Some good news

iPads are not easy to use in glider cockpit, especially not in an emergency situation. However if you have panel space, I highly recommend The TruTrak pictorial turn and bank. Works very well and already saved me in a similar situation.

Ramy

For many people, those things are pretty cost prohibitive, and as Ramy pointed out, an Ipad doesn't fit too well in a cockpit. I was actually in the initial stages of designing a low-cost AHRS for "get-down" situations, but ran out of time to put one in. Not that glider pilots don't encounter $1000 costs, but i'm not sure "phenomenally cheap" is the term those of us not flying 6-figure glass would use to describe the current AHRS market.

If you are not pushing the bounds of safety and are properly adjusting for the conditions in flight, there really shouldn't be a need for an AHRS. Yes, i could have used one on this flight, but at that point i was already 2 bad decisions deep. More equipment will not breed better decision making, it breeds more data, and in many cases lazy pilots who have another crutch. Saying people should buy more equipment is akin to blaming your botched off-field landings on not having a higher performance glider.

The TruTrak Turn and bank works very well and cost $500. Add an instant on switch to address any battery concerns.
http://www.trutrakap.com/product/pictorial-turn-bank/

Ramy

There are products that are real instruments instead of ipad toys and still portable & easily installed. Flying T&B only requires training, why not put Dynon D2 to panel?

I'd agree with any of these. The point is, it's insane to fly in wave or conditions where clouds could form without some sort of artificial horizon. Btw an added advantage of the right foreflight subscription is that it will also give you terrain and clearance. Death seems like a poor bargain vs a couple of thousand, that could be a shared asset at a club or rented at a commercial operation.

It's not insane to fly in wave without an artificial horizon. I've been doing it for decades. You have to be careful and know what you are doing. Do the people that call it insane ever fly in wave? Nothing I hate worst than people that have never done something telling the people that do it all the time how to do it or that it is insane. It's not smart to soar in the wave when you don't know what you are e doing and don't get a proper education from the local pilots that fly there all the time. It's insane to fly a glider without the proper training. It's insane to winch launch without the proper training. It's s insane to fly XC without the proper training. Our sport is about being smart, not about having the right instruments.

Boggs

At 14:44 03 November 2015, Waveguru wrote:
It's not insane to fly in wave without an artificial horizon. I've been
doi=
ng it for decades. You have to be careful and know what you are doing. Do
t=
he people that call it insane ever fly in wave? Nothing I hate worst than
p=
eople that have never done something telling the people that do it all
the
=
time how to do it or that it is insane. It's not smart to soar in the
wave=
when you don't know what you are e doing and don't get a proper
education
=
from the local pilots that fly there all the time. It's insane to fly a
gli=
der without the proper training. It's insane to winch launch without the
pr=
oper training. It's s insane to fly XC without the proper training. Our
spo=
rt is about being smart, not about having the right instruments.=20

Boggs


+1

At 14:44 03 November 2015, Waveguru wrote:
It's not insane to fly in wave without an artificial horizon. I've been
doi=
ng it for decades. You have to be careful and know what you are doing. Do
t=
he people that call it insane ever fly in wave? Nothing I hate worst than
p=
eople that have never done something telling the people that do it all
the
=
time how to do it or that it is insane. It's not smart to soar in the
wave=
when you don't know what you are e doing and don't get a proper
education
=
from the local pilots that fly there all the time. It's insane to fly a
gli=
der without the proper training. It's insane to winch launch without the
pr=
oper training. It's s insane to fly XC without the proper training. Our
spo=
rt is about being smart, not about having the right instruments.=20

Boggs


+1

On Tuesday, November 3, 2015 at 9:44:20 AM UTC-5, Waveguru wrote:
It's not insane to fly in wave without an artificial horizon. I've been doing it for decades. You have to be careful and know what you are doing. Do the people that call it insane ever fly in wave? Nothing I hate worst than people that have never done something telling the people that do it all the time how to do it or that it is insane. It's not smart to soar in the wave when you don't know what you are e doing and don't get a proper education from the local pilots that fly there all the time. It's insane to fly a glider without the proper training. It's insane to winch launch without the proper training. It's s insane to fly XC without the proper training. Our sport is about being smart, not about having the right instruments.

Boggs

Boggs, you are absolutely spot on. IMC in gliders is 100% avoidable. The day of the accidents, most of us were doing other things because (wait for it) the weather just wasn't very good. It takes more than rising air to make a good soaring day.

Evan Ludeman / T8

I really should have read the entire thread rather than replying
individually to the various bad ideas here.

I'm trying to visualize a commercial glider operation that would rent a
tablet with some "cheap" software (neither of which has been tested nor
certified) to someone to go fly in conditions which might lead to a trip
into IMC. I can see the grieving widows with their poor, pathetic
children, and the greedy lawyers preparing their briefs right now.

The Dynon D2 looks like a fine piece of equipment but it does not have
the TSO to be used in IFR flying. But most all airplanes built in the
past 50-60 years come out of the factory with an attitude indicator,
directional gyro, VSI, altimeter, and airspeed indicator and STILL
people come falling out of the bottom of the clouds. Having a TV picture
of the same instruments will not make you an instrument pilot. And I
can not even conceive of and instrument rated pilot making such dumb
suggestions. If you're competent and comfortable with flight in IMC
then, legalities aside, you might succeed with with what you suggest but
what if, say, an email alert pops up in the middle of your display just
as your aircraft is beginning a slow upset? Or any other kind of
interrupt which slows/stops/obscures your display? Do you text while
you drive?

OK, I'm going to see how long it will be until the next bright idea
comes along.

On 11/3/2015 5:38 AM, Andrew Ainslie wrote:
I'd agree with any of these. The point is, it's insane to fly in wave or conditions where clouds could form without some sort of artificial horizon. Btw an added advantage of the right foreflight subscription is that it will also give you terrain and clearance. Death seems like a poor bargain vs a couple of thousand, that could be a shared asset at a club or rented at a commercial operation.

--
Dan, 5J