Parachute source for gliders and winches

That's less expensive than a drag chute used in drag racing.Â* And for
our Brit friends, drag racing is not men in dresses and high heels
running a foot race... :-D

On 11/10/2018 7:54 PM, wrote:
On Thursday, November 1, 2018 at 6:18:55 PM UTC-6, Martin Gregorie wrote:
On Wed, 31 Oct 2018 09:06:05 -0700, JS wrote:

Saw the ad in the AMA flyer for their Expo in Pomona. SSA Region 12 has
a presence there.
AMA Expo:
https://amablog.modelaircraft.org/am...8/10/expowest-
program-2018-web.pdf
Fruity Chutes looks like a good source for chutes, including ballistic
chutes.
Anything from 12" diameter up.
Jim

https://fruitychutes.com/
The Fruity chutes I looked at would all be unlikely to survive their
first winch launch: thie all emphasized light weight, which is exactly
what you don't want for winching. The winch parachute is inline between
cable and shock cord. The tension being carried through the 'chute keeps
it closed during the 60-65 knot launch, when the 'underside' of the
'chute is facing the winch and the shock cord, connecting chute to
glider, it attached to the top centre of its bell. If the launch didn't
finish it off a light weight chute, then being dragged back to the winch
after the launch would probably do the trick.

That is why traditional winch chutes are made of heavy duty canvas with
typically four shrouds made of 50-75mm heavy duty webbing sewn onto the
shock cord attachment at the centre of the chute. Current manufacture
chutes often use plastic fabric, but its just as thick as the canvas it
replaces.


--
Martin | martin at
Gregorie | gregorie dot org
What Martin said..

Try this for a (relatively) cheap 'chute. Bite the bullet and buy one Tost small winch 'chute and take it to your local rigger and ask how much to make a replica. There's a good chance that will be much less than what you paid for the 1st 'chute.

--
Dan, 5J

Credit to Monty Python...

On 11/11/2018 9:26 AM, Dan Marotta wrote:
That's less expensive than a drag chute used in drag racing.Â* And for
our Brit friends, drag racing is not men in dresses and high heels
running a foot race... :-D

On 11/10/2018 7:54 PM, wrote:
On Thursday, November 1, 2018 at 6:18:55 PM UTC-6, Martin Gregorie
wrote:
On Wed, 31 Oct 2018 09:06:05 -0700, JS wrote:

Saw the ad in the AMA flyer for their Expo in Pomona. SSA Region 12
has
a presence there.
AMA Expo:
https://amablog.modelaircraft.org/am...8/10/expowest-
program-2018-web.pdf
Fruity Chutes looks like a good source for chutes, including ballistic
chutes.
Anything from 12" diameter up.
Jim

https://fruitychutes.com/
The Fruity chutes I looked at would all be unlikely to survive their
first winch launch: thie all emphasized light weight, which is exactly
what you don't want for winching. The winch parachute is inline between
cable and shock cord. The tension being carried through the 'chute
keeps
it closed during the 60-65 knot launch, when the 'underside' of the
'chute is facing the winch and the shock cord, connecting chute to
glider, it attached to the top centre of its bell. If the launch didn't
finish it off a light weight chute, then being dragged back to the
winch
after the launch would probably do the trick.

That is why traditional winch chutes are made of heavy duty canvas with
typically four shrouds made of 50-75mm heavy duty webbing sewn onto the
shock cord attachment at the centre of the chute. Current manufacture
chutes often use plastic fabric, but its just as thick as the canvas it
replaces.


--
MartinÂ*Â*Â* | martin at
GregorieÂ* | gregorie dot org
What Martin said..

Try this for a (relatively) cheap 'chute.Â* Bite the bullet and buy
one Tost small winch 'chute and take it to your local rigger and ask
how much to make a replica.Â* There's a good chance that will be much
less than what you paid for the 1st 'chute.


--
Dan, 5J

You talking RuPaul....?!?!
LOL......

If talking to Brits, be careful of fags or faggots......quite a bit different in the US than "Queens English"......;-)
[cigarettes or meatballs....in order.....]

On Sun, 11 Nov 2018 09:26:01 -0700, Dan Marotta wrote:

That's less expensive than a drag chute used in drag racing.Â* And for
our Brit friends, drag racing is not men in dresses and high heels
running a foot race... :-D

..... but think of the possibilities if it was a hurdle race, the runners
were dressed in drag chutes and allowed to handbag each other while
hurdling. Who knows, that could be the latest teevee blockbuster.


--
Martin | martin at
Gregorie | gregorie dot org

My understanding, walking (let alone running) in heels is tough...no, never tried either.....

As to suitability of one drag chute vs. another, seems like a major factor is if you drag it on the ground and whether or not it is pavement/macadam and load on the tow cable/wire.

The simple response to that is:Â* Don't drag it on the ground.Â* When I
was driving a winch back in the 90s, the technique was to increase
throttle sufficiently after the glider releases to keep the parachute
inflated and drop the chute right in front of the winch. The driver had
to have the skill to stop the drum before the chute got jammed in the
rollers.Â* On days without cross winds, just carry enough power to keep
the chute inflated until it lands.

On 11/11/2018 1:54 PM, Charlie M. (UH & 002 owner/pilot) wrote:
My understanding, walking (let alone running) in heels is tough...no, never tried either.....

As to suitability of one drag chute vs. another, seems like a major factor is if you drag it on the ground and whether or not it is pavement/macadam and load on the tow cable/wire.

--
Dan, 5J

On Sun, 11 Nov 2018 14:10:03 -0700, Dan Marotta wrote:

The simple response to that is:Â* Don't drag it on the ground.Â* When I
was driving a winch back in the 90s, the technique was to increase
throttle sufficiently after the glider releases to keep the parachute
inflated and drop the chute right in front of the winch. The driver had
to have the skill to stop the drum before the chute got jammed in the
rollers.Â* On days without cross winds, just carry enough power to keep
the chute inflated until it lands.


Spot on for normal operation, but there is one unavoidable difference if
you're using Spectra rope.

On steel cable, you do the last launch of the day, suck the cable in,
pack the winch up and tow it back to its roost and everything is fine.

But if you do the same with Spectra rope, it will destroy the winch drums
because tightly wound Spectra is likely to crush the drum in overnight
cold, so after the last launch both cables are pulled out again. The
winch then pulls them in slowly enough to avoid inflating the chute. This
leaves the ropes loose enough on the drums to prevent crushing problems,
but has also dragged the 'chutes along the ground for the length of your
airfield.


--
Martin | martin at
Gregorie | gregorie dot org

I hesitate (not really) to ask how you learned what the Spectra could do.

I've only launched and driven with steel cable or plain rope with auto tow.

On 11/11/2018 4:26 PM, Martin Gregorie wrote:
On Sun, 11 Nov 2018 14:10:03 -0700, Dan Marotta wrote:

The simple response to that is:Â* Don't drag it on the ground.Â* When I
was driving a winch back in the 90s, the technique was to increase
throttle sufficiently after the glider releases to keep the parachute
inflated and drop the chute right in front of the winch. The driver had
to have the skill to stop the drum before the chute got jammed in the
rollers.Â* On days without cross winds, just carry enough power to keep
the chute inflated until it lands.

Spot on for normal operation, but there is one unavoidable difference if
you're using Spectra rope.

On steel cable, you do the last launch of the day, suck the cable in,
pack the winch up and tow it back to its roost and everything is fine.

But if you do the same with Spectra rope, it will destroy the winch drums
because tightly wound Spectra is likely to crush the drum in overnight
cold, so after the last launch both cables are pulled out again. The
winch then pulls them in slowly enough to avoid inflating the chute. This
leaves the ropes loose enough on the drums to prevent crushing problems,
but has also dragged the 'chutes along the ground for the length of your
airfield.



--
Dan, 5J

On Sun, 11 Nov 2018 16:44:19 -0700, Dan Marotta wrote:

I hesitate (not really) to ask how you learned what the Spectra could
do.

There was feedback in S&G from early adopters about it and, when we
bought the Skylaunch I'm fairly certain it was in the operating manual.

Disclaimer: I regularly serve as part the airfield's normal operating
crew, but at the launchpoint and driving the cable tow-out truck. I had
some winch training on the Supercat, but don't drive the Skylaunch.

I've only launched and driven with steel cable or plain rope with auto
tow.

I never seen auto tow used - its very much a dieing art over here due to
the availability of good modern winches. Our longest cable run is just on
1km (3270 ft) long. Typical calm weather launches get to 1400ft but I've
had 2600-2700 ft on windy days with a decent velocity gradient in both
ASK-21 and SZD Juniors.


--
Martin | martin at
Gregorie | gregorie dot org

On Sunday, November 11, 2018 at 6:26:47 PM UTC-5, Martin Gregorie wrote:
On Sun, 11 Nov 2018 14:10:03 -0700, Dan Marotta wrote:

The simple response to that is:Â* Don't drag it on the ground.Â* When I
was driving a winch back in the 90s, the technique was to increase
throttle sufficiently after the glider releases to keep the parachute
inflated and drop the chute right in front of the winch. The driver had
to have the skill to stop the drum before the chute got jammed in the
rollers.Â* On days without cross winds, just carry enough power to keep
the chute inflated until it lands.


Spot on for normal operation, but there is one unavoidable difference if
you're using Spectra rope.

On steel cable, you do the last launch of the day, suck the cable in,
pack the winch up and tow it back to its roost and everything is fine.

But if you do the same with Spectra rope, it will destroy the winch drums
because tightly wound Spectra is likely to crush the drum in overnight
cold, so after the last launch both cables are pulled out again. The
winch then pulls them in slowly enough to avoid inflating the chute. This
leaves the ropes loose enough on the drums to prevent crushing problems,
but has also dragged the 'chutes along the ground for the length of your
airfield.


--
Martin | martin at
Gregorie | gregorie dot org

Martin,

steel cables do have the tendency to crush drums when not wound up after the last launch loosely, particularly if you were winching during a warm/hot summer day and experience a drop in temperature over night. Spectra is less affected by temperature swings but it is so tightly packed on the drum after the launch that it can crush a drum if left in that condition. We always pay out the line after the last launch and haul it it in at moderate speed, i.e. 1st gear at idle.
Dragging the chute several thousand feet over any kind of surface is just plain nuts! No wonder you are wearing it out in no time. Tie an old tire to the end, if you desire some resistance.

Uli
'AS'