XCSoar and Wind

If Manual means external than those who use external wind can no longer set it manually. This is a problem since occasionally you want to manually enter expected wind instead of current wind to get realistic final glide calculation when you know the wind at lower altitude is different. I don't understand why not simply add "external" option.

Ramy

On Thursday, November 19, 2015 at 10:26:04 AM UTC-8, Ramy wrote:
If Manual means external than those who use external wind can no longer set it manually. This is a problem since occasionally you want to manually enter expected wind instead of current wind to get realistic final glide calculation when you know the wind at lower altitude is different. I don't understand why not simply add "external" option.

Ramy

My understanding is that even when there was an explicit external option, if it was selected, and there was external wind present, then the manual wind was overridden by it at all times.

So, pre 6.8, with external wind you do not have manual wind.

Seems all they did with this change is to make the UI more consistent with the implemented logic.

David

On Thursday, November 19, 2015 at 12:29:11 PM UTC-8, wrote:
On Thursday, November 19, 2015 at 10:26:04 AM UTC-8, Ramy wrote:
If Manual means external than those who use external wind can no longer set it manually. This is a problem since occasionally you want to manually enter expected wind instead of current wind to get realistic final glide calculation when you know the wind at lower altitude is different. I don't understand why not simply add "external" option.

Ramy

My understanding is that even when there was an explicit external option, if it was selected, and there was external wind present, then the manual wind was overridden by it at all times.

So, pre 6.8, with external wind you do not have manual wind.

Seems all they did with this change is to make the UI more consistent with the implemented logic.

David

To do this the right way, would require a Settings choice between External source and Internal calculation, and a use choice in the Wind modal that lets the user override the Settings choice with a Manual wind, with the ability to clear it and go back to the Settings choice once the user is done with the need to use the Manual values.

David

with pre 6.8 I simply unselected the "use external wind" whenever I wanted the set the wind manually. It worked well. I am hoping there is a way to achieve the same in 6.8 - having the ability to easily switch between external to manual wind. Without this I am better off with 6.7.

Ramy

On Thursday, November 19, 2015 at 12:50:31 PM UTC-8, Ramy wrote:
with pre 6.8 I simply unselected the "use external wind" whenever I wanted the set the wind manually. It worked well. I am hoping there is a way to achieve the same in 6.8 - having the ability to easily switch between external to manual wind. Without this I am better off with 6.7.

Ramy

OK, more speculation about how this works. Looking at the code.

In =6.8, if wind is set to Manual (not Auto), and External wind is present then External is used. If you then set wind manually, that overrides the External wind.

In the Modal, once you select wind manually, a "Clear" button appears (it is not there before). Select 'Clear' once you are done with the Manual wind and it goes back to using External (if present).

Hope that's how it is.

David

On Thursday, 19 November 2015 23:01:48 UTC+2, wrote:
OK, more speculation about how this works. Looking at the code.

In =6.8, if wind is set to Manual (not Auto), and External wind is present then External is used. If you then set wind manually, that overrides the External wind.

In the Modal, once you select wind manually, a "Clear" button appears (it is not there before). Select 'Clear' once you are done with the Manual wind and it goes back to using External (if present).

Hope that's how it is.

David


I asked that question yesterday on the XCSoar forums and Max (one of the main developers) replied.

Question:
Is the Manual option the same as disabled if an external wind source is available?

Max's answer:
Yes. Good commit message, but bad naming in user interface.

Apparently my question is not understood by the developers or XCSoar
does not independently calculate and display wind.

I do not want to manually enter wind based upon a guess of what it is.
I want XCSoar, running on a Dell Streak 5, with no external device
connected, to calculate and display the wind.

Does XCSoar do that? How to I make it do that? I have tried all of the
suggestions and, without an external source, i.e., CAI-302/Bluetooth, I
get no wind.

On 11/20/2015 12:45 AM, Surge wrote:
On Thursday, 19 November 2015 23:01:48 UTC+2, wrote:
OK, more speculation about how this works. Looking at the code.

In =6.8, if wind is set to Manual (not Auto), and External wind is present then External is used. If you then set wind manually, that overrides the External wind.

In the Modal, once you select wind manually, a "Clear" button appears (it is not there before). Select 'Clear' once you are done with the Manual wind and it goes back to using External (if present).

Hope that's how it is.

David

I asked that question yesterday on the XCSoar forums and Max (one of the main developers) replied.

Question:
Is the Manual option the same as disabled if an external wind source is available?

Max's answer:
Yes. Good commit message, but bad naming in user interface.

--
Dan, 5J

If you have no airspeed information the only way to calculate the wind is
by measuring the drift of your circle in circling mode. In my experience
XCSOAR wants 4-5 thermalling turns before it calculates the wind.

At 15:27 20 November 2015, Dan Marotta wrote:
Apparently my question is not understood by the developers or XCSoar
does not independently calculate and display wind.

I do not want to manually enter wind based upon a guess of what it is.
I want XCSoar, running on a Dell Streak 5, with no external device
connected, to calculate and display the wind.

Does XCSoar do that? How to I make it do that? I have tried all of the
suggestions and, without an external source, i.e., CAI-302/Bluetooth, I
get no wind.

On 11/20/2015 12:45 AM, Surge wrote:
On Thursday, 19 November 2015 23:01:48 UTC+2,
wrote:
OK, more speculation about how this works. Looking at the code.

In =6.8, if wind is set to Manual (not Auto), and External wind is
present then External is used. If you then set wind manually, that
overrides the External wind.

In the Modal, once you select wind manually, a "Clear" button appears
(it is not there before). Select 'Clear' once you are done with the
Manual
wind and it goes back to using External (if present).

Hope that's how it is.

David

I asked that question yesterday on the XCSoar forums and Max (one of
the
main developers) replied.

Question:
Is the Manual option the same as disabled if an external wind source is
available?

Max's answer:
Yes. Good commit message, but bad naming in user interface.

--
Dan, 5J

I tried this few times in couple of flights recently. Unfortunately looks like it is no longer possible to enter manual wind in XCSoar if you using external source like 302. I tried entering values manually in manual mode (as well as circling etc) and it immediately switched back to the external value. No matter what I tried, it continues showing external wind. I suspect this is a bug and not intentional as it was possible to enter manual wind in previous versions, crucial when you on final glide into different airmass but the wind remains the last calculated value.

Ramy

Ramy,

I use LK8000 V5 and even though it can receive my SN10B winds, I always configure the winds manually. SN10B winds are more accurate... but far less accurate than the Butterfly IMU based system (AirGlide) according to reports from a few friends.

Circling winds from LK8000 are similar to the SN10B's, but like you... I prefer to set winds manually which is on my checklist before taking off.

Walt Rogers WX