Are off-airport landouts common and/or dangerous?

Roads are to be avoided unless you have specifically surveyed some particular stretch in advance. Besides cars, problems are signs and posts and wires and berms and parallel wire fencing that can easily become deadly if you ground loop into it.

I know two glider pilots who spotted a hangar, windsock and adjacent runway. On short final the runway looked a little short necessitating good speed control and spot landing skills.

They landed on RC strips.

On Monday, May 27, 2019 at 9:30:00 AM UTC-7, Steve Koerner wrote:
Roads are to be avoided unless you have specifically surveyed some particular stretch in advance. Besides cars, problems are signs and posts and wires and berms and parallel wire fencing that can easily become deadly if you ground loop into it.

Yes - roads are the worst place to land...unless the alternatives are worse still. Careful scouting can help but won't solve every problem. For instance, there are a couple of places around Nephi, UT where there are pretty long gaps between airports and no cultivation so you are left with trackless desert (often filled with ravines and boulders - I'm told this is where they filmed "The Martian") or roads. Scouting some spots with enough width that markers and high shoulders aren't a problem still leaves you with the chance of traffic if you get flushed in the wrong spot, but it beats landing in a ravine. Many of these roads are lightly travelled - but others aren't - and you can always run into bad timing I suppose.

I would never head out over such terrain without a glide to an airport, but strong conditions can generate strong sink and you can end up running out of altitude and ideas at the same time in pretty short order.

Emergency landing spots are best not planned in the cockpit if you can help it and best not used if you can avoid it, but I get some comfort out of having at least some hip-pocket spots picked out just in case.

Know terrain where you are headed before you head there.

Andy Blackburn
9B

On Tue, 28 May 2019 13:31:15 -0700, Andy Blackburn wrote:

Know terrain where you are headed before you head there.

I've only flown once in the Great Basin and that was only local soaring
from Minden when nothing but weak thermals were on offer, but I have
driven from Denver to Lost Hills, CA (US70, US15 then Lost Hills via
Bakersfield and Wasco) and back via Sacramento on both US50 and US80, so
I have some idea of the area. Your advics seems highly sensible to me,
but I have one question: wouldn't exactly the same advice about landout
planning for flights in that area also apply to all single-engine and
light twin GA aircraft?


--
Martin | martin at
Gregorie | gregorie dot org

On 5/28/2019 3:50 PM, Martin Gregorie wrote:
On Tue, 28 May 2019 13:31:15 -0700, Andy Blackburn wrote:

Know terrain where you are headed before you head there.

I've only flown once in the Great Basin and that was only local soaring
from Minden when nothing but weak thermals were on offer, but I have driven
from Denver to Lost Hills, CA (US70, US15 then Lost Hills via Bakersfield
and Wasco) and back via Sacramento on both US50 and US80, so I have some
idea of the area. Your advics seems highly sensible to me, but I have one
question: wouldn't exactly the same advice about landout planning for
flights in that area also apply to all single-engine and light twin GA
aircraft?


Well - IMO - yes...but from what I can tell few power-only pilots think that
way. There was a recent (two fatalities) ditching of an SEL plane in Lake
Michigan (no trace of plane/people found) which - if one is to believe
comments from folks familiar with the area/FlightAware-inspection - could have
been avoided by either flying higher, or another 12 miles (at their cruising
height) out of their way.

As with much in aviation, things are often "just fine" until they're not. I
was never a fan (bumming rides in GA) cruising over unlandable terrain
presuming the engine was going to continue running.

YMMV, of course.

Bob W.

---
This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
https://www.avg.com

On Tuesday, May 28, 2019 at 2:50:45 PM UTC-7, Martin Gregorie wrote:
On Tue, 28 May 2019 13:31:15 -0700, Andy Blackburn wrote:

Know terrain where you are headed before you head there.

I've only flown once in the Great Basin and

but I have one question: wouldn't exactly the same advice about landout
planning for flights in that area also apply to all single-engine and
light twin GA aircraft?


Martin | martin at
Gregorie | gregorie dot org

Of course it does.
But the airplane folks think that the engine will always run,
the the fueler kid filled the tanks,
that the wx forecast is always correct,
that ATC always tracks them,
that ATC sweeps their paths clean,
that ELT's always work,
that Search & Rescue will appear instantly after pushing a button,
that cell phones work everywhere,
that landout supply kits are not essential.
That keeping glide altitude to a flat place or a road is prudish.
(I'm being only a little tongue in cheek.)

Wait..... a road? Yep. ASEL span is only 36 feet or less,
and they fit on two lane roads. The gear print on even a light twin is
only 12 feet and fits in a lane.
If they wreck on a road, it makes it easy to find the debris field.

Typically, the suggestion is to follow the interstate highways.
Now with GPS direct, that is less often the practice.

Cindy B
Mojave, CA

Charles "Ben" Ethridge

Ben,

As in everything in aviation, if you use good judgement at the right time you will be fine. Your inquiries into out landings is the first step. Many on the forum have provided excellent ideas and options. There are training opportunities every year to get better in our sport and safely challenge your aviation skill set. Next week we will the Region 5 South contest in Cordele Georgia. This is a learning evolution where we review your flight each night, provide short presentations on contest rules, strategy, and information to improve the specific skills you need to fly XC safely. At Seminole-Lake gliderport in Clermont Florida we love to have pilots improve their comfort in sailplanes. We do XC and racing training. Give me a call, we will be happy to help. I’ll also come to your club to do ground school if enough pilots are interested.

Sincerely,
Rich Owen

Hi Ben,

Go see Rich. He's the real deal and SLG offers a good environment (not too far from you) in which to train. You'll have to adapt the things you learn to whatever your local flying environment happens to be.

best,
Evan Ludeman

On Wednesday, May 29, 2019 at 8:41:51 AM UTC-4, Rich Owen wrote:
Charles "Ben" Ethridge

Ben,

As in everything in aviation, if you use good judgement at the right time you will be fine. Your inquiries into out landings is the first step. Many on the forum have provided excellent ideas and options. There are training opportunities every year to get better in our sport and safely challenge your aviation skill set. Next week we will the Region 5 South contest in Cordele Georgia. This is a learning evolution where we review your flight each night, provide short presentations on contest rules, strategy, and information to improve the specific skills you need to fly XC safely. At Seminole-Lake gliderport in Clermont Florida we love to have pilots improve their comfort in sailplanes. We do XC and racing training. Give me a call, we will be happy to help. I’ll also come to your club to do ground school if enough pilots are interested.

Sincerely,
Rich Owen