF, but it seems to me that one who
has not served in any branch of the military, is in no position to
tell a Guardsman how the Guard works.

What do I win for accurately predicting your pathetic weasle?

Are you gay? Are you a virologist? You've pontificated quite a bit on
these two subjects you know. Are you someone who is not gay that tells
gays how they feel and act? Are you someone who has not studied virology
(BTW, I am a microbiologist which includes virology) but feels like he's
in a position to tell people who have studied virology how viriuses
work? And let's not forget your grand theory of HIV epidemiology. Are
you an epidemiologist? Do you live in Florida? Have you voted there? You
certainly have had a lot to say about how voting works in Florida over
the past few years.

You don't have to serve in the guard to be able to read a transfer
request denial from personel headquarters. Or are there hidden messages
in it that you only learn how to decifer after you've served?

http://users.cis.net/coldfeet/doc9.gif

"Lt. Bush has not been observed at this unit during the period of
report. A civilian occupation made it necessary for him to move to
Montgomery, Alabama. He cleared this base on 15 May 1972 and has been
performing equivalent training in a non-flying status with the 187 TAC
recon Gp, Dannelly ANG Base, Alabama."

[signed]
"William D. Harris, Jr. Lt Col. Pilot, Flt Intcp"
"Jerry D. Killian, Lt. Col. Squadron Commander"

Both signatures dated 2 May 1973 [50 weeks after the date Bush "cleared
this base."]

http://users.cis.net/coldfeet/doc5.gif

"Application for Reserve Assignment, Bush, George W, 1sr Lt

"TAG Texas

"1. Application for Reserve Assignment for First Lieutenant Bush is
returned.

"2. A review of his Master Personel Record shows he has a Military
Service Obligation until 26 May 1974. Under provisions of paragraph 30-6
n (4), AFM 35-3, an obligated Reservist can be assigned to a specific
Ready Reserve position only. Therefore, he is ineligible for assignment
to an Air Reserve Squadron."

signed by The Director of Personnel Resources on 24 May 1972.

9 days *after* Bush "cleared" his prior posting. Bush failed to return
to his post in Texas for another 47 weeks after that. That is desertion
of duty. You cannot spin it any other way. You can pull strings (if your
Poppy) but you cannot change the fact that Bush's transfer request was
denied and he still failed to return to his post for nearly a year.

--
"We gave Hussein a chance to allow inspectors in, and he wouldn't let
them in."
- George WMD. Bush, lying on July 14, 2003.
  #3  
Old March 28th 04, 12:48 AM
Tarver Engineering
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default


"Republican Double Standard" wrote in message
. 1.4...
"David Hartung" wrote in
:


"Republican Double Standard" wrote in
message . 1.4...
"David Hartung" wrote in
:


"Republican Double Standard" wrote in
message . 1.4...
Chad Irby wrote in
news
In article ,
Republican Double Standard wrote:

Why is that Kerry's statements to congress in 1971 are of
critical importance, but Bush AWOL/Desertion/HRP
failure/failure to show up for a drug test all "ancient
history"?

Because there are documents and witnesses to *support* the Kerry
story, but all of the documents and witnesses *disprove* the
Bush story.


Well, in fairness, there is a dentist who can corroborate Bush's
presence at Danelly at least one day in that year. Unfortunately,
Bush's transfer
to
Dannelly was rejected.

Just out of curiosity, what military or Guard experience do you
have?




I can see it now: "You were never in the guard so you are not
allowed to discuss this."

I was in the VA for several years. Does that count? Not that I care
either way, but what's your experience?


My experience is 11 years in the USAF, but it seems to me that one who
has not served in any branch of the military, is in no position to
tell a Guardsman how the Guard works.

What do I win for accurately predicting your pathetic weasle?

Are you gay? Are you a virologist? You've pontificated quite a bit on
these two subjects you know. Are you someone who is not gay that tells
gays how they feel and act? Are you someone who has not studied virology
(BTW, I am a microbiologist which includes virology) but feels like he's
in a position to tell people who have studied virology how viriuses
work?


Are you a bug chaser, Republican Double Standard troll?


  #4  
Old March 28th 04, 04:14 AM
David Hartung
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default


"Republican Double Standard" wrote in message
. 1.4...
"David Hartung" wrote in
:


My experience is 11 years in the USAF, but it seems to me that one who
has not served in any branch of the military, is in no position to
tell a Guardsman how the Guard works.

What do I win for accurately predicting your pathetic weasle?

Are you gay? Are you a virologist? You've pontificated quite a bit on
these two subjects you know. Are you someone who is not gay that tells
gays how they feel and act? Are you someone who has not studied virology
(BTW, I am a microbiologist which includes virology) but feels like he's
in a position to tell people who have studied virology how viriuses
work? And let's not forget your grand theory of HIV epidemiology. Are
you an epidemiologist? Do you live in Florida? Have you voted there? You
certainly have had a lot to say about how voting works in Florida over
the past few years.

You don't have to serve in the guard to be able to read a transfer
request denial from personel headquarters. Or are there hidden messages
in it that you only learn how to decifer after you've served?


It is obvious that you will reject anything which counters your preconceived
opinion, but the simple fact is, one who is in the Guard is much more
qualified to speak to the operation of the Guard than one who has not. I
never served. I do not pretend to know everything about how the Guard works,
except that it was occasionally necessary for My Dad to miss drills, this
was no problem, he would make them up later. The concept of equivalent
training is not one which I am familiar with, but it does stand to reason
that there would be provisions for Guardsmen to do such, after all, they all
had civilian jobs.

One more point, there has been at least one individual who served with
George Bush in the Texas Guard, and according to this individual, Bush did
nothing wrong. My suggestion to you fools who keep beating this dead horse
would be to get a life.


  #5  
Old March 28th 04, 04:15 PM
Republican Double Standard
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

"David Hartung" wrote in
:


"Republican Double Standard" wrote in
message . 1.4...
"David Hartung" wrote in
:


My experience is 11 years in the USAF, but it seems to me that one
who has not served in any branch of the military, is in no position
to tell a Guardsman how the Guard works.

What do I win for accurately predicting your pathetic weasle?

Are you gay? Are you a virologist? You've pontificated quite a bit on
these two subjects you know. Are you someone who is not gay that
tells gays how they feel and act? Are you someone who has not studied
virology (BTW, I am a microbiologist which includes virology) but
feels like he's in a position to tell people who have studied
virology how viriuses work? And let's not forget your grand theory of
HIV epidemiology. Are you an epidemiologist? Do you live in Florida?
Have you voted there? You certainly have had a lot to say about how
voting works in Florida over the past few years.

You don't have to serve in the guard to be able to read a transfer
request denial from personel headquarters. Or are there hidden
messages in it that you only learn how to decifer after you've
served?


It is obvious that you will reject anything which counters your
preconceived opinion, but the simple fact is, one who is in the Guard


How could you possibly know? You have not offered anything that counters
my notions - preconceived or otherwise. All I know is that every actual
document I've seen clearly shows he asked for a transfer, it was denied,
but he still didn't show up at Ellington for a year. He did show up one
day at Dannelly to have his teeth examined. Other than that, there are
only generalizations about whether he was paid (which proves nothing
other than he was paid) and his discharge (which proves nothing because
the two Washington guardsmen who failed their HRP were both honorably
discharged).

is much more qualified to speak to the operation of the Guard than one
who has not.


This is ludicrous. It's like saying a school child is more qualified to
tell you how a school district functions than a superintendant who
didn't attend that particular school district.

I never served. I do not pretend to know everything about
how the Guard works, except that it was occasionally necessary for My
Dad to miss drills, this was no problem, he would make them up later.
The concept of equivalent training is not one which I am familiar
with, but it does stand to reason that there would be provisions for
Guardsmen to do such, after all, they all had civilian jobs.

My dad was in the Army. I suspect that if he had asked for a transfer
from Fort Bragg to another base and had had that request denied but
still failed to show up at Fort Bragg for 12 months, he would have been
court martialled. But then, his daddy wasn't a congressman.

One more point, there has been at least one individual who served with
George Bush in the Texas Guard, and according to this individual, Bush
did nothing wrong. My suggestion to you fools who keep beating this
dead horse would be to get a life.

This one individual you mention served with Bush in Texas from 70-71.
Why would you think his statements have any bearing on Bush's service
from 72-73?

http://users.cis.net/coldfeet/doc9.gif

"Lt. Bush has not been observed at this unit during the period of
report. A civilian occupation made it necessary for him to move to
Montgomery, Alabama. He cleared this base on 15 May 1972 and has been
performing equivalent training in a non-flying status with the 187 TAC
recon Gp, Dannelly ANG Base, Alabama."

[signed]
"William D. Harris, Jr. Lt Col. Pilot, Flt Intcp"
"Jerry D. Killian, Lt. Col. Squadron Commander"

Both signatures dated 2 May 1973 [50 weeks after the date Bush "cleared
this base."]

http://users.cis.net/coldfeet/doc5.gif

"Application for Reserve Assignment, Bush, George W, 1sr Lt

"TAG Texas

"1. Application for Reserve Assignment for First Lieutenant Bush is
returned.

"2. A review of his Master Personel Record shows he has a Military
Service Obligation until 26 May 1974. Under provisions of paragraph 30-6
n (4), AFM 35-3, an obligated Reservist can be assigned to a specific
Ready Reserve position only. Therefore, he is ineligible for assignment
to an Air Reserve Squadron."

signed by The Director of Personnel Resources on 24 May 1972.

9 days *after* Bush "cleared" his prior posting. Bush failed to return
to his post in Texas for another 47 weeks after that. That is desertion
of duty. You cannot spin it any other way. You can pull strings (if your
Poppy) but you cannot change the fact that Bush's transfer request was
denied and he still failed to return to his post for nearly a year.




--
"We gave Hussein a chance to allow inspectors in, and he wouldn't let
them in."
- George WMD. Bush, lying on July 14, 2003.
  #6  
Old March 28th 04, 10:05 PM
Buzzer
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

On 28 Mar 2004 15:15:40 GMT, Republican Double Standard
wrote:

He did show up one
day at Dannelly to have his teeth examined.


That was Jan. 6, 1973?

How about his shot records under polio it has a date of 73APR.
No base given though. If this date isn't in his guard pay records
maybe he is owed training time and back pay for 73APR?

At most bases I have been at the dental clinic and the hospital were
in separate buildings. You had to go to the hospital to get shots.
I could see Bush missing his physical because he got lost on base and
couldn't find the hospital, but he could find the dental clinic. Now
the shot records prove he could also find his way to the hospital!

  #7  
Old March 28th 04, 10:48 PM
BUFDRVR
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

which proves nothing because
the two Washington guardsmen who failed their HRP were both honorably
discharged


You are a clueless SOB aren't you? Removal from PRP (modern day equivelent of
HRP) is non-punitive. You may be removed (temporary or permanent) from PRP due
to illegal activity (drugs, DUI or generally any crime), but being removed in
and of itself doesn't constitute illegal behavior. We had a guy in my missile
squadron permenantly decertified for having a tremendous credit problem. It
bordered on illegality, but he was never charged. Bottom line, he was removed
from PRP, cross trained into communications (I think?) and was never worse the
wear for it. You need to get a clue before you open your mouth, you're looking
pretty foolish.

This is ludicrous. It's like saying a school child is more qualified to
tell you how a school district functions than a superintendant who
didn't attend that particular school district.


In your case, you are not nearly as knowledgeable as a school superintendant.
Keeping with your anology, I'd say you're a person who once read about school.

My dad was in the Army. I suspect that if he had asked for a transfer
from Fort Bragg to another base and had had that request denied but
still failed to show up at Fort Bragg for 12 months, he would have been
court martialled. But then, his daddy wasn't a congressman.


Your knowledge about how active duty works (although far from complicated)
seems complete, but you need to stick to that aspect since you've no idea how
the guard or reserves work. Don't feel bad. neither do I, the BUFF reserve guys
I've played golf with confuse the hell out of me. Had a guy activated after
9-11, do a stint over Afghanistan, return to CONUS and then finish his
activiation teaching ROTC at Colorado State Univ. Guard & reserve guys can do
some interesting stuff.


BUFDRVR

"Stay on the bomb run boys, I'm gonna get those bomb doors open if it harelips
everyone on Bear Creek"
 




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