General Zinni on Sixty Minutes

In article ,
"Paul J. Adam" wrote:

In message , Chad Irby
writes
In article ,
"Paul J. Adam" wrote:
Thousands-to-one odds, anyway.

Nope. Millions. Out of the couple of dozen artillery rounds

How many shells do you think have been used as IEDs? It's not 'dozens'.

Nope. Pretty close to that. Most of them have been explosives of other
types.

--
cirby at cfl.rr.com

Remember: Objects in rearview mirror may be hallucinations.
Slam on brakes accordingly.

In message , Chad Irby
writes
In article ,
"Paul J. Adam" wrote:
How many shells do you think have been used as IEDs? It's not 'dozens'.

Nope. Pretty close to that. Most of them have been explosives of other
types.

How many IEDs do you think have been detonated or disarmed?

--
He thinks too much: such men are dangerous.
Julius Caesar I:2

Paul J. Adam MainBoxatjrwlynch[dot]demon{dot}co(.)uk

In article ,
"Paul J. Adam" wrote:

In message , Chad Irby
writes
In article ,
"Paul J. Adam" wrote:
How many shells do you think have been used as IEDs? It's not 'dozens'.

Nope. Pretty close to that. Most of them have been explosives of other
types.

How many IEDs do you think have been detonated or disarmed?

Quite a few, but most of them have been made out of much smaller devices
or just plain old plastic explosives.

It takes a lot of work and more skill to make an artillery shell into a
remote-detonated bomb, compared to using the other materials they have
available. Making an RPG into an IED is much, much easier (a piece of
string tied to the trigger), and they have a *lot* of those.

An "IED" isn't always made up of normal explosives, anyway. Cans full
of gasoline, a grenade tied to the gas tank of a bus sitting by the side
of the road, fertilizer and diesel in a plastic bag... there's a lot of
different ways to make them. Artillery shells are popular, but with all
of the explosive crap sitting around in undiscovered bunkers in Iraq,
there's a wide variety to choose from.

--
cirby at cfl.rr.com

Remember: Objects in rearview mirror may be hallucinations.
Slam on brakes accordingly.

In message , Chad Irby
writes
In article ,
"Paul J. Adam" wrote:
How many IEDs do you think have been detonated or disarmed?

Quite a few, but most of them have been made out of much smaller devices
or just plain old plastic explosives.

It takes a lot of work and more skill to make an artillery shell into a
remote-detonated bomb, compared to using the other materials they have
available.

How difficult do you believe it is to fill the fusewell of an artillery
shell with plastic explosive and insert a detonator linked to (for
example) a garage door-opener receiver?

Making an RPG into an IED is much, much easier (a piece of
string tied to the trigger), and they have a *lot* of those.

However, an RPG's warhead is measured in ounces and has a relatively
poor fragmentation effect: artillery shells have payloads of pounds and
are *designed* for area fragmentation.

An "IED" isn't always made up of normal explosives, anyway. Cans full
of gasoline, a grenade tied to the gas tank of a bus sitting by the side
of the road, fertilizer and diesel in a plastic bag... there's a lot of
different ways to make them.

Yes, I know - they were an ongoing risk.

Interesting experience: checking out a white van parked on double yellow
lines (illegally, if there's no direct US equivalent) but a look through
the windows shows it's full of fertiliser bags.

Glad I was just the guard that day: and *very* glad that the driver ran
out of a house, saw the armed soldiers examining his van (probably not
in that order), and stuttered "I'll move it! I'm going!" and raced off.

Artillery shells are popular, but with all
of the explosive crap sitting around in undiscovered bunkers in Iraq,
there's a wide variety to choose from.

So, again, what's your estimate of the number of IEDs found to date?

--
He thinks too much: such men are dangerous.
Julius Caesar I:2

Paul J. Adam MainBoxatjrwlynch[dot]demon{dot}co(.)uk

In article ,
"Paul J. Adam" wrote:

In message , Chad Irby
writes
In article ,
"Paul J. Adam" wrote:
How many IEDs do you think have been detonated or disarmed?

Quite a few, but most of them have been made out of much smaller devices
or just plain old plastic explosives.

It takes a lot of work and more skill to make an artillery shell into a
remote-detonated bomb, compared to using the other materials they have
available.

How difficult do you believe it is to fill the fusewell of an artillery
shell with plastic explosive and insert a detonator linked to (for
example) a garage door-opener receiver?

Much more difficult and risky to your own hide than the example I gave:

Making an RPG into an IED is much, much easier (a piece of
string tied to the trigger), and they have a *lot* of those.

....and somewhat more difficult than taking one of a whole lot of
leftover blocks of plastic explosive and sticking a detonator into it.

However, an RPG's warhead is measured in ounces and has a relatively
poor fragmentation effect: artillery shells have payloads of pounds and
are *designed* for area fragmentation.

But are very bad for portability and pretty much useless against
anything except soft targets unless you get them right up against the
hull of an armored vehicle. If you want frag damage, use mortar shells,
they've got a more useful payload and weigh less per round.

An "IED" isn't always made up of normal explosives, anyway. Cans
full of gasoline, a grenade tied to the gas tank of a bus sitting by
the side of the road, fertilizer and diesel in a plastic bag...
there's a lot of different ways to make them.

Yes, I know - they were an ongoing risk.

And *are*. What we're seeing now is the leftovers, and items from
undiscovered weapons caches. Like the sarin shell.

Artillery shells are popular, but with all of the explosive crap
sitting around in undiscovered bunkers in Iraq, there's a wide
variety to choose from.

So, again, what's your estimate of the number of IEDs found to date?

A couple of thousand, from what I've read. They were rare at first,
started coming in after the first three months or so, hit a peak a while
back, and are trailing off (since a lot of the people who were trying to
set them got blown up or shot while making the attempts).

You might also note that they were counting *anything* that could be
considered explosives as "IEDs" for a while, even if it was just an
unattended artillery shell sitting by the road.

--
cirby at cfl.rr.com

Remember: Objects in rearview mirror may be hallucinations.
Slam on brakes accordingly.

In message , Chad Irby
writes
In article ,
"Paul J. Adam" wrote:
How difficult do you believe it is to fill the fusewell of an artillery
shell with plastic explosive and insert a detonator linked to (for
example) a garage door-opener receiver?

Much more difficult and risky to your own hide than the example I gave:

Much less effective, though.

Making an RPG into an IED is much, much easier (a piece of
string tied to the trigger), and they have a *lot* of those.

...and somewhat more difficult than taking one of a whole lot of
leftover blocks of plastic explosive and sticking a detonator into it.

No fragmentation, though that's not hard to fix. On the other hand if
you've *got* shells... you have explosive and fragments pre-made and
just need the new fuze.

However, an RPG's warhead is measured in ounces and has a relatively
poor fragmentation effect: artillery shells have payloads of pounds and
are *designed* for area fragmentation.

But are very bad for portability and pretty much useless against
anything except soft targets

"Soft targets" like trucks, foot patrols, HMMWVs and the like. Most of
the troops, aid workers, local police and contractors in Iraq aren't
mounted in armoured vehicles.

So, again, what's your estimate of the number of IEDs found to date?

A couple of thousand, from what I've read.

Thank you (seriously). Are you still saying less than a "few dozen"
involved artillery shells?

--
He thinks too much: such men are dangerous.
Julius Caesar I:2

Paul J. Adam MainBoxatjrwlynch[dot]demon{dot}co(.)uk