First Glider

Mark James Boyd wrote:
Stay away from wood. There's a reason it is uncommon
in current aircraft manufacturing.

Yes there is......it's is more difficult to build compound shapes from wood,
more expensive to repeatedly make the same parts from wood when in composite
structures you simply need a mold, some cloth and a bucket of resin to
duplicate each part. Much of the same applies to metal aircraft and that's
why so many new designs, especially from smaller manufacturers choose
composites as well. That is not necessarily a reason to stay away from an
aircraft that was, already painstakingly constructed of wood, are still
airworthy and will be for years to come. You may even find many of your
recent composite aircraft STILL have some wood used in areas as the core for
some bulkheads etc...doesn't mean these should be condemned as well.
tim

the Robin DR400 which is, at least for the
wings, made of wood and fabric.

And very good woodwork it is. Interestingly tho the wheel panta are carbon
fiber! Go figure.

Robert Mudd
Oh, yes the full George coder quote is "Woods still good, you can trust a tree"

Robert Ehrlich wrote:
Mark James Boyd wrote:
...
Stay away from wood. There's a reason it is uncommon
in current aircraft manufacturing.
...

Maybe uncommon in the USA, in France the most common 4 seats
airplane is probably the Robin DR400 which is, at least for the
wings, made of wood and fabric. Also widely used as a tow plane.

Oh, and keep in mind that this is just my opinion. I'm sure
there are lots of happy wood plane owners who love the things.
To each his own...


--

------------+
Mark J. Boyd

Have a look at the Sparrowhawk and club class ships.
"Jeff Runciman" wrote in message
...
Thanks for all of the advise. I may have to get a
glider in between 30 and 35 ld. I am concerned about
getting in deeper than I should and not having fun.
It is possible that I should get a club class glider
due to my hang gliding experience (tighter turn radius?).
A PW5 or Russia may be an answer. I will be spending
sometime dual in a Lark. Two questions: What happened
to Russia Sailplanes? Were there any other gliders
that compare to the PW5 and the AC5?

Thank you again for your help.

Jeff

Jeff Runciman wrote in message ...
Thanks for all of the advise. I may have to get a
glider in between 30 and 35 ld. I am concerned about
getting in deeper than I should and not having fun.
It is possible that I should get a club class glider
due to my hang gliding experience (tighter turn radius?).
A PW5 or Russia may be an answer. I will be spending
sometime dual in a Lark. Two questions: What happened
to Russia Sailplanes? Were there any other gliders
that compare to the PW5 and the AC5?

Thank you again for your help.

Jeff



Jeff,

The Russia is an outstanding first glider! I know, I have one. I
recently got it and have put 22 hours on it in 45 days.

Mine is the second Russia at the club and after watching the easy
assembly, ground handling and loads of airtime the other guy was
getting with his it made my decision easy!

In reference to performance and handling...It climbs almost as well as
the PW and runs better in between thermals. Taped up with the root
cuffs and the gear put away it gets 35 to 1. It has really nice
handling, light and nimble without being twitchy.

Lots of room, I am 6'2" with room to spare. Super easy to rig and
ground handle. Automatic hookups on everything, try finding that on
30 year old glass. Did I mention the light weight? Mines 310 pounds,
making it easy to deal with on the ground and you really feel the air
your flying in. As an ex hang glider pilot, I really like that.

In reference to the distributer/importer issue....That is currently
being worked on and should be back in place by late 04 or early 05.

I believe there are around 60 in the US and I have never met an owner
who wasn't pleased with their decision. There is a Yahoo group
dedicated to the design and if you do a little research you will find
happy owners with few issues and lots of smiles and airtime.

Gus
AC4-CK
Houston, TX.
281 705-9701

Thanks for all of the advise. I may have to get a
glider in between 30 and 35 ld. I am concerned about
getting in deeper than I should and not having fun.
It is possible that I should get a club class glider
due to my hang gliding experience (tighter turn radius?).

A dissenting view: There is no reason except money that one should buy
an ancient club-class glider or a low-performance PW5 type glider as a
"first glider."

Sailplanes are very different from hang-gliders or paragliders in this
respect. In hang gliding or paragliding, high performance gliders are
much harder to fly and much more dangerous than older or "club-class"
gliders, and inappropriate for beginners. In sailplanes, the latest
standard or 15 meter gliders (ASW 27/28, Discus 2/Ventus 2) are easier
to fly and much safer (safety cockpit, more benign stall/spin,
automatic hookups, better control on takeoff, better spoilers and
flaps on landing) than older gliders typically bought by beginners.
They also happen to have more performance. They also happen to cost a
LOT more.

In buying a "club-class" glider (Std. Cirrus, etc.) you are giving up
flying characteristics, safety, convenience, and adding the task of
maintaining an antique. There is no flying or safety advantage. The
only reason to do it is that they are a lot cheaper.

"World class" gliders (PW5, Russia) have no safety or ease of flight
advantages either. They offer a different spot on the
price/newness/performance curve, that's all.

Rich beginners should feel no compunction in buying the latest
standard or 15 meter glider. We end up with more experienced pilots in
new gliders only because what we "can afford" seems to change with
time as the addiction level of this sport builds up.

John Cochrane BB

"John Cochrane" wrote in message
m...
Thanks for all of the advise. I may have to get a
glider in between 30 and 35 ld. I am concerned about
getting in deeper than I should and not having fun.
It is possible that I should get a club class glider
due to my hang gliding experience (tighter turn radius?).

A dissenting view: There is no reason except money that one should buy
an ancient club-class glider or a low-performance PW5 type glider as a
"first glider."

Sailplanes are very different from hang-gliders or paragliders in this
respect. In hang gliding or paragliding, high performance gliders are
much harder to fly and much more dangerous than older or "club-class"
gliders, and inappropriate for beginners. In sailplanes, the latest
standard or 15 meter gliders (ASW 27/28, Discus 2/Ventus 2) are easier
to fly and much safer (safety cockpit, more benign stall/spin,
automatic hookups, better control on takeoff, better spoilers and
flaps on landing) than older gliders typically bought by beginners.
They also happen to have more performance. They also happen to cost a
LOT more.

In buying a "club-class" glider (Std. Cirrus, etc.) you are giving up
flying characteristics, safety, convenience, and adding the task of
maintaining an antique. There is no flying or safety advantage. The
only reason to do it is that they are a lot cheaper.

"World class" gliders (PW5, Russia) have no safety or ease of flight
advantages either. They offer a different spot on the
price/newness/performance curve, that's all.

Rich beginners should feel no compunction in buying the latest
standard or 15 meter glider. We end up with more experienced pilots in
new gliders only because what we "can afford" seems to change with
time as the addiction level of this sport builds up.

John Cochrane BB

Let me add an enthusiastic second to John excellent post above. Handling
qualities and performance are not inversely related. Bad gliders handle and
perform badly. Good gliders handle and perform well. Buy the best you can
afford.

I would differ a tiny bit on John's comment on "antique gliders". My 24
year old Nimbus 2C would probably qualify as an antique in John's view but
it has been very well supported by Shempp Hirth. Those parts I have needed
have always been in stock.

Glass is glass. Maintenance on older glass is about the same as with newer
ships. The metal parts can be fabricated if the factory doesn't supply
them. In some cases, the older resins and gel coat are superior to that
found on the newest ships. Take a look at a 40 year old Libelle and then
look at the shrinkage over the spar on a 2 year old ASW 27.

Bill Daniels

Bill Daniels

Jeff Runciman wrote in message news:...
Thanks for all of the advise. I may have to get a
glider in between 30 and 35 ld. I am concerned about
getting in deeper than I should and not having fun.
It is possible that I should get a club class glider
due to my hang gliding experience (tighter turn radius?).
A PW5 or Russia may be an answer. I will be spending
sometime dual in a Lark. Two questions: What happened
to Russia Sailplanes? Were there any other gliders
that compare to the PW5 and the AC5?

Thank you again for your help.

Jeff


Jeff:

I had approx. 60 hours total gliding experience when
I bought my first glider, a Blanik L33 Solo. My hours
including time in a 2-33, 1-26 and a Lark.

The L33 was a nice 1st ship. Very easy to fly, no retractable
gear, L/D of 32.5/1 and it climbed pretty well. I was
able to tie it down because it was metal and the cockpit
was very large. I flew it for a year and sold it to
a club for their operations. My current glider is a
Genesis 2, which has a 43/1 L/D and retractable gear.
It is also easy to fly, but I think that if I had bought
it as a first glider it may have been too much for
me to handle.
GORDY