Air America breaking news: "USA to fingerprint ALL visitors !!!"

On Sat, 3 Apr 2004 07:55:44 -0600, "Quantum Foam Guy"
wrote:

"Oelewapper" wrote in message
...
Dear allies, welcome to the age of digital fascism... :

This is not "fascism", unless you're one of those morons who thinks dealing
with the DMV and getting fingerprinted for a driver's license is "fascism".

Having finger-prints taken for a driving licence? Maybe in Cuba, the
former DDR, or some other 'big brother' regime, but certainly not in
any free country. Finger-printing is for criminals.



--==++AJC++==--

"AJC" wrote in message
...
Having finger-prints taken for a driving licence? Maybe in Cuba, the
former DDR, or some other 'big brother' regime, but certainly not in
any free country. Finger-printing is for criminals.


So how can we identify a person other than fingerprints? Passports, DLs, and
every other form of ID have been no problem to duplicate for terrorists.

In article ,
"Brian" writes:

"AJC" wrote in message
...
Having finger-prints taken for a driving licence? Maybe in Cuba, the
former DDR, or some other 'big brother' regime, but certainly not in
any free country. Finger-printing is for criminals.


So how can we identify a person other than fingerprints? Passports, DLs, and
every other form of ID have been no problem to duplicate for terrorists.

Fingerprints aren't reliable, either. It seems that a number of agents
of the former Iraqi regime, and Al-Queda agents as well, have been
found travelling under Kuwaiti papers, with the appropriate
fingerprints on file. It seems that when Iraq took Kuwait in 1990,
Saddam's intel folks took the opportunity to plant some sleeper IDs,
and they've been renting them out.

--
Pete Stickney
A strong conviction that something must be done is the parent of many
bad measures. -- Daniel Webster

On Sat, 3 Apr 2004 10:04:43 -0500, "Brian"
wrote:


"AJC" wrote in message
.. .
Having finger-prints taken for a driving licence? Maybe in Cuba, the
former DDR, or some other 'big brother' regime, but certainly not in
any free country. Finger-printing is for criminals.


So how can we identify a person other than fingerprints? Passports, DLs, and
every other form of ID have been no problem to duplicate for terrorists.

You could always wait for the biometric passports to arrive. The
reason the fingerprinting is being extended is that thebiometric
passports mandated by the US congress are running a little late (for
example the UK expects to have them available frommid-2005).

Oh, and just curious, but what's stopping the terrorists using
Canadian or US passports?

I'm just glad I get an exemption from the process thanks to a nice
shiny government visa, because otherwise I would *ot* come to the US
again as I object to being fingerprinted without even being accused of
a crime...or indeed of a crime even haivng been committed I could be
accused of.

---
Peter Kemp

Life is short - drink faster

Peter Kemp wrote:
I'm just glad I get an exemption from the process thanks to a nice
shiny government visa, because otherwise I would *ot* come to the US

I thought it was currently the opposite: all those entering on a visa are fingerprinted.
In october, it will be all travellers whether on a real visa, or a 90 day visa waiver.

On Sat, 03 Apr 2004 15:32:04 -0400, nobody wrote:

Peter Kemp wrote:
I'm just glad I get an exemption from the process thanks to a nice
shiny government visa, because otherwise I would *ot* come to the US

I thought it was currently the opposite: all those entering on a visa are fingerprinted.
In october, it will be all travellers whether on a real visa, or a 90 day visa waiver.

For standard tourist visas you are correct, anyone holding one goes
through the process. I've got a different type of visa as I'm in the
US on UK government business. Which is exempt from the procedures (and
also means that I tend to spend less time at immigration even than US
citizens).
Still takes too bloody long though - of the 30+ countries I've been
to, entering over half I've never had to spend more than 20 seconds at
immigration (and quite often just walk past showing the *outside* of
my UK passport), and I'll be buggered if they're getting my
fingerprints without a fight.

---
Peter Kemp

Life is short - drink faster

In article ,
Peter Kemp wrote:

Still takes too bloody long though - of the 30+ countries I've been
to, entering over half I've never had to spend more than 20 seconds at
immigration (and quite often just walk past showing the *outside* of
my UK passport), and I'll be buggered if they're getting my
fingerprints without a fight.

Really funny.

The folks from countries with government-sponsored health care, with the
government knowing the results of their last rectal exams, are worried
about fingerprints...

--
cirby at cfl.rr.com

Remember: Objects in rearview mirror may be hallucinations.
Slam on brakes accordingly.

On Sat, 03 Apr 2004 19:18:12 -0500, Peter Kemp
wrote:

On Sat, 03 Apr 2004 15:32:04 -0400, nobody wrote:

Peter Kemp wrote:
I'm just glad I get an exemption from the process thanks to a nice
shiny government visa, because otherwise I would *ot* come to the US

I thought it was currently the opposite: all those entering on a visa are fingerprinted.
In october, it will be all travellers whether on a real visa, or a 90 day visa waiver.

For standard tourist visas you are correct, anyone holding one goes
through the process. I've got a different type of visa as I'm in the
US on UK government business. Which is exempt from the procedures (and
also means that I tend to spend less time at immigration even than US
citizens).
Still takes too bloody long though - of the 30+ countries I've been
to, entering over half I've never had to spend more than 20 seconds at
immigration (and quite often just walk past showing the *outside* of
my UK passport), and I'll be buggered if they're getting my
fingerprints without a fight.

---

That surprises me. You must have a very special visa. Even the visas
that airline crews hold have required them to be fingerprinted and
photographed each time they enter the US since January this year. Air
New Zealand crew members were telling me it routinely takes them an
hour to get through the formalities at LAX.
--==++AJC++==--

Brian wrote:
So how can we identify a person other than fingerprints? Passports, DLs, and
every other form of ID have been no problem to duplicate for terrorists.

And just how will the usa verify your fingerprints ? If you're a foreigner who
has never been to the USA, your fingerprints will be "virgin". So terrorists
will now know that they can only travel once to the USA since on a second
attempt, they might be spotted.

Where this would make a difference is if someone with same fingerprints enters
with different identity. They might be able to spot them.

What remains to be seen is whether computers really have the ability to match
fingerprints in real-time over such a high volume database since it won't be
just criminals anymore, it will be all visitors.

Where will it stop ? Will the USA then ask for a blood sample so that they can
register your complete DNA ?

In article , nobody
wrote:

Brian wrote:
So how can we identify a person other than fingerprints? Passports,
DLs, and every other form of ID have been no problem to duplicate
for terrorists.

And just how will the usa verify your fingerprints ?

By comparing them to known terrorists. Pretty simple, really. They can
fake IDs (or get them issued "officially" from many countries), but it's
a bit harder to fake fingerprints.

If you're a foreigner who has never been to the USA, your
fingerprints will be "virgin".

Not so. We have a lot of records of known bad guys from other sources.

--
cirby at cfl.rr.com

Remember: Objects in rearview mirror may be hallucinations.
Slam on brakes accordingly.