$75,000 2-33

Uli, send your son 1.5 hours down to Prescott We have several Embry Riddle students and several 14-16 year olds learning gliders. And yes we only train in 2-33s as our fleet of blanik L13 is grounded. And yes we only winch launch. Our costs are very inexpensive and we fly year round weather permitting google "AC Goodwin memorial field" or Prescott Area soaring on fb

CH

Continuing the digression, successful clubs rely on members to do much or most of the work. There's always a question of whether to allow affluent and/or time-challenged members to buy their way out of their work obligation. When I was learning to fly at what is now Caesar Creek Soaring Club in the mid 60s, most of us worked one weekend day a month instructing, towing, or crewing. If you didn't, your fee for a 2,000' tow was a dollar higher (IIRC, $4.50 instead of $3.50 in a club glider. Yeah, times change.). Most members worked. A few didn't. Yes, there was a loss of camaraderie with those who just showed up to fly, but the philosophy was that we'd rather have them as club members than not.

Decades later, there was related discussion involving another club. I sensed some resentment about a few more affluent members not working. I've always wondered if that led to at least one active pilot I knew gradually dropping out of soaring. Probably not the deciding factor. But not feeling 100% welcome at your own soaring club doesn't seem like a formula for success.

It's a fine balance. We want club members to "pay their dues", literally and figuratively. We want them to show their commitment, not just because we need their support but because we resent investing in them if they're just going to wander away a year later.

But...if they're not as committed, would we rather send them to a commercial operation or see them drop out? It's a question; I don't have the answer.

Chip Bearden

Just when I was starting to feel like a lot of soaring clubs in North America were doomed, I stumbled across this success story. Made me feel optimistic.

https://www.cunim.org/our-fleet/

At 15:34 15 March 2018, wrote:
Continuing the digression, successful clubs rely on members to do
much or
m=
ost of the work. There's always a question of whether to allow
affluent
and=
/or time-challenged members to buy their way out of their work
obligation.
=
When I was learning to fly at what is now Caesar Creek Soaring
Club in the
=
mid 60s, most of us worked one weekend day a month instructing,
towing, or
=
crewing. If you didn't, your fee for a 2,000' tow was a dollar higher
(IIRC=
, $4.50 instead of $3.50 in a club glider. Yeah, times change.).
Most
membe=
rs worked. A few didn't. Yes, there was a loss of camaraderie with
those
wh=
o just showed up to fly, but the philosophy was that we'd rather
have them
=
as club members than not.

Decades later, there was related discussion involving another club.
I
sense=
d some resentment about a few more affluent members not
working. I've
alway=
s wondered if that led to at least one active pilot I knew gradually
droppi=
ng out of soaring. Probably not the deciding factor. But not feeling
100%
w=
elcome at your own soaring club doesn't seem like a formula for
success.=20

It's a fine balance. We want club members to "pay their dues",
literally
an=
d figuratively. We want them to show their commitment, not just
because we
=
need their support but because we resent investing in them if
they're just
=
going to wander away a year later.=20

But...if they're not as committed, would we rather send them to a
commercia=
l operation or see them drop out? It's a question; I don't have the
answer.

Chip Bearden


It doesn't matter if they are rich or not. If they don't work, and you
don't charge them, they are free-loaders that are leeching off other
people's work and efforts. IMO, it's just not right to let these people
get away with not doing anything at the expense of someone else
having to cover for them. If they can't or don't want to work, make
them pay the difference in money. If they get mad, let them go to a
commercial operator where they will be served by others the way
they want, but then they will have to pay for those services anyway.

RO

It doesn't matter if they are rich or not. If they don't work, and you
don't charge them, they are free-loaders that are leeching off other
people's work and efforts. IMO, it's just not right to let these people
get away with not doing anything at the expense of someone else
having to cover for them. If they can't or don't want to work, make
them pay the difference in money. If they get mad, let them go to a
commercial operator where they will be served by others the way
they want, but then they will have to pay for those services anyway.

RO

I hope I wasn't misleading because I agree, Mike. The attitude I have encountered numerous times is that a club member should not be allowed to pay the difference in money if they don't contribute their time. Having been at clubs that took somewhat different positions, I can see both sides.

My personal view (having used commercial operations for 20 years) is to encourage members to work while allowing them to pay. One reason soaring is declining (IMO) is all the things that compete for our time these days, from jobs that are nearly 24/7 to family to other sports and leisure time activities. For a lot of people, soaring is just not the #1 thing in their lives that it was for me for many years. But we need all kinds. And some members who don't want to show up one day a month for ground crew duty might be very happy to do some pro bono legal work defending against a community effort to put the gliderport out of business, for example.

Chip Bearden

Snip Chip's post

It's a good question, our club is structured around volunteer effort and some people bear the majority of the burden. However we also need "customers" and flying activity is the lifeblood of the club. Recently we have moved to paying for more services such as annual aircraft inspection/maintenance rather than forcing the work on club members (still mostly done by volunteers however). We also use builders for major jobs as the club needs them finished by a date more than we need to save money. Plus the would-be volunteers can spend their time flying rather than working (or feeling too guilty about not working to turn up!)

Cheers Ben