Landing on snow-covered grass

I must not be visualizing correctly what you are talking about. I was
thinking it was like a J laying on its side with the long leg being the
runway and the short leg being beside the runway (assuming a pretty wide
takeoff area). You start point away from the direction of takeoff and
then make a sweeping turn onto the runway. However, if you do that wide
enough to be at 20 knots when aligned with the runway, you will have a
fairly large radius of turn and I'll bet you lose nearly as much as you
gain.

You're right, if done incorrectly, you don't gain much -- although
even sloppily done, you still gain a bit.

The trick is to maintain your momentum around the "J" turn. You have
to hit the speed fast enough to maintain momentum, but not so fast
that you tip your tricycle over! As someone mentioned, Cherokees
are good for this, thanks to their wide stance. (A Tri-Pacer, for
instance, might not fare as well, with its tall, more closely spaced
gear...)
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

Jay Honeck wrote:
I must not be visualizing correctly what you are talking about. I was
thinking it was like a J laying on its side with the long leg being the
runway and the short leg being beside the runway (assuming a pretty wide
takeoff area). You start point away from the direction of takeoff and
then make a sweeping turn onto the runway. However, if you do that wide
enough to be at 20 knots when aligned with the runway, you will have a
fairly large radius of turn and I'll bet you lose nearly as much as you
gain.

You're right, if done incorrectly, you don't gain much -- although
even sloppily done, you still gain a bit.

The trick is to maintain your momentum around the "J" turn. You have
to hit the speed fast enough to maintain momentum, but not so fast
that you tip your tricycle over! As someone mentioned, Cherokees
are good for this, thanks to their wide stance. (A Tri-Pacer, for
instance, might not fare as well, with its tall, more closely spaced
gear...)

Ok, got it. Since I fly mainly Cessna airplanes, this may not help as
much. I've found that making a tight turn with my tail as close to the
end of runway as possible and then running to full throttle and RPM
before brake release works quite well, assuming the field isn't soft.

Matt

In article ,
Matt Whiting wrote:


Ok, got it. Since I fly mainly Cessna airplanes, this may not help as
much. I've found that making a tight turn with my tail as close to the
end of runway as possible and then running to full throttle and RPM
before brake release works quite well, assuming the field isn't soft.

Matt

Food for thought. That holding the brakes and bringing the power up is
very costly in propellors if you operate from
dirt/grass/gravel/rock/sand/etc.

I much prefer having even 5 knots from a rolling start than any power
added before brake release.

In article ,
Matt Whiting wrote:



Ok, got it. Since I fly mainly Cessna airplanes, this may not help as
much. I've found that making a tight turn with my tail as close to the
end of runway as possible and then running to full throttle and RPM
before brake release works quite well, assuming the field isn't soft.

Matt

Hit enter too soon on the other post.

This strip is about 700' long and exactly the width of Cessna main gear.
G

http://home.gci.net/~sncdfalk/flypics/ghshortfinal.jpg

Dale wrote in news:notme-E6348E.12154125112007
@news.gci.net:

In article ,
Matt Whiting wrote:



Ok, got it. Since I fly mainly Cessna airplanes, this may not help as
much. I've found that making a tight turn with my tail as close to the
end of runway as possible and then running to full throttle and RPM
before brake release works quite well, assuming the field isn't soft.

Matt

Hit enter too soon on the other post.

This strip is about 700' long and exactly the width of Cessna main gear.
G

http://home.gci.net/~sncdfalk/flypics/ghshortfinal.jpg




Cool.


Bertie

This strip is about 700' long and exactly the width of Cessna main gear.
G

http://home.gci.net/~sncdfalk/flypics/ghshortfinal.jpg

That does meet the definition of a "back country strip", doesn't it.

Thing that jumped out at me was, "and it isn't even straight, when it just
as easily could have been. There must have been alcohol involved when it
got roughed out!"
--
Jim in NC

Dale wrote:
In article ,
Matt Whiting wrote:


Ok, got it. Since I fly mainly Cessna airplanes, this may not help as
much. I've found that making a tight turn with my tail as close to the
end of runway as possible and then running to full throttle and RPM
before brake release works quite well, assuming the field isn't soft.

Matt

Food for thought. That holding the brakes and bringing the power up is
very costly in propellors if you operate from
dirt/grass/gravel/rock/sand/etc.

I much prefer having even 5 knots from a rolling start than any power
added before brake release.

I've heard this mentioned before, but frankly consider it an urban
legend. I've never seen a prop on a Skylane pick up anything given the
fairly generous prop clearance and I've seen many takeoff on gravel and
grass strips and made many such takeoffs myself with nary a nick.

Matt

In article ,
Matt Whiting wrote:



I've heard this mentioned before, but frankly consider it an urban
legend. I've never seen a prop on a Skylane pick up anything given the
fairly generous prop clearance and I've seen many takeoff on gravel and
grass strips and made many such takeoffs myself with nary a nick.

Matt

LOL. Now that's funny. I've witnessed props on two occasions suffer
serious damage due to picking up a rock from the surface. Once on a
182, the other a 206.

In article ,
"Morgans" wrote:

This strip is about 700' long and exactly the width of Cessna main gear.
G

http://home.gci.net/~sncdfalk/flypics/ghshortfinal.jpg

That does meet the definition of a "back country strip", doesn't it.

Thing that jumped out at me was, "and it isn't even straight, when it just
as easily could have been. There must have been alcohol involved when it
got roughed out!"

The really run part is the big whoop-dee-doo about 2/3 down the strip.
If you have much speed it throws you back into the air.

LOL. Now that's funny. I've witnessed props on two occasions suffer
serious damage due to picking up a rock from the surface. Once on a
182, the other a 206.

Me, too. In fact, one of the reasons I started "Friends of Iowa City
Airport" was because our taxiway was returning to gravel, and my prop
and stabilator were getting ruined.

We learned to keep the RPMs under 1000, because rocks and pebbles
won't be moved at that speed.
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"