FAI, soaring and Olympic Games

At 03:56 07 November 2016, Papa3 wrote:
Sean,=20

If nothing else, you are entertaining. =20

Busy with work this evening, but in a nutshell... The Collegiate
Soaring
A=
ssociation has been around for 30 years. It is an affiliate of the
SSA.
=
It was founded by Dr. John Campbell in 1984 who was a post-doc
at
Princeton=
when I was an undergraduate. The two of us, along with several
others,
sp=
ent years working very hard to revive college-based soaring
activity.
Joh=
n was incredibly passionate about the project, and spent
countless hours
pr=
omoting, cajoling, and driving this. We obtained 501 C3 status,
we
receiv=
ed a few donations, we even hosted competitions. I personally
drove
aroun=
d to Penn State, Ohio State, RIT, and several others with John to
conduct
=
workshops, help with recruiting drives, etc. I drove the 1-36
which was
=
donated around to several sites as a loaner to help drive activity.

Eventually, we were able to pull together a few Collegiate
Championships,
=
but in reality they were just a couple of juniors participating in
existing=
SSA Regionals (I believe Sean Franke won one, though calling it
an "MSU
Ch=
ampionship" was really a stretch). John managed to pull a "local"
competi=
tion together in Colorado due in large part to the presence of the
Air
Forc=
e Academy. When John tragically died way too young from brain
cancer,
th=
e CSA really started to fade away.=20

In the end, it turned out that College Soaring clubs are very hard
to
maint=
ain. As an example, the Princeton club was at one point one of the
largest
=
campus organizations, with over 70 members. It was started by
Steve Sliwa,
=
himself a Harris Hill Junior. We had tremendous advantages,
being a
unive=
rsity with an active Flight Research program and our own airport.
That
mea=
nt qualified CFIs, towpilots, and even mechanics. But, over the
years,
th=
e university got out of the Flight Research business, they sold the
airport=
, and the nearest glider operation was an hour away. After a few
years,
th=
e membership was down to a handful of students, and those
students rotate
o=
ut every 4 years. Also, many recent graduates are challenged by
finances,
=
time, and frankly have other passions. So, imagine the difficulty
at
othe=
r colleges and universities that don't already have an active group
of
stud=
ents naturally inclined toward aviation.=20

Soaring is a very quirky sport. If a person with as much energy
and drive
=
as John can't achieve critical mass in Collegiate Soaring over 10
years,
i=
t's not something that a couple of posts on RAS will change. =20

Erik Mann (P3)


I was the SSA Youth Education Chair before John Campbell, and
wrestled with the same issues. College soaring goes back to the
1930's with the MIT and Michigan clubs. The biggest problem is
that we soar in the summer when the college students go home to
other places. In spring when we start up, they are studying for
finals. The timelines just aren't conducive to making it work
reliably.

The collegiate soaring thing has gone up and down over the years.
Back in 1971, Pete Silvaggio at Cornell tried to start a collegiate
soaring association. He even organized a contest at Harris Hill
(which I won) that summer. I think we had competitors there from
maybe 4 schools.

My old alma mater (RPI) even designed and built an ultralight glider
as an exercise in design and composite construction. Dr. Francis
Bundy even test flew it up in Schenectady (I believe), but it never
went much further than that. The students were able to work on
the construction over the winter school year part time, but during
the soaring season, they were gone. I think that there were also
insurance issues with flying that glider as well.....

Money is also an issue because most college students don't have
much extra to spend with already having to pay for college, etc..

College soaring sounds like a great idea, and it has been tried many
times. The only consistently successful operation is at the USAF
Academy where the students stay there and fly over the summer as
opposed to going back home like most college student do. The
flying is also free for them, as it is part of the overall USAFA
program.

RO

'Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it.'
George Santayana

I like new ideas and without trying to grow I agree we will shrink - just need to be smart/calculating - not all disruptive ideas and Chaos end well or get the desired results.

A Soaring Film is in contention for a Emmy...... Excellent exposure. and a gliders has been in 2 major movies in the past few years - also great exposure. All good all positive and it took no volunteer resources, which are limited.

The hard part is how to best use our limited volunteer resources (until the US Government hands SSA a truck load of cash, just JOKING). Also how to nurture new ideas and help guide them with out seeming like all ideas are old and bad.

You never know what will catch a new glider pilot's eye (like that Disney movie that caught my eye when I was 13) or the person who flew at 14 take and few years off (like 30) and hope to be a pilot for a few decades, and can support the sport and has some time to volunteer a little.

my 2.5 cents.

WH

I would think that clubs and the SSA would subsidize this to reach critical mass per a strategic plan.

College kids are perfect. High school programs also make sense.

But this kind of thing always needs great care and feeding and many coordinated SSA leader hands on deck for sure.

We can't afford to be failed at this one.

An interesting data point in my opinion would be Harris Hill and their Juniors. It is far-and-away the largest, longest running, most highly supported junior group out there (there are others that are growing, but HHSC is the poster child). If you are really interested in the topic, it would be good to get some hard data backed up by some qualitative input to understand exactly what has been generated by this great organization. Off the top of my head, I can name a few (less than 10) competition pilots who are currently active coming out of the HHSC program. Sean Murphy is heading to Benalla for our 15M team. Heinz Weisenbuhler has represented the US in Open and Doppelsitzers. There are several others in "my" generation (40 to 50 year olds). In the last 20 years though, there are only a couple who have stuck with it, despite all of the support one could ask for. More often than not they've been around for a couple of years in their late teens/early 20s, then "life happens." Right now, the next great hope is Noah Ritter.

So there's the rub... if the best-supported Junior organization has literally a handful of pilots who go on to embrace racing, what are we missing?

Sean, I don't disagree with you that what's been done in the past isn't necessarily the best/only model. But I think slinging arrows at "The SSA" when in fact every one of these initiatives relies on hard working (unpaid) volunteers who mostly have other jobs isn't going to get the reaction you might be hoping for.

That's it for me this week. Work and family beckon.

p3

I think the Harris Hill group is doing great. But they are unique in many ways in terms of the facility, history, museum, funding, etc.

What's missing? :-). How about what isn't missing?

1) Serious focus at the SSA level. Leadership and realistic prioritization..
2) A sense of urgency nationally (carefully drilled down to the club level) and a plan. Oddly youth soaring programs would be very healthy for soaring clubs yet we seem to have few and no real national focus.
3) A national plan to motivate/help clubs to do what Harris Hill is doing.
4) A website (for the youth specifically) along with social channels. Kids do not want to talk to us about this, they want to talk to other kids. It needs to be self sustaining and "theirs" not ours. (a different conversation)
5) The chemistry and inertia of 30 such vibrant youth programs (or 10-15 in a region) operating simultaneously and feeding off each other. One or two at a time is not going to ignite this. Many need to be doing what Harris hill is doing now.

IMO, the SSA leadership needs to seriously re-prioritize (rules committee, etc) and re-focus on making sure that we develop these programs and measure success constantly.

Just look at Britain, Australia, France, Germany, etc. They seem to have great youth energy and participation (at all levels). Many have several national youth competitions, each with 50+ youth pilots each (plus instructors, etc). Imagine 3 or 4 seniors full of Juniors. Great parties for the kids, fun, etc. A great vibe. Healthy, active social media, video (youtube), twitter, snap-chat, etc.

A few quick examples (links to websites, etc all available and lots of inter-team taunting [very healthy]):
(Some of these are all 50x more active than our own SSA overall websites and social media)
(PS...websites are becoming almost irrelevant)
https://www.facebook.com/ukjuniorgliding/
https://www.facebook.com/groups/176599515713334/
https://www.facebook.com/GermanJuniorGlidingTeam/
https://www.facebook.com/Belgian-Jun...7310690991217/
https://www.gliding.co.uk/juniorgliding
Also France, Spain, Italy, Nordic countries, Poland, etc, etc, etc, etc.
All flying FAI rules together by the way.

The truth is that we may never recover. The kids are trying but they are going to need significantly more help than they have at present. We (SSA, US Soaring) cant survive without solving this problem soon. It needs to be a huge priority. It simply is not.

How the US fell so far off the ledge with youth soaring yet so many other countries are still thriving (and highly organized and focused) is puzzling to me (despite the obvious). What happened 15, 20, 25 years ago to cause this near extinction vs. other counties east and west? Australia has the same size, isolation problem but seems to be developing many juniors. Even Canada is stronger. Anyone have any thoughts?

3) A national plan to motivate/help clubs to do what Harris Hill is doing

Harris Hill is unique because of the history of the site, and therefore
the governmental preservation and backing of the facility. The HHSC is
essentially given the whole facility to operate free of charge as long
as they "provide rides for the public". As I understand it, the
government does all of the facilities maintenance as well. The rides
also produce revenue , so they basically have no overhead costs.
Because of this, they are able to free up funding for programs like their
Juniors program. Even as prolific as the HHSC program is, they have
the same issues with young people staying "with it" over time. One
can only try to "set the hook" so that they come back after "life" gets in

the way.. ie, college, getting married, having kids, job, money, etc, etc.

The club which I have belonged to for the last 52 years (Nutmeg
Soaring Association formerly of CT, and now in Freehold, NY) has had
many scholarship students over the years. We have had them go on to
the USAFA , USNA, and other fine schools and universities. Some have
wound up as military aviators, airline and corporate pilots. Very, very
few have been able to stay with soaring as they went about the
business of living life. We can only hope that they can come back at a
time when life will permit it....

Most soaring operations/clubs don't have anywhere near the
"discretionary cash flow" that HHSC may have, so they can't spend as
much on youth programs. It is a very tough nut to crack....

RO

Soaring runs on obsessed pilots with the rare combination of money and time.. You need more of those before you have the trickle down resources(excess money and time) to run large youth programs. I'm not saying discard youth programs or not start any, just that we don't have the resources to make big ones. We need to recruit soaring pilots from the ranks of bored trustfunders. Another thought on youth programs, people don't like going back to sports they did when they were young if they are unable to perform at the same level. Soaring might not have this issue and I think any flight training for young people is a positive life enhancer whether or not they go on to be regular pilots. But training up masses of kids that don't become obsessed regulars is spent energy with possibly very low return to soaring. Noble certainly, but soaring doesn't have the resources for large scale nobility at the moment. Soaring needs more wealthy pilots(time, money, energy, and desire) if you want large youth programs.
PS Sean do you have your CFI?

Good points Gregg. It's going to be very hard, but this must be the SSA's "OBVIOUS" top priority. I'm not seeing very much in the way of even "light chatter" on this topic unfortunately.

No CFIG yet but I am planning on earning one. Maybe next spring. I just need to find some time.

I have been training/supporting a couple fairly famous photographers (one sports focused and the other a pure nature artist) to fly some very advanced custom drones (which help design and build to carry their ridiculous cameras) safely and efficiently ;-). That has been incredibly fun and rewarding.. I get to work with ESPN, NBC, America's Cup, etc. I plan on continuing with that.

For soaring, I would mainly be interested in a CFIG for teaching & promoting cross country soaring.

No trust fund here unfortunately.

Sean

At 16:26 08 November 2016, Sean wrote:
Good points Gregg. It's going to be very hard, but this must be
the SSA's
=
"OBVIOUS" top priority. I'm not seeing very much in the way of
even
"light=
chatter" on this topic unfortunately.

No CFIG yet but I am planning on earning one. Maybe next
spring. I just
n=
eed to find some time. =20

I have been training/supporting a couple fairly famous
photographers (one
s=
ports focused and the other a pure nature artist) to fly some very
advanced=
custom drones (which help design and build to carry their
ridiculous
camer=
as) safely and efficiently ;-). That has been incredibly fun and
rewarding=
.. I get to work with ESPN, NBC, America's Cup, etc. I plan on
continuing
=
with that.

For soaring, I would mainly be interested in a CFIG for teaching &
promotin=
g cross country soaring.

No trust fund here unfortunately.

Sean


You could volunteer to be on the SSA Youth Education Committee.
You might possibly even get to be the chairperson. Maybe you can
promote your social media skills to the SSA board, and maybe come
up with an SSA sponsored youth initiative which will be more
appealing to young people than what is out there right now. It is an
all volunteer thing, so the loudest complainers will be given the
chance to actually do something about it if they really want to....

RO

On Tuesday, 8 November 2016 16:41:26 UTC+11, Sean wrote:

Just look at Britain, Australia, France, Germany, etc. They seem to have great youth energy and participation (at all levels). Many have several national youth competitions, each with 50+ youth pilots each (plus instructors, etc). Imagine 3 or 4 seniors full of Juniors. Great parties for the kids, fun, etc. A great vibe. Healthy, active social media, video (youtube), twitter, snap-chat, etc.


Sorry to say, same problems as you down under! Our club runs a youth scholarship program and very little retention is seen. Although that's no worse than the retention rates from other recruitment sources!

Cheers Ben