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#1
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Slow Flight
There is little doubt in my mind that the ability to do slow flight at
the very edge of stall speed will do more to prevent accidents than 1000 hours of cruise speed flight. Is there anyone here who is proficient that lands their aircraft more than 10kts above stall speed? I teach all my students to slow fly with the entire range of configurations for the particular aircraft they are flying. Gear up/ down, flaps up/down/in-between. I want them to be comfortable flying at the very edge of the stall speeds and spend a lot of time maneuvering right on the edge of a stall "nibble". It does more for pilot confidence and ability than anything else I can think of. They learn proper control useage and how their particular aircraft responds while in the low speed areas. Playing with different angles of bank while at low speeds and flying with a modicum of accuracy does a lot for proper control use. If you think about it, how many accidents occur in the low speed spectrum? Either from a stall, or from a high sink rate on approach, or poor control use during an emergency or off airport landing, or something similar? In my opinion, the pilot who is comfortable throughout the entire speed range of their aircraft is a properly trained pilot and one who will not get into an inadvertant stall, or spin. What are your thoughts? |
#2
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Slow Flight
On Sat, 08 Sep 2007 11:03:45 -0700, Ol Shy & Bashful
wrote: There is little doubt in my mind that the ability to do slow flight at the very edge of stall speed will do more to prevent accidents than 1000 hours of cruise speed flight. What are your thoughts? I'm a member of your choir. G |
#3
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Slow Flight
"Ol" == Ol Shy & Bashful writes:
Ol There is little doubt in my mind that the ability to do slow Ol flight at the very edge of stall speed will do more to prevent Ol accidents than 1000 hours of cruise speed flight. .. . . Ol What are your thoughts? Can't agree. The single best thing I did with an airplane to improve my confidence and safety was fly a cross-country to Oshkosh from California with a more experienced friend, each in our own airplane. But others will agree with you. The point is that there are several areas of aviation and flight that are important, and different people will have different needs in those areas. Your students are probably proficient in slow flight, that's good. How well would they do with a long cross country and handling weather issues? There are only so many hours of training to give, and the reality is that a fresh pilot just receiving their PP-ASEL doesn't know much. Perhaps the best thing an instructor can do is see that their students understand their ignorance but also understand how they can use their new license to improve. -- It is a mistake to think you can solve any major problems just with potatoes. Douglas Adams |
#4
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Slow Flight
Ol Shy & Bashful wrote:
In my opinion, the pilot who is comfortable throughout the entire speed range of their aircraft is a properly trained pilot and one who will not get into an inadvertant stall, or spin. What are your thoughts? I think what you said makes complete sense. But I always wonder how people define "comfortable"? I was trained the way you described and have repeated the drill more regularly than some. I can do it if asked or necessary, I understand it, and I know how my airplane acts. But I don't *like* flying at that edge of the envelope. Does that mean I'm "uncomfortable"? |
#5
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Slow Flight
On Sat, 08 Sep 2007 12:49:11 -0700, Bob Fry
wrote: Can't agree. The single best thing I did with an airplane to improve my confidence and safety was fly a cross-country to Oshkosh from California with a more experienced friend, each in our own airplane. What about all those who get the same number of hours you flew on that trip within 50 miles of home? |
#6
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Slow Flight
"Ol Shy & Bashful" wrote in message
ups.com... There is little doubt in my mind that the ability to do slow flight at the very edge of stall speed will do more to prevent accidents than 1000 hours of cruise speed flight. Is there anyone here who is proficient that lands their aircraft more than 10kts above stall speed? I teach all my students to slow fly with the entire range of configurations for the particular aircraft they are flying. Gear up/ down, flaps up/down/in-between. I want them to be comfortable flying at the very edge of the stall speeds and spend a lot of time maneuvering right on the edge of a stall "nibble". It does more for pilot confidence and ability than anything else I can think of. They learn proper control useage and how their particular aircraft responds while in the low speed areas. Playing with different angles of bank while at low speeds and flying with a modicum of accuracy does a lot for proper control use. If you think about it, how many accidents occur in the low speed spectrum? Either from a stall, or from a high sink rate on approach, or poor control use during an emergency or off airport landing, or something similar? In my opinion, the pilot who is comfortable throughout the entire speed range of their aircraft is a properly trained pilot and one who will not get into an inadvertant stall, or spin. What are your thoughts? You sound just like my old instructor in FW aviation, back in Nov 1959!!! Can't agree more. You are right on the money. You know, I think I spent more time flying slow flight than I did regular flight with him. :-))))) Great guy, I have nothing but respect for him. Paul |
#7
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Slow Flight
"Ol Shy & Bashful" wrote in message ups.com... There is little doubt in my mind that the ability to do slow flight at the very edge of stall speed will do more to prevent accidents than 1000 hours of cruise speed flight. Is there anyone here who is proficient that lands their aircraft more than 10kts above stall speed? ... If you think about it, how many accidents occur in the low speed spectrum? Either from a stall, or from a high sink rate on approach, or poor control use during an emergency or off airport landing, or something similar? I am having a bit of trouble "connecting the dots" between the two above paragraphs. Glider pilots spend a lot of time at the nibbling edge of a stall, especially circling at high bank angles right at the edge of a stall. I don't think any of my students ever left being uncomfortable in slow flight. That said, I don't want any of my students to be "comfortable" in the pattern (except for very short final) whilst anywhere near a stall. In my opinion, the pilot who is comfortable throughout the entire speed range of their aircraft is a properly trained pilot and one who will not get into an inadvertant stall, or spin. What are your thoughts? I think that there is a time and a place for everything, and I there are times when I would want my students to feel distinctly uncomfortable if they were to find themselves slow. Vaughn |
#8
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Slow Flight
Slow flight is a skill. Crosswind landing is a skill. Exposure to long
trips and making difficult decisions under varying weather conditions is experience. The right combination of skill and experience is what makes a pilot "mature" and safe. On Sep 8, 3:49 pm, Bob Fry wrote: "Ol" == Ol Shy & Bashful writes: Ol There is little doubt in my mind that the ability to do slow Ol flight at the very edge of stall speed will do more to prevent Ol accidents than 1000 hours of cruise speed flight. . . . Ol What are your thoughts? Can't agree. The single best thing I did with an airplane to improve my confidence and safety was fly a cross-country to Oshkosh from California with a more experienced friend, each in our own airplane. But others will agree with you. The point is that there are several areas of aviation and flight that are important, and different people will have different needs in those areas. Your students are probably proficient in slow flight, that's good. How well would they do with a long cross country and handling weather issues? There are only so many hours of training to give, and the reality is that a fresh pilot just receiving their PP-ASEL doesn't know much. Perhaps the best thing an instructor can do is see that their students understand their ignorance but also understand how they can use their new license to improve. -- It is a mistake to think you can solve any major problems just with potatoes. Douglas Adams |
#9
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Slow Flight
Shirl wrote:
Ol Shy & Bashful wrote: In my opinion, the pilot who is comfortable throughout the entire speed range of their aircraft is a properly trained pilot and one who will not get into an inadvertant stall, or spin. What are your thoughts? I think what you said makes complete sense. But I always wonder how people define "comfortable"? I was trained the way you described and have repeated the drill more regularly than some. I can do it if asked or necessary, I understand it, and I know how my airplane acts. But I don't *like* flying at that edge of the envelope. Does that mean I'm "uncomfortable"? No. You never really want to feel completely "comfortable" in the airplane. You always want to be performing on that "edge" of awareness when flying that keeps you ahead of the "comfortable" area and more into the "alert" area. In other words, the correct mental attitude while flying is one of being relaxed, but on guard and alert....just a bit on edge as they say......to put it bluntly...SHARP! Just an aside; beware of the fact that you "don't like" flying near the edge of the envelope. The normal reaction should be more associated with an "increased awareness and alertness" when flying in this area. It's ok for the comfort level to go down as you enter this area, but it shouldn't go so far down that you actually dislike flying on the left side. I'd work on that and possibly change from a dislike to feeling just a bit sharper in this area. -- Dudley Henriques |
#10
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Slow Flight
On Sat, 08 Sep 2007 11:03:45 -0700, Ol Shy & Bashful
wrote: There is little doubt in my mind that the ability to do slow flight at the very edge of stall speed will do more to prevent accidents than 1000 hours of cruise speed flight. Is there anyone here who is proficient that lands their aircraft more than 10kts above stall speed? This brings up a question in my mind. When you say slow flight at the edge of a stall I think of Minimum Controllable Air Speed or MCA. Slow flight, to me, is considerably more comfortable and a bit above the stall warning horn. I was taught steep turns with the horn on all the way around. Of course I was taught accelerated stalls out of steep turns as well :-)) I teach all my students to slow fly with the entire range of configurations for the particular aircraft they are flying. Gear up/ down, flaps up/down/in-between. I want them to be comfortable flying at the very edge of the stall speeds and spend a lot of time maneuvering right on the edge of a stall "nibble". It does more for I think that definition of slow flight and MCA depends on the instructor(s) as around here a lot of them teach slow flight, whereas as few still teach MCA. pilot confidence and ability than anything else I can think of. They learn proper control useage and how their particular aircraft responds while in the low speed areas. Playing with different angles of bank while at low speeds and flying with a modicum of accuracy does a lot for proper control use. If you think about it, how many accidents occur in the low speed spectrum? Either from a stall, or from a high sink rate on approach, or poor control use during an emergency or off airport landing, or something similar? In my opinion, the pilot who is comfortable throughout the entire speed range of their aircraft is a properly trained pilot and one who will not get into an inadvertant stall, or spin. What are your thoughts? Amen! A couple of thoughts or observations: I see a lot of pilots with quite a few hours who still fly mechanically. IOW they never go outside the original basics. These are the pilots who never learn to be flexible. They are the ones you don't want to get behind (or have behind yo) in the pattern at Oshkosh where the tower tells you what to do and when. They are the ones who have a problem getting down when the wind changes on final. If the wind changes and they find themselves high on final it never occurs to them a slip would be appropriate to still put them on the desired spot, or to apply just enough power to put them on that spot instead of applying lots of power when they see they are going to come up short. With an engine failure they have to recognize what has happened and think of each step. They rely on the stall warning horn and or light, rather than feel in the controls. When I was in primary training the flight envelop was by feel. Yes, we used the gages to get in the neighborhood, but beyond that is was learning to feel what the plane was doing. OTOH when I was in primary training a lot of things were done differently than they are now. As to inadvertent stalls, not all can be avoided no mater how well the pilot is trained. I've had three inadvertent stalls. One was in level flight at 5500. Two were on final due to wind shear that was well beyond what had been forecast and I was carrying extra speed. Nothing was bent in any of the events, nor did I need to change my shorts (or count seat cushions). And we all have to realize that on rare occasion mechanical parts fail and nature does conspire to put us in a heap of hurt. In those cases we have to use our training to minimize the damage if possible. Roger (K8RI) |
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