The highly successful UK Junior XC program vs. USA's nonexistantJunior XC program. Why?

Very well said.

On Monday, September 14, 2015 at 12:15:51 PM UTC-7, Andy Gough wrote:
On Monday, September 14, 2015 at 2:45:41 AM UTC-4, Andy Blackburn wrote:
On Sunday, September 13, 2015 at 11:22:38 PM UTC-7, Andy Blackburn wrote:

I've been noodling on a few ideas for about a year now and have come to the conclusion that we really need to understand better where the bottleneck is: intake (seems not from the data), getting to solo, getting to first XC or getting to advanced XC/racing-ready? We also need to understand the state of the junior population and what the constraints are. The solution really needs to fit the problem - even then it would take energy, commitment and resources.


In addition to the bottlenecks to progress there needs to be an assessment of where we lose juniors in the process because it's pretty obvious that not all of them are making it into full-fledged XC and racing pilots as adults. Do the commitments of the last couple of years of high school get them? College? Moving into the working world? It's not just development, but retention that need a hard, analytical look. Right now we have a good number of opinions and anecdotes that can lead us where to look, but how much of what effects prevail when and where probably needs to be assessed at more than a cursory level. I've heard heartfelt proposed solutions over the years that I suspect a first-order look at the actual data would show to be fruitless.

Andy

There is a long way to go before we can begin to emulate the European gliding scene and as Alexander Schwagermakers pointed out you need to start somewhere. I believe the start point is long before the provision of contest aircraft for juniors to fly.

Club's must be willing to promote cross country and just as important is the organization of club resources to attain the objective. The clever ones would plan their fleets to provide aircraft for a variety of flying opportunities and promote standards that once attained would allow pilots to advance to higher performance aircraft. The aircraft at the top of the scale would be maintained expressly for cross country. The example citing the inconvenience to a member who would have to forfeit his flight to a cross country pilot would not occur, e.g. an LS4 is not a local soaring aircraft, for a one hour float around the airfield a 1-26, Ka8 or similar glider is perfectly adequate. Some clubs in Europe refine this process by allocating aircraft on a daily basis for cross country soaring. Not only is an aircraft allocated, also a weather briefing is conducted and a task set. Pilots who are not allocated an aircraft become willing retrieve crew knowing they will have the benefit of the same when it is their turn to fly. Pilots who are allocated an aircraft have the incentive to attempt the task knowing help has already been organized should they need a retrieve. Just like gaggle flying, groups can get better results even when conditions are not optimal.

The Europeans who have contributed to this discussion have intimated the club culture in Europe encourages cross country regardless of age. Sean is convinced this is not the case this side of the pond, I concur. Not every pilot is going to become a contest pilot, the same for juniors but many more would if cross country flying was made available and promoted in a meaningful way. Low costs and the availability of aircraft go a long way to enabling more pilots to gain the time and skills cross country flying requires. Convince the clubs that it is in their best interests to organize their activities to promote higher standards that lead to cross country flying and we might have a starting point for a revival.

Here's an additional challenge. About a year ago I took a look at the club fleet as listed on the "where to fly" section of SSA.org. It appears that the numbers of even two-generations-old fiberglass aircraft in the US fleet is extremely limited - like a handful. Maybe that's not totally up-to-date, but it seems likely that not only is it possible that club policies may restrict pilots of any age from going cross-country, but the equipment itself isn't all that suited for the task. Not that you can't go cross-country in a 1-26, but, as I can personally can attest from my early days flying cross-county in a 1-34, it's not exactly a picnic.

I'd be curious to know the exact level of development of the nearly 800 youth pilots currently holding SSA memberships. That's a pretty decent number, but if there is limited development, or ability to build skills, then that's the first problem - be it policies, equipment or some combination.

Andy
9B

At 19:15 14 September 2015, Andy Gough wrote:
On Monday, September 14, 2015 at 2:45:41 AM UTC-4, Andy Blackburn wrote:
On Sunday, September 13, 2015 at 11:22:38 PM UTC-7, Andy Blackburn
wrote:
=20
I've been noodling on a few ideas for about a year now and have come
to=
the conclusion that we really need to understand better where the
bottlene=
ck is: intake (seems not from the data), getting to solo, getting to
first
=
XC or getting to advanced XC/racing-ready? We also need to understand the
s=
tate of the junior population and what the constraints are. The solution
re=
ally needs to fit the problem - even then it would take energy,
commitment
=
and resources.=20
=20
=20
In addition to the bottlenecks to progress there needs to be an
assessmen=
t of where we lose juniors in the process because it's pretty obvious
that
=
not all of them are making it into full-fledged XC and racing pilots as
adu=
lts. Do the commitments of the last couple of years of high school get
them=
? College? Moving into the working world? It's not just development, but
re=
tention that need a hard, analytical look. Right now we have a good
number
=
of opinions and anecdotes that can lead us where to look, but how much of
w=
hat effects prevail when and where probably needs to be assessed at more
th=
an a cursory level. I've heard heartfelt proposed solutions over the
years
=
that I suspect a first-order look at the actual data would show to be
fruit=
less.
=20
Andy

There is a long way to go before we can begin to emulate the European
glidi=
ng scene and as Alexander Schwagermakers pointed out you need to start
some=
where. I believe the start point is long before the provision of contest
ai=
rcraft for juniors to fly.

Club's must be willing to promote cross country and just as important is
th=
e organization of club resources to attain the objective. The clever ones
w=
ould plan their fleets to provide aircraft for a variety of flying
opportun=
ities and promote standards that once attained would allow pilots to
advanc=
e to higher performance aircraft. The aircraft at the top of the scale
woul=
d be maintained expressly for cross country. The example citing the
inconve=
nience to a member who would have to forfeit his flight to a cross
country
=
pilot would not occur, e.g. an LS4 is not a local soaring aircraft, for a
o=
ne hour float around the airfield a 1-26, Ka8 or similar glider is
perfectl=
y adequate. Some clubs in Europe refine this process by allocating
aircraft=
on a daily basis for cross country soaring. Not only is an aircraft
alloca=
ted, also a weather briefing is conducted and a task set. Pilots who are
no=
t allocated an aircraft become willing retrieve crew knowing they will
have=
the benefit of the same when it is their turn to fly. Pilots who are
alloc=
ated an aircraft have the incentive to attempt the task knowing help has
al=
ready been organized should they need a retrieve. Just like gaggle
flying,
=
groups can get better results even when conditions are not optimal.

The Europeans who have contributed to this discussion have intimated the
cl=
ub culture in Europe encourages cross country regardless of age. Sean is
co=
nvinced this is not the case this side of the pond, I concur. Not every
pil=
ot is going to become a contest pilot, the same for juniors but many more
w=
ould if cross country flying was made available and promoted in a
meaningfu=
l way. Low costs and the availability of aircraft go a long way to
enabling=
more pilots to gain the time and skills cross country flying requires.
Con=
vince the clubs that it is in their best interests to organize their
activi=
ties to promote higher standards that lead to cross country flying and we
m=
ight have a starting point for a revival.


Interesting thread, and really a continuation of the “How do we
inspire� topic that Sean began here
http://ras.gliderpilot.net/?op=s2&id=282714&vt= and Andy Gough has it.
I would guess not many joggers jog competitively- if they were told that to
enjoy their recreation they had to race I suspect the majority response
might be rude. Not many glider pilots race competitively – what is it
5%, maybe only 2%. Soaring, even cross-country soaring is, for most, not a
race. I think those promoting soaring as a primarily competitive endeavour
do it no favours.

That's one thing. The other is the club thing. I've heard it said what
clubs need is more people like them. Many have a choice of one and,
depending on the club, Joe Public might think “Jeez no way I'm joining
that�. And some are clubmen, some just aren't. Long-time club
membership declines should encourage us to conclude there simply are not
enough “people like them� out there and to broaden the appeal stuff
needs fixing (I know its not the same everywhere). If the clubs are the
problem, the only alternative is that newcomers don't have to join them to
go soaring. Another discussion.

Showing newbies soaring and how its done as a “why we do it� and, at
the right point cross-country soaring too, without having them believe its
all about racing, could bring better results. The club culture thing is
harder. It should be the case that folk join clubs because they want to
not because they have to. Cross-country soaring should be an easy and
achievable aspiration but not all will want to do it. Of those that do
get the XC bug we cannot expect much more than the existing tiny minority
to have the commitment, time and money to take it as far as racing.
Therefore, to end up with more racing pilots means starting with a whole
lot more cross-country “joggers�, most of whom will quite reasonably
only ever want to enjoy the jogging.

On Monday, September 14, 2015 at 3:15:51 PM UTC-4, Andy Gough wrote:
On Monday, September 14, 2015 at 2:45:41 AM UTC-4, Andy Blackburn wrote:
On Sunday, September 13, 2015 at 11:22:38 PM UTC-7, Andy Blackburn wrote:

I've been noodling on a few ideas for about a year now and have come to the conclusion that we really need to understand better where the bottleneck is: intake (seems not from the data), getting to solo, getting to first XC or getting to advanced XC/racing-ready? We also need to understand the state of the junior population and what the constraints are. The solution really needs to fit the problem - even then it would take energy, commitment and resources.


In addition to the bottlenecks to progress there needs to be an assessment of where we lose juniors in the process because it's pretty obvious that not all of them are making it into full-fledged XC and racing pilots as adults. Do the commitments of the last couple of years of high school get them? College? Moving into the working world? It's not just development, but retention that need a hard, analytical look. Right now we have a good number of opinions and anecdotes that can lead us where to look, but how much of what effects prevail when and where probably needs to be assessed at more than a cursory level. I've heard heartfelt proposed solutions over the years that I suspect a first-order look at the actual data would show to be fruitless.

Andy

There is a long way to go before we can begin to emulate the European gliding scene and as Alexander Schwagermakers pointed out you need to start somewhere. I believe the start point is long before the provision of contest aircraft for juniors to fly.

Club's must be willing to promote cross country and just as important is the organization of club resources to attain the objective. The clever ones would plan their fleets to provide aircraft for a variety of flying opportunities and promote standards that once attained would allow pilots to advance to higher performance aircraft. The aircraft at the top of the scale would be maintained expressly for cross country. The example citing the inconvenience to a member who would have to forfeit his flight to a cross country pilot would not occur, e.g. an LS4 is not a local soaring aircraft, for a one hour float around the airfield a 1-26, Ka8 or similar glider is perfectly adequate. Some clubs in Europe refine this process by allocating aircraft on a daily basis for cross country soaring. Not only is an aircraft allocated, also a weather briefing is conducted and a task set. Pilots who are not allocated an aircraft become willing retrieve crew knowing they will have the benefit of the same when it is their turn to fly. Pilots who are allocated an aircraft have the incentive to attempt the task knowing help has already been organized should they need a retrieve. Just like gaggle flying, groups can get better results even when conditions are not optimal.

The Europeans who have contributed to this discussion have intimated the club culture in Europe encourages cross country regardless of age. Sean is convinced this is not the case this side of the pond, I concur. Not every pilot is going to become a contest pilot, the same for juniors but many more would if cross country flying was made available and promoted in a meaningful way. Low costs and the availability of aircraft go a long way to enabling more pilots to gain the time and skills cross country flying requires. Convince the clubs that it is in their best interests to organize their activities to promote higher standards that lead to cross country flying and we might have a starting point for a revival.

+100. It requires real work to create an XC culture in a club. There are plenty of clubs in the US with high-class fleets that never go more than 10 miles from the home field. There are clubs with ratty (but capable) gliders that rack up the OLC points and badges. While a well-organized approach would be best, even seemingly tactical activities are better than nothing.

Greg Delp just organized a very successful OLC weekend at a small club in Connecticut. I'd venture a guess that there wasn't a large committee involved. Just a couple of sparkplugs.

If each SSA Director or State Governor simply made an effort to promote XC and Junior XC in particular in his/her region, it would only take a relatively small number of "hits" to generate a reasonable population of junior XC pilots in the US. Once there are a few converts in a club or region, there's a critical mass to hold a local junior get together with maybe 10 pilots. But, typing on RAS and bashing the "system" won't get it done.

To steal a line from Nike: Just Do It.

p3

Seems to be working a little bit!

"If your opponent is of choleric temperament, seek to irritate him." -Sun Tzu

Sean
7T

On Tuesday, September 15, 2015 at 11:34:01 AM UTC-4, Papa3 wrote:
On Monday, September 14, 2015 at 3:15:51 PM UTC-4, Andy Gough wrote:
On Monday, September 14, 2015 at 2:45:41 AM UTC-4, Andy Blackburn wrote:
On Sunday, September 13, 2015 at 11:22:38 PM UTC-7, Andy Blackburn wrote:

I've been noodling on a few ideas for about a year now and have come to the conclusion that we really need to understand better where the bottleneck is: intake (seems not from the data), getting to solo, getting to first XC or getting to advanced XC/racing-ready? We also need to understand the state of the junior population and what the constraints are. The solution really needs to fit the problem - even then it would take energy, commitment and resources.


In addition to the bottlenecks to progress there needs to be an assessment of where we lose juniors in the process because it's pretty obvious that not all of them are making it into full-fledged XC and racing pilots as adults. Do the commitments of the last couple of years of high school get them? College? Moving into the working world? It's not just development, but retention that need a hard, analytical look. Right now we have a good number of opinions and anecdotes that can lead us where to look, but how much of what effects prevail when and where probably needs to be assessed at more than a cursory level. I've heard heartfelt proposed solutions over the years that I suspect a first-order look at the actual data would show to be fruitless.

Andy

There is a long way to go before we can begin to emulate the European gliding scene and as Alexander Schwagermakers pointed out you need to start somewhere. I believe the start point is long before the provision of contest aircraft for juniors to fly.

Club's must be willing to promote cross country and just as important is the organization of club resources to attain the objective. The clever ones would plan their fleets to provide aircraft for a variety of flying opportunities and promote standards that once attained would allow pilots to advance to higher performance aircraft. The aircraft at the top of the scale would be maintained expressly for cross country. The example citing the inconvenience to a member who would have to forfeit his flight to a cross country pilot would not occur, e.g. an LS4 is not a local soaring aircraft, for a one hour float around the airfield a 1-26, Ka8 or similar glider is perfectly adequate. Some clubs in Europe refine this process by allocating aircraft on a daily basis for cross country soaring. Not only is an aircraft allocated, also a weather briefing is conducted and a task set. Pilots who are not allocated an aircraft become willing retrieve crew knowing they will have the benefit of the same when it is their turn to fly. Pilots who are allocated an aircraft have the incentive to attempt the task knowing help has already been organized should they need a retrieve. Just like gaggle flying, groups can get better results even when conditions are not optimal.

The Europeans who have contributed to this discussion have intimated the club culture in Europe encourages cross country regardless of age. Sean is convinced this is not the case this side of the pond, I concur. Not every pilot is going to become a contest pilot, the same for juniors but many more would if cross country flying was made available and promoted in a meaningful way. Low costs and the availability of aircraft go a long way to enabling more pilots to gain the time and skills cross country flying requires. Convince the clubs that it is in their best interests to organize their activities to promote higher standards that lead to cross country flying and we might have a starting point for a revival.

+100. It requires real work to create an XC culture in a club. There are plenty of clubs in the US with high-class fleets that never go more than 10 miles from the home field. There are clubs with ratty (but capable) gliders that rack up the OLC points and badges. While a well-organized approach would be best, even seemingly tactical activities are better than nothing.

Greg Delp just organized a very successful OLC weekend at a small club in Connecticut. I'd venture a guess that there wasn't a large committee involved. Just a couple of sparkplugs.

If each SSA Director or State Governor simply made an effort to promote XC and Junior XC in particular in his/her region, it would only take a relatively small number of "hits" to generate a reasonable population of junior XC pilots in the US. Once there are a few converts in a club or region, there's a critical mass to hold a local junior get together with maybe 10 pilots. But, typing on RAS and bashing the "system" won't get it done.

To steal a line from Nike: Just Do It.

p3

I hope I will know more later in the year ,I have volunteered to fly some
in
my duo when the circus visits my club in October .
From what I remember when my kids were juniors ,
They learn at a ferocious rate though not necessary consciously and have
reflexes that you have forgotten about.
The partying is nearly as important and it's the peer pressure keeps them
trying.
My old Chief flying instructors worried more about the conciencious 60 year

old early solo pilot than the 16 year old ,the junior will sort it out ,the
senior
will still be thinking about it when the sinsipient has turned into a
......
Remember fighter pilots are usually young or at least used to be.

At 16:41 15 September 2015, Sean Fidler wrote:
Seems to be working a little bit!

"If your opponent is of choleric temperament, seek to irritate him."
-Sun
=
Tzu

Sean
7T

On Tuesday, September 15, 2015 at 11:34:01 AM UTC-4, Papa3 wrote:
On Monday, September 14, 2015 at 3:15:51 PM UTC-4, Andy Gough
wrote:
On Monday, September 14, 2015 at 2:45:41 AM UTC-4, Andy
Blackburn
wrote=
:
On Sunday, September 13, 2015 at 11:22:38 PM UTC-7, Andy
Blackburn
wr=
ote:
=20
I've been noodling on a few ideas for about a year now and have
com=
e to the conclusion that we really need to understand better where the
bott=
leneck is: intake (seems not from the data), getting to solo, getting to
fi=
rst XC or getting to advanced XC/racing-ready? We also need to understand
t=
he state of the junior population and what the constraints are. The
solutio=
n really needs to fit the problem - even then it would take energy,
commitm=
ent and resources.=20
=20
=20
In addition to the bottlenecks to progress there needs to be an
asses=
sment of where we lose juniors in the process because it's pretty obvious
t=
hat not all of them are making it into full-fledged XC and racing pilots
as=
adults. Do the commitments of the last couple of years of high school
get
=
them? College? Moving into the working world? It's not just development,
bu=
t retention that need a hard, analytical look. Right now we have a good
num=
ber of opinions and anecdotes that can lead us where to look, but how
much
=
of what effects prevail when and where probably needs to be assessed at
mor=
e than a cursory level. I've heard heartfelt proposed solutions over the
ye=
ars that I suspect a first-order look at the actual data would show to be
f=
ruitless.
=20
Andy
=20
There is a long way to go before we can begin to emulate the European
g=
liding scene and as Alexander Schwagermakers pointed out you need to
start
=
somewhere. I believe the start point is long before the provision of
contes=
t aircraft for juniors to fly.
=20
Club's must be willing to promote cross country and just as important
i=
s the organization of club resources to attain the objective. The clever
on=
es would plan their fleets to provide aircraft for a variety of flying
oppo=
rtunities and promote standards that once attained would allow pilots to
ad=
vance to higher performance aircraft. The aircraft at the top of the
scale
=
would be maintained expressly for cross country. The example citing the
inc=
onvenience to a member who would have to forfeit his flight to a cross
coun=
try pilot would not occur, e.g. an LS4 is not a local soaring aircraft,
for=
a one hour float around the airfield a 1-26, Ka8 or similar glider is
perf=
ectly adequate. Some clubs in Europe refine this process by allocating
airc=
raft on a daily basis for cross country soaring. Not only is an aircraft
al=
located, also a weather briefing is conducted and a task set. Pilots who
ar=
e not allocated an aircraft become willing retrieve crew knowing they
will
=
have the benefit of the same when it is their turn to fly. Pilots who are
a=
llocated an aircraft have the incentive to attempt the task knowing help
ha=
s already been organized should they need a retrieve. Just like gaggle
flyi=
ng, groups can get better results even when conditions are not optimal.
=20
The Europeans who have contributed to this discussion have intimated
th=
e club culture in Europe encourages cross country regardless of age. Sean
i=
s convinced this is not the case this side of the pond, I concur. Not
every=
pilot is going to become a contest pilot, the same for juniors but many
mo=
re would if cross country flying was made available and promoted in a
meani=
ngful way. Low costs and the availability of aircraft go a long way to
enab=
ling more pilots to gain the time and skills cross country flying
requires.=
Convince the clubs that it is in their best interests to organize their
ac=
tivities to promote higher standards that lead to cross country flying
and
=
we might have a starting point for a revival.
=20
+100. It requires real work to create an XC culture in a club. There
a=
re plenty of clubs in the US with high-class fleets that never go more
than=
10 miles from the home field. There are clubs with ratty (but capable)
g=
liders that rack up the OLC points and badges. While a well-organized
appr=
oach would be best, even seemingly tactical activities are better than
noth=
ing. =20
=20
Greg Delp just organized a very successful OLC weekend at a small club
in=
Connecticut. I'd venture a guess that there wasn't a large committee
invo=
lved. Just a couple of sparkplugs.=20
=20
If each SSA Director or State Governor simply made an effort to promote
X=
C and Junior XC in particular in his/her region, it would only take a
rel=
atively small number of "hits" to generate a reasonable population of
junio=
r XC pilots in the US. Once there are a few converts in a club or
region,=
there's a critical mass to hold a local junior get together with maybe
10
=
pilots. But, typing on RAS and bashing the "system" won't get it done.
=
=20
=20
To steal a line from Nike: Just Do It. =20
=20
p3

On Monday, September 14, 2015 at 12:22:38 AM UTC-6, Andy Blackburn wrote:
On Sunday, September 13, 2015 at 1:00:52 PM UTC-7, Sean Fidler wrote:
Good point. We need a balance for sure. Right now the balance is pretty full in the "not cross country" direction at most clubs. Not having gliders to fly because they are all out flying XC would really be a good problem to have initially...


A little data (thanks to Frank Whiteley).

There are 37 clubs in the US with at least 5 SSA youth members. The total number is 351. If you add the smaller club programs, juniors not on youth memberships or non-SSA members and juniors flying at commercial operations, maybe there are 400-500 juniors currently flying gliders in the US. If even a third of them are reasonably committed that is something we can work with.

There is also the Collegiate Soaring Association, a 501(c)3 with an assortment of glider equipment. It's unclear to me the current level of activity within the CSA and I understand that there are issues with the bylaws of the CSA that restrict how the equipment can be used. Something to look into.

I've been noodling on a few ideas for about a year now and have come to the conclusion that we really need to understand better where the bottleneck is: intake (seems not from the data), getting to solo, getting to first XC or getting to advanced XC/racing-ready? We also need to understand the state of the junior population and what the constraints are. The solution really needs to fit the problem - even then it would take energy, commitment and resources.

I've also discovered with just a little digging that thoughtful and generous people have been working on these issues for quite some time, but results have been, well, uneven. Hip-shooting solutions will likely waste time and energy and have little impact. I'd suggest a hard look at where we stand and some directed creativity to see if we can't come up with new approaches and focused investment (of time and money) to make some progress.

I'm willing to do some work on it, but for now I'm still counting leeches from the last r.a.s. racing discussion.

Andy Blackburn
9B

Actually, there are a variety of SSA memberships aged 23 and under in the SSA. Current tally is 808 with e-mail addresses. "Juniors" are a slightly different grouping. There are some number of active youth in clubs and at commercial operations that aren't SSA members.

Frank Whiteley

On Tuesday, September 15, 2015 at 7:45:07 AM UTC-6, Roger Hurley wrote:
At 19:15 14 September 2015, Andy Gough wrote:
On Monday, September 14, 2015 at 2:45:41 AM UTC-4, Andy Blackburn wrote:
On Sunday, September 13, 2015 at 11:22:38 PM UTC-7, Andy Blackburn
wrote:
=20
I've been noodling on a few ideas for about a year now and have come
to=
the conclusion that we really need to understand better where the
bottlene=
ck is: intake (seems not from the data), getting to solo, getting to
first
=
XC or getting to advanced XC/racing-ready? We also need to understand the
s=
tate of the junior population and what the constraints are. The solution
re=
ally needs to fit the problem - even then it would take energy,
commitment
=
and resources.=20
=20
=20
In addition to the bottlenecks to progress there needs to be an
assessmen=
t of where we lose juniors in the process because it's pretty obvious
that
=
not all of them are making it into full-fledged XC and racing pilots as
adu=
lts. Do the commitments of the last couple of years of high school get
them=
? College? Moving into the working world? It's not just development, but
re=
tention that need a hard, analytical look. Right now we have a good
number
=
of opinions and anecdotes that can lead us where to look, but how much of
w=
hat effects prevail when and where probably needs to be assessed at more
th=
an a cursory level. I've heard heartfelt proposed solutions over the
years
=
that I suspect a first-order look at the actual data would show to be
fruit=
less.
=20
Andy

There is a long way to go before we can begin to emulate the European
glidi=
ng scene and as Alexander Schwagermakers pointed out you need to start
some=
where. I believe the start point is long before the provision of contest
ai=
rcraft for juniors to fly.

Club's must be willing to promote cross country and just as important is
th=
e organization of club resources to attain the objective. The clever ones
w=
ould plan their fleets to provide aircraft for a variety of flying
opportun=
ities and promote standards that once attained would allow pilots to
advanc=
e to higher performance aircraft. The aircraft at the top of the scale
woul=
d be maintained expressly for cross country. The example citing the
inconve=
nience to a member who would have to forfeit his flight to a cross
country
=
pilot would not occur, e.g. an LS4 is not a local soaring aircraft, for a
o=
ne hour float around the airfield a 1-26, Ka8 or similar glider is
perfectl=
y adequate. Some clubs in Europe refine this process by allocating
aircraft=
on a daily basis for cross country soaring. Not only is an aircraft
alloca=
ted, also a weather briefing is conducted and a task set. Pilots who are
no=
t allocated an aircraft become willing retrieve crew knowing they will
have=
the benefit of the same when it is their turn to fly. Pilots who are
alloc=
ated an aircraft have the incentive to attempt the task knowing help has
al=
ready been organized should they need a retrieve. Just like gaggle
flying,
=
groups can get better results even when conditions are not optimal.

The Europeans who have contributed to this discussion have intimated the
cl=
ub culture in Europe encourages cross country regardless of age. Sean is
co=
nvinced this is not the case this side of the pond, I concur. Not every
pil=
ot is going to become a contest pilot, the same for juniors but many more
w=
ould if cross country flying was made available and promoted in a
meaningfu=
l way. Low costs and the availability of aircraft go a long way to
enabling=
more pilots to gain the time and skills cross country flying requires.
Con=
vince the clubs that it is in their best interests to organize their
activi=
ties to promote higher standards that lead to cross country flying and we
m=
ight have a starting point for a revival.


Interesting thread, and really a continuation of the "How do we
inspire" topic that Sean began here
http://ras.gliderpilot.net/?op=s2&id=282714&vt= and Andy Gough has it.
I would guess not many joggers jog competitively- if they were told that to
enjoy their recreation they had to race I suspect the majority response
might be rude. Not many glider pilots race competitively - what is it
5%, maybe only 2%. Soaring, even cross-country soaring is, for most, not a
race. I think those promoting soaring as a primarily competitive endeavour
do it no favours.

That's one thing. The other is the club thing. I've heard it said what
clubs need is more people like them. Many have a choice of one and,
depending on the club, Joe Public might think "Jeez no way I'm joining
that". And some are clubmen, some just aren't. Long-time club
membership declines should encourage us to conclude there simply are not
enough "people like them" out there and to broaden the appeal stuff
needs fixing (I know its not the same everywhere). If the clubs are the
problem, the only alternative is that newcomers don't have to join them to
go soaring. Another discussion.

Showing newbies soaring and how its done as a "why we do it" and, at
the right point cross-country soaring too, without having them believe its
all about racing, could bring better results. The club culture thing is
harder. It should be the case that folk join clubs because they want to
not because they have to. Cross-country soaring should be an easy and
achievable aspiration but not all will want to do it. Of those that do
get the XC bug we cannot expect much more than the existing tiny minority
to have the commitment, time and money to take it as far as racing.
Therefore, to end up with more racing pilots means starting with a whole
lot more cross-country "joggers", most of whom will quite reasonably
only ever want to enjoy the jogging.




The number of clubs and chapters and SSA members in them has be quite steady for several years. Churn is always happening. A few listed chapters are fiddling with the rules by not requiring all members to be SSA members. We are working to differentiate those. It's a work in progress, or not.

Frank Whiteley

Sean,
Frank Whiteley is looking for a new chair for the youth committee. Call him and volunteer. The SSA's abilities are limited by the capabilities, and the productivity of the volunteers doing the work. Instead of saying that "they" need to do something, step up, and show us how it's done.

Ultimately, your success will depend on your ability to convince someone at each of the local clubs to take this on. Irritating them might not be the best motivational tactic since they should be considered team mates to work with not opponents to vanquish. More Patrick Lencioni, a lot less Sun Tzu.

SF

I can add my view as the Junior advisor for Harris Hill's program. Before I do that, I want to be clear that I'm speaking personally, not on behalf of the club. The opinions are my own.

We have 35 active Juniors, 26 in high school, the balance of them are in college, so are not usually here except during the summer. I was handed a thriving Junior program several years ago by Janell Sullivan, so can't tell you what it takes to start one. I can tell you what it takes to sustain one..

1. You must have a critical mass of Juniors in the program. One or two Juniors doesn't cut it. The kids like the seniors and value their experience with them, but let's face it, they prefer to hang out with their peers. You need several so they are all at the field together. Otherwise, they get tired of hearing the same stories over and over and drift away.

2. Plan for churn. Some kids (like adults) decide this isn't for them and move on. Some kids really like it but have too many activities and something has to give. There will be churn as that happens and you need a critical mass of kids to survive the inevitable dropouts or the whole thing grinds to a halt.

3. Kids like action. The understand that they need to help out with line duties and club stuff, but the real reason they joined was to fly. If they end up working more than flying, they stop showing up.

4. Parents have to help out. We take kids on at age 14, before they can drive. We all know that being at the field is the way they make progress and Mom and Dad have to shuttle them up there until they are old enough to drive.

5. Average lifespan of a Junior as a contributing club member is about 4 years -less if they come to us at 15 or 16. It's essential that you explain to them what the deal is up front because your club is making an investment of time and money in them. Thus, joining our program is not easy. First, I make both parent and Junior read an introductory document that lays out in detail the duties and program for the Juniors -and the parents. Then, I require them to meet me in person where I go over the exact same information. We tour the operation, and if we can do it, we take the prospective Junior for an introductory ride. AFTER all of that, I send them home and instruct them to discuss the commitment with each other and for the Junior to contact me if he/she wants an application. This 'no surprises' approach makes sure they know what they are in for and I think it makes our investment in their training more valuable.

6. We hold monthly meetings and I track their flight progress both to keep them focused on the prize and to see if they're getting flights. First instructional flight, 10 flights, flying tow, piloting landings, solo, checkout in the 1-26, 1-34, A, B, C badges, Silver C, private pilot. We celebrate flight achievements and encourage everyone to keep making progress.

7. The club is all about instructing the Juniors. I can't emphasize this enough. If your club is only lukewarm about it, then forget trying to spark an interest in a Junior program. We subsidize flying for the Juniors, making it very low cost. Period. People may say one thing but they vote with their wallets. If your club isn't willing to incur time and expense for a Junior program, then they aren't actually interested in one.

8. Juniors rarely fly except when school is out. We are fortunate enough to be able to host daily summer operations. The kids wait until they are clear of school (end of June around here) and fly daily through August until summer ops ends. We often employ collegiate Juniors as CFI's, comm pilots (to fund the daily ops) and tow pilots. This works for about the first two years of college when they need flying jobs but can't get them yet. The kids really respond to flying with and being taught by Juniors who are just a bit older than they are. When school begins, they have fall activities and when it is ending, they are trying to get their final exams and projects finished. They just don't always have time to get out to the field.

9. We try to match resources to requirements. We understand that it is much more expensive in terms of resources and effort to attract and partially train a member that abandons their training than to ensure the existing student pilots get to their certificate. Since Junior training has to fit in there somewhere and competes for instructor time, we limit the number of Juniors to a number we can both afford and train. That keeps both senior students and Juniors happier in terms of being able to access instructors.

10. Mentorship. I realize we are very fortunate to have both experience and equipment on the field. Because the club is on board with Junior membership, many of our members will take Juniors on local or cross country flights 'just because'. One of the things they learn from this is that you don't have to stay local, you can stretch out and go somewhere. And, I'll just point out that the average teen kid is absolutely clueless about how to get from student to cross country pilot. They absolutely need someone to show them how to get there and impose a little structure.

11. Even a little upgrade is exciting to a student pilot. I see a lot of people disparaging 2-33's but they're cheap, they do a great job of training, and they fly sufficiently like a 1-26 that our kids are genuinely excited about getting checked out in, and flying the 1-26. They love it. And, after a fashion, they move up to the 1-34 and LOVE it. Can you imagine LOVING and being EXCITED about flying a 1-34? I can, because I see it all the time. The 1-34 opens up the possibility of stretching out to get that cloud just a little further away and it is a great 50k cross country machine. The kids usually get their 5 hour flight in the 1-34 (or 1-26) and compete for it on any given summer day.

12. They're not DIYers like many of us are. I've found our senior members to be independent, take charge folks. Teens are not like that. They don't fix up cars (I'm generalizing here, but you get the picture), know how to change a tire, or know how to build a deck. Nor are they particularly interested in how to do that. It's obviously generational, but they just aren't into it very much. That's a little bit at odds with what I know about soaring culture, but having said that - they're usually game for almost anything. They don't care if you camp out, forgot the tent and only brought candy bars for dinner. They're adaptable and that's awesome. They could also care less about club politics, which they view as a bunch of adults bickering over stupid stuff while we could all be flying. Refreshing.

13. Junior flying is competing with other leisure activities and almost all of them are WAY easier to do. Both Juniors and parents have to feel like they are getting something of value from membership. You may think that kids ought to be grateful to fly your aircraft and you're right, but that's just not how they are going to view it until later, when they've gone of on their adult adventures. I try to structure our meetings with a theme each month so they are worth attending (providing pizza helps) and remind the kids that of the 600,000 pilots in the U.S., they only hand out about 150 student licenses to 14-15 year olds each year. That gets their attention because it underscores how few kids get the opportunity they do. I also have a blog for the parents that they can get to in our member section so they can find out what is going on in the program.

14. See number 7, again. It takes a lot of EFFORT to do this but the payoff is watching awkward, clueless 14 year olds turn into responsible, mature adults in front of your eyes. Whether they go on to a career in aviation is immaterial - they carry the gift of flight with them for life. You all know what I mean.

Whew. That's a lot and I apologize for the length of this post. I'll end by saying that even with our amazing resources, we don't do a great job of shepherding the kids to fly XC. You have to remember, they have almost no clue about badges, flight recorders, paperwork, or pre-planning. You have to bring them along to this when they are ready. For my part, I'm going to be more organized and focused at our monthly meetings by explaining the badge levels through Silver C and helping them understand how they can achieve those levels. It's all about opening their eyes to the possibilities.

One last note - when we were starting to get down a bit in our Junior membership, all I had to do was ask the kids if they'd tried to get any of their friends involved in soaring. Within a month, we had several new ones and have added them steadily all year long. Kids are still interested in flying.

That's my two cents.