Pribina Cup 2016 - Slovakia - Mid-Air?

Renny pisze:

A web search revealed very little info, so does anyone "out there" have any information on this "incident?"
Mid-air, one glider landed back on the airfield, second one - you know
the story. Not much more to be told even by people who were there.

It's typical for "publicity" of competition accidents to be zero.
Organizers' reasons are obvious, but on the other hand pretending
"nothing happened" doesn't make gliding community look serious.

Wojciech

On Monday, April 4, 2016 at 5:46:12 AM UTC-6, Wojciech Scigala wrote:
Renny pisze:

A web search revealed very little info, so does anyone "out there" have any information on this "incident?"
Mid-air, one glider landed back on the airfield, second one - you know
the story. Not much more to be told even by people who were there.

It's typical for "publicity" of competition accidents to be zero.
Organizers' reasons are obvious, but on the other hand pretending
"nothing happened" doesn't make gliding community look serious.

Wojciech

Wojciech,
Thank you for the information. Hopefully, we will learn more in time. I did receive this URL with some photos:

http://nasanitra.sme.sk/c/20129950/l...e.html?ref=trz

Thanks again - Renny

On Monday, April 4, 2016 at 7:52:41 AM UTC-6, Renny wrote:
On Monday, April 4, 2016 at 5:46:12 AM UTC-6, Wojciech Scigala wrote:
Renny pisze:

A web search revealed very little info, so does anyone "out there" have any information on this "incident?"
Mid-air, one glider landed back on the airfield, second one - you know
the story. Not much more to be told even by people who were there.

It's typical for "publicity" of competition accidents to be zero.
Organizers' reasons are obvious, but on the other hand pretending
"nothing happened" doesn't make gliding community look serious.

Wojciech

Wojciech,
Thank you for the information. Hopefully, we will learn more in time. I did receive this URL with some photos:

http://nasanitra.sme.sk/c/20129950/l...e.html?ref=trz

Thanks again - Renny

Another link, in English that helps with the Google translate of the above link. Less pictures.
http://spectator.sme.sk/c/20130833/t...-of-house.html

Frank Whiteley

On Monday, 4 April 2016 14:46:12 UTC+3, Wojciech Scigala wrote:
It's typical for "publicity" of competition accidents to be zero.
Organizers' reasons are obvious, but on the other hand pretending
"nothing happened" doesn't make gliding community look serious.

Wojciech

Maybe it would be a good time to look at the mirror. Why is it that pilots from certain Eastern European countries find themselves in these midairs so often? It's out of any proportions, internationally. Competition culture is just plain dangerous. This is constantly proven by stream of accident reports, most remarkable example was Jantar Cup 2014 at Pila (two collisions, three parachute saves and one fatality).

krasw pisze:

It's out of any proportions, internationally.

Maybe the reason is the volume of competitions there? More flights =
more accidents. Mid-airs happen all over the world, without any hard
numbers comparing number of flights with number of collisions it's
impossible to judge if the reason is really behind "geopolitics". What's
more, low numbers of accidents assures high noise level. To make it even
worse, practice of sweeping accidents under the PR carpet leaves those
numbers only to official boards, so all we have are speculations and gut
feelings.

It would be great if one can give the main reason for mid-airs. Be it
lack of lookout, cockpit design, too much or too less electronics,
nationality, hours flown, sex, competition rules, etc... The issue is
complex and any simple diagnosis won't help anyone. If one says that
pilots from particular group are dangerous, those accused will just deny
that (even if proven by dry facts, it will be mentally rejected and take
long to be absorbed) - others will think "problem found, does not apply
to me". No easy solutions here.

Yes, this might be true that some countries share same deep-dug reasons,
be it law, weather, glider types or more vague ones like history,
culture, mentality etc. Finding them out (not guessing) will be great
starting point for discussion and hopefully improvements.

Right now we're only guessing. And even if guess is right, it won't help
unless we have some identified area to work with.


Regards,
Wojciech

Wonder if the aircraft were Flarm equipped ?

These accidents usually happen at pre start gaggles with dozens of gliders in same thermals. Flarm is useless there. Only thing that help is disciple and safety-oriented attitude, which these kamikaze pilots lack.

Do you fly comps?

At 17:58 07 April 2016, krasw wrote:
These accidents usually happen at pre start gaggles with dozens of
gliders
in same thermals. Flarm is useless there. Only thing that help is
disciple
and safety-oriented attitude, which these kamikaze pilots lack.

perjantai 8. huhtikuuta 2016 11.00.08 UTC+3 Justin Craig kirjoitti:
Do you fly comps?

At 17:58 07 April 2016, krasw wrote:
These accidents usually happen at pre start gaggles with dozens of
gliders
in same thermals. Flarm is useless there. Only thing that help is
disciple
and safety-oriented attitude, which these kamikaze pilots lack.


Of course I do.

Since statistics were called for, I extracted all accidents involving mid-air during competitions during last 5 seasons (data from Aviation Safety Network). Here are the results:

Eastern Europe: Poland (3), Slovakia (2), Czech (1): 6 accidents
USA: 3 accidents (incl. 1 in Uvalde worlds)
UK: 1 accident
Finland 1 accident

I maintain that this is not proportional to glider pilot population worldwide.

Le jeudi 7 avril 2016 19:58:30 UTC+2, krasw a écrit*:
These accidents usually happen at pre start gaggles with dozens of gliders in same thermals. Flarm is useless there.

I have been with dozens of flarm-equipped gliders in pre-start gaggles. Flarm was very helpful in these situations, almost no false alarms.