Stall/spin and ground reference maneuvers

Airspeed and coordination - it's only two items, yet so many people lose
track of one or the other or both.

Great, thought-provoking, thread, with excellent points-n-perspectives all
around. And though I doubt what's below will add anything not already noted,
repetition is often useful in learning...

I flew gliders (only) for more than a decade before learning of "pivotal
altitude" (from an article in "Soaring" magazine as I recall). By then,
reading had also alerted me to a whole bunch of other not-then-experienced
optical illusions and "altered visual perspectives" pilots could encounter.
Meanwhile, I'd been flying successfully enough I'd not yet (or to-date) come
even vaguely close to an unexpected departure from controlled flight in the
landing pattern, despite "the usual number" of off-field landings by then.

Yet by the time I became aware of "pivotal altitude" I knew of dead pilots -
soaring and otherwise - who evidently HAD experienced unexpected departures
from controlled flight in landing patterns (mostly at airports), including
some with gobs more time than I. My conclusion? Clearly, failure to pay
attention to and control airspeed and coordination (neither being more
important than the other, IMO) - as noted above - could easily be my last mistake.

The $64,000 question is: How can a person "become immune" from making the
mistake(s) in the landing pattern that lead to NOT always being able to
effectively monitor/control airspeed & coordination in the pattern?

IMO, education is good. (Duh!) And given the complex differences among humans,
the idea of making students aware of all known possible distractions (visual
and otherwise) in landing patterns is probably a good instructional thing, and
- clearly - conveying in practical terms the "look and feel" of pivotal
altitude cannot be done in a sailplane. So if you're one of the lucky ones who
can always monitor and effectively control airspeed and coordination in your
landing patterns, then probably no need for power-plane exposure to pivotal
altitude. But for anyone uncertain of their capabilities...maybe it'd be a
great idea to go get some personal exposure with a power instructor you're
certain is knowledgeable of - and confident about their ability to safely
teach - the concept. For I suspect not all instructors ARE safely qualified to
expose students to the pivotal altitude concept. (I hope I'm wrong, but when
it's my life at stake, I tend to be conservative! :-) )

Bob W.

In my very short 8 years of glider only flight I've witnessed 4 pattern mishaps (no fatalities, fortunately). Two happened because the pilots wouldn't truncate their patterns even though they could see that they were way too low, one happened because an instructor pulled the release too low, and the last happened because I believed my altimeter when it said I was too high (I'd set it wrong and wasn't fully versed in TLAR). Fortunately I didn't damage either myself or the glider, but the incipient low altitude stall I experienced that day is something I'll never forget.

Is it possible to "become immune" from making mistakes in the pattern. I don't think so. All you can do is to give your full attention to flying the airplane properly. Prioritize tasks for different phases of the pattern and try your very best to execute them perfectly.

-John, Q3

On Tuesday, March 4, 2014 12:22:39 PM UTC-5, Bob Whelan wrote:
I flew gliders (only) for more than a decade before learning of "pivotal
altitude" (from an article in "Soaring" magazine as I recall). By then,
reading had also alerted me to a whole bunch of other not-then-experienced
optical illusions and "altered visual perspectives" pilots could encounter.

Meanwhile, I'd been flying successfully enough I'd not yet (or to-date) come
even vaguely close to an unexpected departure from controlled flight in the
landing pattern, despite "the usual number" of off-field landings by then..

Yet by the time I became aware of "pivotal altitude" I knew of dead pilots -
soaring and otherwise - who evidently HAD experienced unexpected departures
from controlled flight in landing patterns (mostly at airports), including
some with gobs more time than I. My conclusion? Clearly, failure to pay
attention to and control airspeed and coordination (neither being more
important than the other, IMO) - as noted above - could easily be my last mistake.

The $64,000 question is: How can a person "become immune" from making the
mistake(s) in the landing pattern that lead to NOT always being able to
effectively monitor/control airspeed & coordination in the pattern?

IMO, education is good. (Duh!) And given the complex differences among humans,
the idea of making students aware of all known possible distractions (visual
and otherwise) in landing patterns is probably a good instructional thing, and
- clearly - conveying in practical terms the "look and feel" of pivotal
altitude cannot be done in a sailplane. So if you're one of the lucky ones who
can always monitor and effectively control airspeed and coordination in your
landing patterns, then probably no need for power-plane exposure to pivotal
= altitude. But for anyone uncertain of their capabilities...maybe it'd be a
great idea to go get some personal exposure with a power instructor you're
certain is knowledgeable of - and confident about their ability to safely
teach - the concept. For I suspect not all instructors ARE safely qualified to
expose students to the pivotal altitude concept. (I hope I'm wrong, but when
it's my life at stake, I tend to be conservative! :-) )

Bob W.

On 3/4/2014 11:23 AM, John Carlyle wrote:
Snip...
Is it possible to "become immune" from making mistakes in the pattern. I
don't think so. All you can do is to give your full attention to flying the
airplane properly. Prioritize tasks for different phases of the pattern and
try your very best to execute them perfectly.

-John, Q3

Yup!


On Tuesday, March 4, 2014 12:22:39 PM UTC-5, Bob Whelan wrote:
Snip...
The $64,000 question is: How can a person "become immune" from making
the mistake(s) in the landing pattern that lead to NOT always being able
to effectively monitor/control airspeed & coordination in the pattern?

We agree on the impossibility of "becom[ing] immune" from making mistakes in
the pattern (or anywhere else/hence my original quotes). Human perfection
isn't an option.

In addition to that assumption, another of my operating assumptions is an
assumed life-critical need for continual monitoring of "things" crucial to
continuing achievement of my intentions...in this case not departing from
controlled flight in the landing pattern.

Goal (see next paragraph) achieved by: pilot control inputs (required to
achieve goal); monitoring of flight conditions/path; corrective feedback loop
to control inputs. Continue circularly until a new goal can be set and begun
acting upon...

In every landing pattern, my unchanging Primary Goal is to land safely,
without hitting anything other than mother earth - in the intended manner and
near some specifically selected desired location - with appropriate
amount/vectors of kinetic energy. Personally, I think that ought to be the
goal of every pilot's landing patterns. :-)

However Joe Pilot achieves that goal is inextricably linked with how their
brain works, hence the potential value of these sorts of brain-engaging
discussions, in my view...

Bob W.

Very good point, Bob (how their brain works). I know that there are many ways to accomplish almost everything, but as an engineer I know that only a few are "safe" and/or "efficient" and usually only one is "elegant". What fascinates me is watching someone else solving the same problem and seeing things they come up with that I never thought of...

-John, Q3

On Tuesday, March 4, 2014 2:11:00 PM UTC-5, Bob Whelan wrote:
In every landing pattern, my unchanging Primary Goal is to land safely,
without hitting anything other than mother earth - in the intended manner and
near some specifically selected desired location - with appropriate
amount/vectors of kinetic energy. Personally, I think that ought to be the
goal of every pilot's landing patterns. :-)

However Joe Pilot achieves that goal is inextricably linked with how their
brain works, hence the potential value of these sorts of brain-engaging
discussions, in my view...

Bob W.