World Contest - 15m class

OK Leo L-B, time to step in; curious minds have questions.

Like many, I've been following the Jonker JS1 18-21 self launcher webpage found here http://www.js1.co.za/js2selflaun.htm . First thing I noticed was JS2 in the URL. So after awing over all the pictures (I love that kind of stuff) curiosity set in. Why would Jonker go to the expense and trouble of designing a new fuselage for the SL when the current JS1 fuselage was a "knock-off" of an outstanding self launch fuselage being the ASH-26? And, why would they show a new wing mold when there isn't an announced wing change to the 18-21 EVO? Obviously, they get only so many "pulls" off a mold before it has to be replaced but it came across as a "something different" mold.

The recent SA FAI SGP YouTube broadcasts got my attention when the JS3 was mentioned...news to me. Even more surprised to learn Jonker discussed it at 2016 Nephi and that "scoop" didn't make it to R.A.S.

What does make since...at least to me...is the pictures on the above self launching site are actually the JS3 which I understand will have a 15-18 wing and not a 13.5-15 wing that has also been mentioned. New fuselage and wing molds certainly make sense here.

Shaking my head in disbelief that I'm agreeing with Sean, I think the Jonker brothers have taken the lead in current competition sailplane design. Great job Team Jonker.

On Thursday, November 24, 2016 at 12:44:42 PM UTC-5, wrote:
OK Leo L-B, time to step in; curious minds have questions.

Like many, I've been following the Jonker JS1 18-21 self launcher webpage found here http://www.js1.co.za/js2selflaun.htm . First thing I noticed was JS2 in the URL. So after awing over all the pictures (I love that kind of stuff) curiosity set in. Why would Jonker go to the expense and trouble of designing a new fuselage for the SL when the current JS1 fuselage was a "knock-off" of an outstanding self launch fuselage being the ASH-26? And, why would they show a new wing mold when there isn't an announced wing change to the 18-21 EVO? Obviously, they get only so many "pulls" off a mold before it has to be replaced but it came across as a "something different" mold.

The recent SA FAI SGP YouTube broadcasts got my attention when the JS3 was mentioned...news to me. Even more surprised to learn Jonker discussed it at 2016 Nephi and that "scoop" didn't make it to R.A.S.

What does make since...at least to me...is the pictures on the above self launching site are actually the JS3 which I understand will have a 15-18 wing and not a 13.5-15 wing that has also been mentioned. New fuselage and wing molds certainly make sense here.

Shaking my head in disbelief that I'm agreeing with Sean, I think the Jonker brothers have taken the lead in current competition sailplane design. Great job Team Jonker.

The reason they needed to create a new fuselage for the SL version is because the Schleicher engine is narrower than lawn mower engines found in other gliders . They had no access to the Wankel engine.

On Thursday, 24 November 2016 10:44:42 UTC-7, wrote:
OK Leo L-B, time to step in; curious minds have questions.

Like many, I've been following the Jonker JS1 18-21 self launcher webpage found here http://www.js1.co.za/js2selflaun.htm . First thing I noticed was JS2 in the URL. So after awing over all the pictures (I love that kind of stuff) curiosity set in. Why would Jonker go to the expense and trouble of designing a new fuselage for the SL when the current JS1 fuselage was a "knock-off" of an outstanding self launch fuselage being the ASH-26? And, why would they show a new wing mold when there isn't an announced wing change to the 18-21 EVO? Obviously, they get only so many "pulls" off a mold before it has to be replaced but it came across as a "something different" mold.

The recent SA FAI SGP YouTube broadcasts got my attention when the JS3 was mentioned...news to me. Even more surprised to learn Jonker discussed it at 2016 Nephi and that "scoop" didn't make it to R.A.S.



What does make since...at least to me...is the pictures on the above self launching site are actually the JS3 which I understand will have a 15-18 wing and not a 13.5-15 wing that has also been mentioned. New fuselage and wing molds certainly make sense here.

Shaking my head in disbelief that I'm agreeing with Sean, I think the Jonker brothers have taken the lead in current competition sailplane design. Great job Team Jonker.

At Nephi in late June, Ace delivered a presentation on the overall approach that Jonkers is taking towards their business and designing and delivering current and new products to the marketplace. There were very few if any specifics provided on new models etc.

In private conversations Ace provided more details but again was careful not to promise anything or spill the beans.

I am aware that some pilots were approached and signed non-disclosure documents for forth coming specifics.

Regarding new molds, the company realizes that they need to ramp up production and tweak their processes when additional models are in production. They brought a lot to the table from the days of a repair shop and used that to get their first model(s) to the market. Now they are taking the next steps.

Marketing is not a strength of any glider manufacturer and IMO Jonkers is doing as well as anybody in the industry.

I look forward to seeing what all the manufacturers do and I for one am grateful for what they are producing and supporting for such a small finicky marketplace. I am also grateful for the companies that are delivering electronics and other accessories to the marketplace we utilize to have fun.

Ron Gleason

Is the JS-3 using a new wing, or are they just chopping off the existing wing inboard of 15m, and using new 15m tips?

Loved flying the Janus and a Nimbus4D (looks like the same cockpit), but SH left much performance on the table by not updating their fuselage, I think the ASH-25 outsold the Nimbus 4D three to one and the ASH-25 was just a better performing glider, having placed as high at the podium in World Gliding Championships.

As for SH and their adherence to a 1970's fuselage design with a side hinged canopy... I has the fuselage really been updated since the first ventus C? I know they updated the tail feathers from the Vents 2C to the Ventus 2CX, not sure why they could not have designed it right the first time!!! I think it was 8 weeks after I got my new Ventus 2C licensed that SH announced they had finished the design and were now offering the Ventus 2CX. After waiting two years receive a glider that SH knew needed more design work before it was released, I was unhappy. Plus it arrived with x kilograms of weight in the tail when it should have had x pounds, that's right 2.2 times the tail weight it should have had. If you haven't flown a glider past the aft limits, I can tell you it is very squirrly, had difficultly keeping the airspeed between 45 and 75 knots.

Does anyone actually like the side hinged canopy?


On Wednesday, November 23, 2016 at 10:30:39 AM UTC-8, Bruce Hoult wrote:

The same canopy fits a mid 1970s Janus and a modern Duo Discus!

On Thursday, November 24, 2016 at 7:48:10 PM UTC+3, Jonathan St. Cloud wrote:
Loved flying the Janus and a Nimbus4D (looks like the same cockpit), but SH left much performance on the table by not updating their fuselage, I think the ASH-25 outsold the Nimbus 4D three to one and the ASH-25 was just a better performing glider, having placed as high at the podium in World Gliding Championships.

As for SH and their adherence to a 1970's fuselage design with a side hinged canopy... I has the fuselage really been updated since the first ventus C? I know they updated the tail feathers from the Vents 2C to the Ventus 2CX, not sure why they could not have designed it right the first time!!! I think it was 8 weeks after I got my new Ventus 2C licensed that SH announced they had finished the design and were now offering the Ventus 2CX. After waiting two years receive a glider that SH knew needed more design work before it was released, I was unhappy. Plus it arrived with x kilograms of weight in the tail when it should have had x pounds, that's right 2.2 times the tail weight it should have had. If you haven't flown a glider past the aft limits, I can tell you it is very squirrly, had difficultly keeping the airspeed between 45 and 75 knots.

Does anyone actually like the side hinged canopy?


On Wednesday, November 23, 2016 at 10:30:39 AM UTC-8, Bruce Hoult wrote:

The same canopy fits a mid 1970s Janus and a modern Duo Discus!

I've seldom flown anything else!

Blanik -- side hinged
Twin Astir -- 2x side hinged
Janus -- side hinged
Duo -- side hinged
DG1000 -- 2x side hinged

PW5 -- front hinged
Club Libelle -- rear hinged
ASK21 -- 1x front hinged, 1x rear hinged

Ka6 and Std Libelle -- totally unhinged

Must be late in Moscow! Side hinged is a pain when assembly or if you take two steps away from canopy and there is a wind gust.


On Thursday, November 24, 2016 at 1:55:39 PM UTC-8, Bruce Hoult wrote:
On Thursday, November 24, 2016 at 7:48:10 PM UTC+3, Jonathan St. Cloud wrote:
Loved flying the Janus and a Nimbus4D (looks like the same cockpit), but SH left much performance on the table by not updating their fuselage, I think the ASH-25 outsold the Nimbus 4D three to one and the ASH-25 was just a better performing glider, having placed as high at the podium in World Gliding Championships.

As for SH and their adherence to a 1970's fuselage design with a side hinged canopy... I has the fuselage really been updated since the first ventus C? I know they updated the tail feathers from the Vents 2C to the Ventus 2CX, not sure why they could not have designed it right the first time!!! I think it was 8 weeks after I got my new Ventus 2C licensed that SH announced they had finished the design and were now offering the Ventus 2CX. After waiting two years receive a glider that SH knew needed more design work before it was released, I was unhappy. Plus it arrived with x kilograms of weight in the tail when it should have had x pounds, that's right 2.2 times the tail weight it should have had. If you haven't flown a glider past the aft limits, I can tell you it is very squirrly, had difficultly keeping the airspeed between 45 and 75 knots.

Does anyone actually like the side hinged canopy?


On Wednesday, November 23, 2016 at 10:30:39 AM UTC-8, Bruce Hoult wrote:

The same canopy fits a mid 1970s Janus and a modern Duo Discus!

I've seldom flown anything else!

Blanik -- side hinged
Twin Astir -- 2x side hinged
Janus -- side hinged
Duo -- side hinged
DG1000 -- 2x side hinged

PW5 -- front hinged
Club Libelle -- rear hinged
ASK21 -- 1x front hinged, 1x rear hinged

Ka6 and Std Libelle -- totally unhinged