A Tale of Two Takeoffs

Looks like Evan and I were typing at the same time and have had the same experience.

On Monday, June 19, 2017 at 2:25:49 PM UTC-4, Steve Koerner wrote:
Looks like Evan and I were typing at the same time and have had the same experience.

Yep. Loss of roll control in my case too.

-Evan

It's not like I haven't been there, guys. The ballasted occasions are almost all at contests and the tow pilots have generally responded to my agonized pleas for more speed.

The scariest one was actually dry, though, at a local club. It's the closest I've come to losing roll control or having to pull the release. And, yes, I was in near-low-tow position.

I was just wondering if settling even lower might help get me out of the downwash, at least when using a longish rope. I've towed at Hank's Middletown operation, which uses low tow exclusively, and if you're not used to it, it looks very strange (although it works very well). I don't think I've been down that low in my slow-tow adventures.

Chip Bearden
"JB"

At 19:02 19 June 2017, wrote:
It's not like I haven't been there, guys. The ballasted occasions
are
almos=
t all at contests and the tow pilots have generally responded to my
agonize=
d pleas for more speed.

The scariest one was actually dry, though, at a local club. It's the
closes=
t I've come to losing roll control or having to pull the release. And,
yes,=
I was in near-low-tow position.=20

I was just wondering if settling even lower might help get me out
of the
do=
wnwash, at least when using a longish rope. I've towed at Hank's
Middletown=
operation, which uses low tow exclusively, and if you're not used
to it,
i=
t looks very strange (although it works very well). I don't think
I've
been=
down that low in my slow-tow adventures.

Chip Bearden
"JB"

I have been there, in my case I was in a K21 2 up behind a Rotax
Falke. (Motor glider with big engine). I was definitely in low tow and
had no way of getting out of it. The problem as I see it is that if
you sink low enough you could make it extremely difficult for the
tug to lower the nose to give you more speed, in which case he will
probably give you the rope, not a situation I would care to be in.
The radio call in my case was heeded.
Someone once told be that in Australia they all use low tow as the
norm, even releasing in low tow which I admit I never have. I have
always used low tow on cross country tows as it is a lot more
stable. I have always transitioned to high tow for release.

On Tuesday, 20 June 2017 08:30:05 UTC+10, Don Johnstone wrote:


I have been there, in my case I was in a K21 2 up behind a Rotax
Falke. (Motor glider with big engine). I was definitely in low tow and
had no way of getting out of it. The problem as I see it is that if
you sink low enough you could make it extremely difficult for the
tug to lower the nose to give you more speed, in which case he will
probably give you the rope, not a situation I would care to be in.
The radio call in my case was heeded.
Someone once told be that in Australia they all use low tow as the
norm, even releasing in low tow which I admit I never have. I have
always used low tow on cross country tows as it is a lot more
stable. I have always transitioned to high tow for release.


Confirmed, low tow is the norm here - just below the prop wash. The only time I have been in high tow is boxing the slipstream. One of our old hands used to transition to high tow for release (it was speculated that it was to get a few free feet of altitude) but it wasn't appreciated by the tuggies.

I have had one "memorable" towing speed incident. In my first ballasted comp. flying a Jantar Standard, the tow plane climbed out while I was still on the ground. I yanked the glider into the air and it took a few moments to get my wits about me to call for more speed. It was not something I had expected or prepared for and I should have released. It still gets my nerves jangling when I recall it.

I am doubly careful to make sure the tow pilot knows I am ballasted now, thanks goodness I have not had such an experience since (although I have had to ask for a few more knots now and then).

Cheers Ben

From our testing, you "almost" can't get too low on the towplane, most still have elevator authority (for lowering the nose) when you are really low unlike getting too high and you dive him in.

At 01:17 20 June 2017, Charlie M. UH & 002 owner/pilot wrote:
From our testing, you "almost" can't get too low on the towplane,
most
still have elevator authority (for lowering the nose) when you are
really
low unlike getting too high and you dive him in.

Perhaps we can all learn from the boys in Oz. From the last two posts
tug upsets should be almost unknown in Australia.
Is there a case for making low tow the standard towing position in the
rest of the world?
Just from the lessening of the chance of a tug upset it seems that low
tow is the safest option.

Or moving off center to one side Towpilots can skip leg day. Wonder if there is an ingestion, rather than simple interference, of the towplane wake at the glider wingtips similar to helicopter settling with power?
On Tuesday, June 20, 2017 at 2:00:06 AM UTC-4, Don Johnstone wrote:
At 01:17 20 June 2017, Charlie M. UH & 002 owner/pilot wrote:
From our testing, you "almost" can't get too low on the towplane,
most
still have elevator authority (for lowering the nose) when you are
really
low unlike getting too high and you dive him in.

Perhaps we can all learn from the boys in Oz. From the last two posts
tug upsets should be almost unknown in Australia.
Is there a case for making low tow the standard towing position in the
rest of the world?
Just from the lessening of the chance of a tug upset it seems that low
tow is the safest option.