Mystery of crashed glider in Arizona

BTW, I think Bob K knows more then he is telling us.

I think so too. Bob's earlier speculation on the wing construction
matches precisely what I observed.

Tell us, please Bob.

On Dec 8, 6:41*pm, Steve Koerner wrote:
BTW, I think Bob K knows more then he is telling us.

I think so too. * Bob's earlier speculation on the wing construction
matches precisely what I observed.

Tell us, please Bob.

Sorry to disappoint, but I'm pretty sure I've already told about as
much as I know. I think I've seen pictures of it in an old Soaring
magazine, maybe along with an old Homebuilders Hall article. But
looking through my copy of the Collected Works of Stan Hall, the
closes thing I can find is the Moba 2C, which is in Australia and
accounted for. It also dates to the late 1970s, probably too late to
be our mystery ship. I sure wish I could ask Stan about it, I'd be
pretty sure he'd know it.

What I think I recall of the pictures in Soaring showed a cross-
section of how the aluminum box spar was sized to fit into the
airfoil, and how the foam blocks were cut and nested onto the spar. I
probably saw the pictures around 1980 when I was working at Sky
Sailing and someone left us several cartons of old Soaring magazines
ranging from about 1960 to about 1977. If I was to start looking
through old Soarings, I'd start at 1967 and then widen the search both
ways.

If it seems odd that I identified the wing construction, please
understand that I've been interested in sailplane structures since
about as far back as I can remember clearly. Whenever I saw a picture
of something like that, I'd be all over it, figuring out how it could
be done, what the advantages are, what the disadvantages are. I know
just about every way there is to build a glider. I even know a few
pretty good ways.

Furthermore, I recall that there were several similar projects in the
late 1960s. It seems natural to want to combine predicable, well-
understood riveted aluminum primary structure with easily-shaped foam
and fiberglass secondary structure.

As for my quip about the pilot buying a Libelle, that was an offhand
remark based on two things: For one, it seems evident from the photos
that whatever incident placed that glider there was eminently
survivable, and the pilot probably walked away from it. For another,
my bet is that that glider, like too many homebuilt ships, was too
hard to assemble, too hard to disassemble, too hard to seal, and
probably embodied other disappointments as well. And it probably had a
lousy trailer. So when the pilot did walk away, he probably couldn't
face the idea of another disassembly and reassembly, so he just took
the instruments and left it there, vowing his next glider would go
together much more easily. The lesson there is probably that having a
good trailer is possibly more important than having a good glider.

As for having been involved in the construction, I'm flattered, but
I'm not quite that old. Guessing that that glider was built around
1967, I would have been four or five years old at the time.

Here's a list of all the people I'd ask for more information:

Fred Jiran
George Applebay
Jim Marske
Vern Oldershaw
Alex Sim

Thanks, and best regards to all

Bob K.
www.hpaircraft.com

On Dec 8, 11:22*pm, Junior Team 2007
wrote:
Come on guys, it's got to be an Edelweiss!

http://www.probertencyclopaedia.com/...0Edelweiss.jpg

Mike Westbrook

The nose area ahead of the canopy is too short on the Edelweiss

On Dec 7 2009, 3:48*pm, Mike the Strike wrote:
Several of our members have recently been surveying possible landing
strips for our contest database and Steve Koerner came across an old
crashed glider in the Arizona desert.....

http://www.flickr.com/photos/3676667...7622824263137/

Registration was N71JR.

Suggestions and speculation welcome!

I was contacted by a pilot who has flow at Estrella for many years.
He told me he knew about this glider and I asked him to write up what
he knew. His wife sent the following in an email.

"back in 1986? 1987? joe was looking for a new trailer for his 1-35
that he had bought in moriarity, new mexico. the glider came with a
closed in trailer but it was big enough to make a mobile home out of
it!!! joe thinks he saw the ad for a trailer in the ssa magazine and
called a tel. # down in tucson. it was the wife of jordan reid who
was already deceased (from cancer we think) and she was just trying to
get rid of it. she told joe her husband had been an aeronautical
engineer at the university down there and that the trailer had a
glider in it that he had built, but after 5 or 6 test flights, the
wings were fluttering really bad. in the meantime he got ill and
could never fix the problem. she told joe she would sell him the
trailer with the glider in it and warned him it was not flyable. some
friend of their family actually delivered the trailer and sailplane to
estrella sailport for joe. the trailer was 1" square steel tubing
with no skin on it and very well built. joe and i covered it and
still have the 1-35 in that trailer!!!...................now for the
glider.......there was a logbook with the 5 or 6 entries in it showing
the plane was dangerous to fly. joe said the glider was in very good
condition and primed but not painted. he took out all the
instruments, push rods, moving parts, etc. and hauled the rest of the
glider to the stanfield dump!!!!! not too long later (maybe a year
later?) joe and i were out exploring the desert near estrella looking
at land. he slammed on the brakes and was freaking out because he
realized it was the glider he had taken to the dump!! it was up along
a fence on someone's property that obviously had a runway on it. we
met the people who owned the property (we have no idea now what their
names were) and they were very friendly and only stayed on the
property sometimes (they had another home in the phoenix area). they
told us they went to the stanfield dump 1 day to throw out their
trash, saw the sailplane, and decided it would make a wonderful
decoration for their property!! joe unfortunately threw away the log
book when he took the sailplane to the dump which he obviously deeply
regrets. he wants everyone to know that mr. jordan reid had put a
huge amount of effort in that glider and the trailer also. everything
was very well built and it is so sad he couldn't really enjoy it."

So it appears that the builder abandoned the project due to failing
health and it was not ever flown by anyone else.

Andy

So it appears that the builder abandoned the project due to failing
health and it was not ever flown by anyone else.

Andy

Charlie"Lite" remembers watching Jordan fly in the glider. Those
wings fluttered so bad, he was surprised that Jordan never crashed
it. But he always made it back to land safely. If Jordan's health
had permitted, he would have fixed that problem! There was so much
time and detail put into it, but it was definitely all Jordan's design
and work.

Yesterday, I received a CD from the FAA for N71JR. Why did I order
this again? Looking it up in the FAA database further confused me. A
Cessna 421C? Was this a possible tow plane? Hmmmmm.

After reading the contents of the CD, my brain cells started to
fire. The great wrecked Jordon Reid RGS-1 glider mystery!!

The tail number was registered on March 10, 1975. It was de-
registered by the estate of Jordon Reid by Frank Whiting (I think -
its handwritten) on April 4, 1986 as "Totally destroyed or scrapped.
Not flyable."

So for all those that are still interested in the details of this
glider, the contents of the CD can be found at the following URL.
There is a great handwritten note by Jordon Reid in the Airworthiness
file asking for a tail number assignment. See http://derosaweb.net/aviation/N71JR/
for the files.

If you don't have a CD of the information on your glider, this is a
great $10 deal. In my case I got details all the way back to the
initial German language documentation! Order this at
http://162.58.35.241/e.gov/ND/airrecordsND.asp.

Enjoy, John DeRosa

Other details on the glider from the "Experimental/Amateur-Built
Aircraft Operating Limitations" (items number 7-9).

7. Maximum Gross Weight: 740 Normal, 983 with water
Center of Gravity Limits: 84.75 to 87.5

Maximum Speed Limitations
------------
Auto or winch tow: N/A
Airplane Tow: 70MPH
Max. Smooth Air: 140 MPH (handwritten 126 next to this)
Max. Rough Air: 140 MPH

8. These operating limitations will expire on 8/17/78

10. Flight test area per attached Phoenix Sectional

On Jan 15, 9:23*am, ContestID67 wrote:
Yesterday, I received a CD from the FAA for N71JR. *Why did I order
this again? *Looking it up in the FAA database further confused me. *A
Cessna 421C? *Was this a possible tow plane? *Hmmmmm.

After reading the contents of the CD, my brain cells started to
fire. * The great wrecked Jordon Reid RGS-1 glider mystery!!

The tail number was registered on March 10, 1975. *It was de-
registered by the estate of Jordon Reid by Frank Whiting (I think -
its handwritten) on April 4, 1986 as "Totally destroyed or scrapped.
Not flyable."

So for all those that are still interested in the details of this
glider, the contents of the CD can be found at the following URL.
There is a great handwritten note by Jordon Reid in the Airworthiness
file asking for a tail number assignment. *Seehttp://derosaweb.net/aviation/N71JR/
for the files.

If you don't have a CD of the information on your glider, this is a
great $10 deal. *In my case I got details all the way back to the
initial German language documentation! *Order this athttp://162.58.35.241/e.gov/ND/airrecordsND.asp.

Enjoy, John DeRosa

That is the first time I've ever heard of anyone asking the FAA to
"surprise me!" classic!

On Jan 15, 9:23*am, ContestID67 wrote:
Yesterday, I received a CD from the FAA for N71JR. *Why did I order
this again? *Looking it up in the FAA database further confused me. *A
Cessna 421C? *Was this a possible tow plane? *Hmmmmm.

After reading the contents of the CD, my brain cells started to
fire. * The great wrecked Jordon Reid RGS-1 glider mystery!!

The tail number was registered on March 10, 1975. *It was de-
registered by the estate of Jordon Reid by Frank Whiting (I think -
its handwritten) on April 4, 1986 as "Totally destroyed or scrapped.
Not flyable."

So for all those that are still interested in the details of this
glider, the contents of the CD can be found at the following URL.
There is a great handwritten note by Jordon Reid in the Airworthiness
file asking for a tail number assignment. *Seehttp://derosaweb.net/aviation/N71JR/
for the files.

If you don't have a CD of the information on your glider, this is a
great $10 deal. *In my case I got details all the way back to the
initial German language documentation! *Order this athttp://162.58.35.241/e.gov/ND/airrecordsND.asp.

Enjoy, John DeRosa

Also if you are as "frugal" (read chaep) as me, you can get the FAA
records CD for free when you stop at the FAA pavillion during the
Oshkosh fly-in. Of course having to spend the $37 for admission is
going to cut into your savings a bit :-)


Pete

ContestID67 wrote:
Yesterday, I received a CD from the FAA for N71JR. /snip/
If you don't have a CD of the information on your glider
[or any registered airplane], this is a
great $10 deal. In my case I got details all the way back to the
initial German language documentation! Order this at
http://162.58.35.241/e.gov/ND/airrecordsND.asp.

Enjoy, John DeRosa

You're right.
This was a smooth, hassle free transaction.
Thanks!

Brian W