Train Wreck

On Wednesday, November 8, 2017 at 3:19:36 PM UTC-7, wrote:



So, I would appreciate it if you refrained from further ill-advised and erroneous public "guesses" regarding 7T's behavior as a USA Team member, ........
Gina

Gina,
7T's behavior at Benalla is not what is in question here. I am sure you realize this but you have decided, For whatever reason, to blur an important distinction. From what I am able to gather from the SSA website is that 7T was in fact offered a spot on the US team but declined. 7T's FB and personal web page do not make mention of this (Granted, I didn't dig too deep on either page). So which is it? Good ol boyz and cronyism or did the selection committee see the potential in his flying and offer a spot on the team.
Granted, I am not a fan of the hair pulling that goes on here (RAS), But one good thing that can come out of this thread is a discussion of the US Team decision to move off of a merit based system and the logic behind the current team member selections.

Someone wrote this to me:

"Gina,
7T's behavior at Benalla is not what is in question here. I am sure you realize this but you have decided, For whatever reason, to blur an important distinction."

If you are going to personally address me, it is common courtesy that you sign your posts.

If you read my two posts at RAS, you'll see that they are corrections of another poster's incorrect assumptions or statements. Mr Christner had quoted a portion of the US Team Code of Conduct and had asked John Cochrane if he could "certify that [7T] has met all of these requirements". Because John Cochrane was not in attendance at the Benalla WGC, I myself assured Mr Christner that Sean Fidler's behavior at the WGC was exemplary (as was the conduct of all the other Team Members).

Subsequently, Mr Christner quoted the same portion of the US Team Code of Conduct and opined that pilots are required to adhere to the Code "at ALL times, not just during a competition." I then corrected that mistaken assumption by quoting the relevant portions of the US Team Code of Conduct -- the Code is specific to WGC competitions and is not meant to be a requirement, 24-7, for all competition pilots who might possibly be future US Team Members.

It was important to make these corrections to Mr Christner's mistaken assumptions, because he was using them to support his call for a "permanent ban from future competition" for one of USA's top competition pilots.

It's always a good idea to correct mistaken assumptions or statements, especially when they are the argumentative basis for actions with very serious consequences, don't you agree, Mr or Ms Somebody?

Gina



On Friday, November 10, 2017 at 4:16:37 AM UTC+13, wrote:
On Wednesday, November 8, 2017 at 3:19:36 PM UTC-7, wrote:



So, I would appreciate it if you refrained from further ill-advised and erroneous public "guesses" regarding 7T's behavior as a USA Team member, ........
Gina

Gina,
7T's behavior at Benalla is not what is in question here. I am sure you realize this but you have decided, For whatever reason, to blur an important distinction. From what I am able to gather from the SSA website is that 7T was in fact offered a spot on the US team but declined. 7T's FB and personal web page do not make mention of this (Granted, I didn't dig too deep on either page). So which is it? Good ol boyz and cronyism or did the selection committee see the potential in his flying and offer a spot on the team.
Granted, I am not a fan of the hair pulling that goes on here (RAS), But one good thing that can come out of this thread is a discussion of the US Team decision to move off of a merit based system and the logic behind the current team member selections.

On Thursday, November 9, 2017 at 2:10:16 PM UTC-7, wrote:
Someone wrote this to me:

"Gina,
7T's behavior at Benalla is not what is in question here. I am sure you realize this but you have decided, For whatever reason, to blur an important distinction."

If you are going to personally address me, it is common courtesy that you sign your posts.

If you read my two posts at RAS, you'll see that they are corrections of another poster's incorrect assumptions or statements. Mr Christner had quoted a portion of the US Team Code of Conduct and had asked John Cochrane if he could "certify that [7T] has met all of these requirements". Because John Cochrane was not in attendance at the Benalla WGC, I myself assured Mr Christner that Sean Fidler's behavior at the WGC was exemplary (as was the conduct of all the other Team Members).

Subsequently, Mr Christner quoted the same portion of the US Team Code of Conduct and opined that pilots are required to adhere to the Code "at ALL times, not just during a competition." I then corrected that mistaken assumption by quoting the relevant portions of the US Team Code of Conduct -- the Code is specific to WGC competitions and is not meant to be a requirement, 24-7, for all competition pilots who might possibly be future US Team Members.

It was important to make these corrections to Mr Christner's mistaken assumptions, because he was using them to support his call for a "permanent ban from future competition" for one of USA's top competition pilots.

It's always a good idea to correct mistaken assumptions or statements, especially when they are the argumentative basis for actions with very serious consequences, don't you agree, Mr or Ms Somebody?

Gina



On Friday, November 10, 2017 at 4:16:37 AM UTC+13, wrote:
On Wednesday, November 8, 2017 at 3:19:36 PM UTC-7, wrote:



So, I would appreciate it if you refrained from further ill-advised and erroneous public "guesses" regarding 7T's behavior as a USA Team member, .......
Gina

Gina,
7T's behavior at Benalla is not what is in question here. I am sure you realize this but you have decided, For whatever reason, to blur an important distinction. From what I am able to gather from the SSA website is that 7T was in fact offered a spot on the US team but declined. 7T's FB and personal web page do not make mention of this (Granted, I didn't dig too deep on either page). So which is it? Good ol boyz and cronyism or did the selection committee see the potential in his flying and offer a spot on the team.
Granted, I am not a fan of the hair pulling that goes on here (RAS), But one good thing that can come out of this thread is a discussion of the US Team decision to move off of a merit based system and the logic behind the current team member selections.

Gina, (if this really is Gina?), You and I have chatted over the years. You have even helped me at contest's and we have shared dinners chatting. Since Sean wishes honesty, I share the below as it's a direct copy of a post to Seans FB page by another. Why does the poster state what you share differently?

Sean Fidler Soaring
October 31 at 8:38am ·
From an unnamed friend this AM.
“What fools. So a guy (Sean Fidler) wins his second competition day at
a World Championships (totally unheard of) in the 18m class (with a
teammate who refused to team fly and with virtually no team support,
wife had to communicate) and is skipped over in the selection that
SAME year for the next world championships for an insider (Good old
boy pet) who was way behind in the their countries own international
rankings (which use different rules). What’s the problem? That sounds
completely justifiable. Nothing to see here. Move along. Extended
laughter...Jesus F Christ...f€%k that and F$&k them...you have been
right all along Sean...�
Well said I think.
Next statement...�you know the test on this is to ask yourself, if the
situation was reversed, would you have been picked?�
Next statement...�that’s borderline criminal...�
Thanks everyone but the decision is final.


Sean even states "The decision is final". So, Gina, the above poster does state their were problems which you never saw. So, by what "others" are seeing/reading, they are simply giving their comments/views. Honest communication, by all parties, could end this. But this train wreck has had earlier derailments, which have never been corrected. In most, if not all sports, this is seen/experienced.

Thanks Gina, Best. Tom #711.

Hi, Tom

The purpose of your post isn't entirely clear to me. You rather vaguely indicate that others "saw" "problems" that I never saw. If you meant "problems" regarding 7T's behavior at the Worlds, then of course I am not witness to, or privy to, everything that took place at Benalla. I never claimed such omniscience. Other Team Members are naturally welcome to state their own opinions regarding what they personally witnessed, if they are so inclined.

I'll repeat this one more time. Kevin Christner, who was not at the Benalla WGC, suggested that 7T would not be able to meet the requirements of the US Team Code of Conduct. As someone who spent more time in the presence of Team 7T than most everyone else on the US Team, I felt qualified to reply to Mr Christner and reveal what I witnessed, day after day, week after week, at the Worlds in January. I repeat -- I witnessed nothing but exemplary behavior from Team 7T.

If anyone believes that I am not entitled to my own opinion in this regard, then please do us all a favor and keep it to yourself.

Gina



Gina, (if this really is Gina?), You and I have chatted over the years. You have even helped me at contest's and we have shared dinners chatting. Since Sean wishes honesty, I share the below as it's a direct copy of a post to Seans FB page by another. Why does the poster state what you share differently?

Sean Fidler Soaring
October 31 at 8:38am ·
From an unnamed friend this AM.
“What fools. So a guy (Sean Fidler) wins his second competition day at
a World Championships (totally unheard of) in the 18m class (with a
teammate who refused to team fly and with virtually no team support,
wife had to communicate) and is skipped over in the selection that
SAME year for the next world championships for an insider (Good old
boy pet) who was way behind in the their countries own international
rankings (which use different rules). What’s the problem? That sounds
completely justifiable. Nothing to see here. Move along. Extended
laughter...Jesus F Christ...f€%k that and F$&k them...you have been
right all along Sean...�
Well said I think.
Next statement...�you know the test on this is to ask yourself, if the
situation was reversed, would you have been picked?�
Next statement...�that’s borderline criminal...�
Thanks everyone but the decision is final.


Sean even states "The decision is final". So, Gina, the above poster does state their were problems which you never saw. So, by what "others" are seeing/reading, they are simply giving their comments/views. Honest communication, by all parties, could end this. But this train wreck has had earlier derailments, which have never been corrected. In most, if not all sports, this is seen/experienced.

Thanks Gina, Best. Tom #711.

On Thursday, November 9, 2017 at 3:48:24 PM UTC-8, wrote:

...favor...

On Thursday, November 9, 2017 at 2:10:16 PM UTC-7, wrote:
Someone wrote this to me:

It's always a good idea to correct mistaken assumptions or statements, especially when they are the argumentative basis for actions with very serious consequences, don't you agree, Mr or Ms Somebody?

Gina
Gina,
I thought that night in Benalla was bigger than the both of us but now I am just "Mr Somebody? Was I just another notch in your lipstick case?
(Laughing) Is this 7T? (Laughing harder) How is it you show up here with a new account and only 4 posts claiming to be a crew member and yet you have more intimate knowledge of the SSA rules than most competitors?
Sean, I mean Gina, You probably don't remember me but we met briefly at the Nats. I am one of the dozens of casual competitors who enjoyed meeting you and talking in person and is entertained by your zainy interweb antics (Weren't you the one who started a soaring classified on FB over a snit with Tim Mara?).
This IS better than TV. I'm gonna grab another beer.

Mr Somebody again addressed me personally, without the courtesy of identifying himself, and wrote:

"How is it you show up here with a new account and only 4 posts claiming to be a crew member and you have more intimate knowledge of the SSA rules than most competitors?"

I claimed to be a crew member at Benalla because I was. You erroneously state that I have "intimate knowledge of the SSA rules." I merely did a Google search for the US Team Code of Conduct and read it. And I don't know who "Tim Mara" is.

Sean Murphy can enlighten you regarding the existential dilemma that you are having, Mr Somebody (or do you prefer Mr Nobody?). XC knows who I am. I had the pleasure of meeting him shortly before he flew in his first Worlds.. The 15m US Team did an excellent job at Benalla, and I enjoyed every minute of it.

Perhaps you should lay off the beer. The only pilot I know who can drink like a fish and not act like a dork is P7.

Gina Wilson
New Zealand



On Friday, November 10, 2017 at 3:24:43 PM UTC+13, wrote:
On Thursday, November 9, 2017 at 2:10:16 PM UTC-7, wrote:
Someone wrote this to me:

It's always a good idea to correct mistaken assumptions or statements, especially when they are the argumentative basis for actions with very serious consequences, don't you agree, Mr or Ms Somebody?

Gina
Gina,
I thought that night in Benalla was bigger than the both of us but now I am just "Mr Somebody? Was I just another notch in your lipstick case?
(Laughing) Is this 7T? (Laughing harder) How is it you show up here with a new account and only 4 posts claiming to be a crew member and yet you have more intimate knowledge of the SSA rules than most competitors?
Sean, I mean Gina, You probably don't remember me but we met briefly at the Nats. I am one of the dozens of casual competitors who enjoyed meeting you and talking in person and is entertained by your zainy interweb antics (Weren't you the one who started a soaring classified on FB over a snit with Tim Mara?).
This IS better than TV. I'm gonna grab another beer.

7T has been known to post under an alias here and in the sailboat racing world but not this time. I am convinced that last post was P7's crew, Gina. A delightful soul.

As to 711's post and anyone else who may be interested.

Gina is absolutely correct. There was no dysfunction with our team in Benalla. Everyone got along. Sean Fidler was a perfect gentleman. The pilots and crews represented the US well. John Good worked very hard (7am-11pm) and did two jobs as team captain and team manager. Tiffany, Gina and other folks did double duty to help out. Not to say we had enough help but it was a fun cooperative effort. Great experience.

This whole post began as my shocked reaction to Sean Fidler attacking his teammates and friends on the USTC after not getting selected in 18m. I mean to say John Good didn't do a good job is crazy! And the other vile things....nuts! He was offered a slot on the 15m squad after all. I continue to be mystified at how someone could act in such a manner.

I still can't believe it but I've said enough about all that...perhaps too much.

XC
Sean Murphy

On Thursday, November 9, 2017 at 8:54:30 PM UTC-7, XC wrote:
7T has been known to post under an alias here and in the sailboat racing world but not this time.............
Thanks for the clarification XC. I figured this was another Wilbur or Orville thing again. When I first read this thread I was rooting for 7T to hopefully be able to resolve this issue and move on but after some of the responses it shows how toxic this behavior really is.
And to the real Gina, I will echo what myself and others have said, No issues with anyone in person, But on the internet it is a completely different story. When I first posted I was hoping 7T would get beyond the accusations and name calling and shed some insight (That was naive on my part).
And lastly JAMES, I usually do not dignify childish posts like yours with a response, but Tosser? Really? Is name calling necessary? Stop and think for a minute, Soaring is a small community and referring to people as jerk offs and scum is just counter productive.

On Thursday, November 9, 2017 at 11:50:40 PM UTC-7, K m wrote:
On Thursday, November 9, 2017 at 8:54:30 PM UTC-7, XC wrote:
7T has been known to post under an alias here and in the sailboat racing world but not this time.............
Thanks for the clarification XC. I figured this was another Wilbur or Orville thing again. When I first read this thread I was rooting for 7T to hopefully be able to resolve this issue and move on but after some of the responses it shows how toxic this behavior really is.
And to the real Gina, I will echo what myself and others have said, No issues with anyone in person, But on the internet it is a completely different story. When I first posted I was hoping 7T would get beyond the accusations and name calling and shed some insight (That was naive on my part).
And lastly JAMES, I usually do not dignify childish posts like yours with a response, but Tosser? Really? Is name calling necessary? Stop and think for a minute, Soaring is a small community and referring to people as jerk offs and scum is just counter productive.

My God, "SCUM", is a 4 letter word which was sold on many T-Shirts and carrying bags by the late CD Charlie Lite. These 4 letters mean "Sailplane Crew Union Member". The "real" KM would know this! JS was the crew for both the AU folks who came to Uvalde this last summer, which Bruce Taylor won. JS is the one who also lent Bruce Taylor his ASG 29 for Nephi the year before.
As Gina stated earlier, why don't you sign your name because your not who some may think you are, Mr/Ms. Nobody!
Thank you, both XC and Gina, as I also will support your views on 7T at all the contests we have been at together. As a matter of fact, at all the contest's I have ever been to, I have always seen a good showing of Sportsmanship and Camaraderie with the entrant's, crew's, tow pilot's, contest management and line folks. Might have missed a few, but them too.

Best. Tom #711.