Don't point RPGs at US soldiers!

"John Keeney" wrote in message
...

"Dav1936531" wrote in message
...
From: "Kevin Brooks"


Up until you mentioned the bipod, you had me thinking M-21. But I don't
recall
seeing any bipods being used with M-21's (and I seriously doubt any of
the
ones
that were at one *distant* time available for M-14's are still around).
I
guess
it could be an M-21 with a bipod, but I have never seen one so equipped
(note
that the M-24 bolt action replacment does have a bipod included in the
kit).
OTOH, are you sure you were maybe not gettting a squirrely view of a
M-249
(which does indeed have a bipod) with a 30-round magazine in place of
the
usual
drum mag? I am having a problem getting around the whole sniper-with-M21
thing;
I had a sniper-type attend a school with me way back in 1995-96, and I
can
rememeber his telling me they had already replaced the M-21 with the
M-24
in
his ARNG light infantry battalion (and it was not an "enhanced brigade"
unit,
either, so their priority of fill would have been about the same as the
rest of
the Guard units).
Brooks

The pic was on the AP wire feed from Iraq here on AOL. Unfortunately,
the
articles and pics expire after a given period of time and disappear from
the
feed so I cannot now call the picture back up and rellok at it.

The guy definitely had some variant of the M-14. I have wanted one of
these for
a long time and recognize it. It was not a bolt action. It was not an
M-249.

I could have incorrectly recalled that his rifle was equiped with a
bipod
though. But it certainly was some type of the basic M-14 and had a
telescope,
and I seem to recall a bipod.....but I saw the pic probably a month and
a
half
or so ago, and my memory isn't what it used to be.
Dave

I know I posted on this before, but I'll repeat incase it got sucked
up in to the great bit bucket in the sky. Yes, at the very minimum
I can guaranty that one NYAG unit currently attached to the 1st ID
in Iraq have M-14s as issued equipment. They are issued to unit
"Marksmen" in addition to which ever flavor of M-16 / M-4 that
infantryman is issued. Marksmen are not rated snipers but provide
a bit of precision in a spray & pray world.

I'd be very surprised if they are carrying M14's. The M-14 offers danged
little in terms of "precision" versus the M16A2 in the likely ironsight
range fan (the A2 is plenty accurate oput to the 300 meter range). I guess
they could have some old M-21's (which unlike the M-14 have a telescopic
sight)--but which combat unit of the NYARNG is attached to the 1st ID? ISTR
that the NYARNG 42nd ID(M) HQ is indeed deploying to Iraq later this year
(or early next year?).

Brooks

"Kevin Brooks" wrote in message
...

I know I posted on this before, but I'll repeat incase it got sucked
up in to the great bit bucket in the sky. Yes, at the very minimum
I can guaranty that one NYAG unit currently attached to the 1st ID
in Iraq have M-14s as issued equipment. They are issued to unit
"Marksmen" in addition to which ever flavor of M-16 / M-4 that
infantryman is issued. Marksmen are not rated snipers but provide
a bit of precision in a spray & pray world.

I'd be very surprised if they are carrying M14's. The M-14 offers danged
little in terms of "precision" versus the M16A2 in the likely ironsight
range fan (the A2 is plenty accurate oput to the 300 meter range).

Be surprised, be very surprised. I know this via an NCO who's got
them in his unit.
Oh, I checked the unit is carrying the M-4 version of the M-16.

I guess they could have some old M-21's (which unlike the M-14 have
a telescopic sight)--

Variations on a theme. It could be an M-21, I fail to make the distinction
quite often and my source may be the same. Then again, he once defined
"HEDP" as "High Explosive Deep Penetrating." Yes, he was ashamed.

but which combat unit of the NYARNG is attached to the 1st ID? ISTR
that the NYARNG 42nd ID(M) HQ is indeed deploying to Iraq later this year
(or early next year?).

I don't know if I should call it the 27th Infantry Brigade or 42nd ID,
the guys went as the 27th & got taken in by the 1st ID but the part
that didn't has since been absorbed into the 42nd ID.

"John Keeney" wrote in message
...

"Kevin Brooks" wrote in message
...

I know I posted on this before, but I'll repeat incase it got sucked
up in to the great bit bucket in the sky. Yes, at the very minimum
I can guaranty that one NYAG unit currently attached to the 1st ID
in Iraq have M-14s as issued equipment. They are issued to unit
"Marksmen" in addition to which ever flavor of M-16 / M-4 that
infantryman is issued. Marksmen are not rated snipers but provide
a bit of precision in a spray & pray world.

I'd be very surprised if they are carrying M14's. The M-14 offers danged
little in terms of "precision" versus the M16A2 in the likely ironsight
range fan (the A2 is plenty accurate oput to the 300 meter range).

Be surprised, be very surprised. I know this via an NCO who's got
them in his unit.
Oh, I checked the unit is carrying the M-4 version of the M-16.

Not surprised, disbelieveing (of the M-14 offering significantly greater
accuracy in the 300 meter and below range). Having fired both the M-14 and
the M-16 (A1 and A2 versions), the idea that the M-14 (sans telescopic
sight) is significantly more accurate in the hands of a rifleman in the
likely engagement range limits is just not very believable.


I guess they could have some old M-21's (which unlike the M-14 have
a telescopic sight)--

Variations on a theme. It could be an M-21, I fail to make the distinction
quite often and my source may be the same. Then again, he once defined
"HEDP" as "High Explosive Deep Penetrating." Yes, he was ashamed.

Question--is your source a truly knowledgable and reliable individual?
Having spend many years around troops, I can vouch for the fact that some,
just like their civilian counterparts, either get things wrong (like your
HEDP example), or worse can "overextend" themselves (i.e., verge into the
tall-tale arena).

As far as "variations on a theme" goes...only if you consider a specialized
development capable of reliably hitting a silouette at 600-800 meters (the
M-21) versus the 300-400 meters of the original (M-14 with iron sights--and
400 meters is definitely pushing that capability; just *seeing* the 300
meter target pop up is difficult enough on most ranges...) a "variation upon
a theme". What this guy may be referring to is a trickle-down supply of
M-21's resulting from the fielding of the M-24 to sniper elements (and as an
enhanced light brigade you can be assured the 27th got the M-24 in its
greedy little hands six-to-eight years ago, at least) to unit
marksmen--something I acknowledged was a possibility earlier in the thread.


but which combat unit of the NYARNG is attached to the 1st ID? ISTR
that the NYARNG 42nd ID(M) HQ is indeed deploying to Iraq later this
year
(or early next year?).

I don't know if I should call it the 27th Infantry Brigade or 42nd ID,
the guys went as the 27th & got taken in by the 1st ID but the part
that didn't has since been absorbed into the 42nd ID.

Based upon a quick check at DefenseLink, it is probably 1-108th Inf, one of
the three light infantry battalions assigned to the 27th SIB(L) (Enhanced);
makes sense, as a battalion of light fighters provides a heavy division like
1st ID(M) with greater versatility and more "boots on the ground" combat
grunts. And in a (minor) effort to keep this somewhere near on-topic, at
least one of the companies of that battalion is designated as "air assault"
in the DoD release (though that is not an assurance of accuracy--DefenseLink
has been known to screw up unit ID's from time to time). The 27th SIB is
still shown as being a seperate brigade; as one of the 15 enhanced brigades
of the ARNG, it is extremely unlikely to have been "absorbed" into the 42nd
ID(M) (the ARNG state HQ's generally love having their enhanced units, and
would scream bloody murder at the thought of losing one because they result
in greater resource allocation to the state HQ). What may be happening is
that the 27th SIB(-) has been attached to the 42nd ID(-) for their upcoming
deployment to Iraq.

Brooks